How Bout This Cummins Conversion

8.1HD/ALLISON · December 25, 2010

Too bad he ruined the trucks box by putting stacks on that thing, never get good re-sale when you do that... unless you find some really dumb kid..

I'm not picking on you, but I hear the phrase "re-sale" all the time on this stuff. My question is how many people buy trucks, or in this case, go through the trouble of building a truck the way they want it with resale in mind. I for one buy a vehicle hoping not to have to get rid of it for at least 10 years or better. I make it the way I want it, not what will make it better for re-sale. Just wondering what everyone's opinion is. BTW I think that is an awesome looking truck! More power to him for spending the money to make it what he wants.

brainpause · December 25, 2010

I used to DREAM of having a Duramax (or a Freightliner SportChassis). Always wanted to pull a big fifth wheel. Now, I think I'd have to hard research about the right truck for me. Might even need to downsize my dream trailer too.

I'm not comfortable, at this point, with DEF and DPF technology in its infancy.

Larry

kmirts · December 25, 2010

True but thats what air to air and aftercoolers are for. i definitly hate all this emissions bull, especially if u have to use def, i drive a 2011 ram 5500 at work and it has that dumb def. wish it had a jake brake instead of that dumb engine brake, the engine brakes are not that good at slowing down a heavy load. cummins is making a mistake by moving away from c brakes.

clemsonblozz · December 25, 2010

True but thats what air to air and aftercoolers are for. i definitly hate all this emissions bull, especially if u have to use def, i drive a 2011 ram 5500 at work and it has that dumb def. wish it had a jake brake instead of that dumb engine brake, the engine brakes are not that good at slowing down a heavy load. cummins is making a mistake by moving away from c brakes.

up until the common rail engines, there were no mid range engine brakes. they were the exhaust flapper type brakes, which suck ass. now they are actual engine brakes, except for in the rams.

dodge gets what they specify. they want crrappy flapper brake to save a buck, they get it.

cummins owns jacobs, which is alive and well in the heavy duty market. they are making brakes and designing varible valve timing systems

kmirts · December 26, 2010

True but thats what air to air and aftercoolers are for. i definitly hate all this emissions bull, especially if u have to use def, i drive a 2011 ram 5500 at work and it has that dumb def. wish it had a jake brake instead of that dumb engine brake, the engine brakes are not that good at slowing down a heavy load. cummins is making a mistake by moving away from c brakes.

up until the common rail engines, there were no mid range engine brakes. they were the exhaust flapper type brakes, which suck ass. now they are actual engine brakes, except for in the rams.

dodge gets what they specify. they want crrappy flapper brake to save a buck, they get it.

cummins owns jacobs, which is alive and well in the heavy duty market. they are making brakes and designing varible valve timing systems

i guess i dont know what the common rail fuel system has to do with the kinda of braking it has, also not sure what the flapper brake is, and not sure about cummins ownings jacobs, pretty sure that jacobs own themselves and they make the jake brake, cummins make their own c brake wich is a compression brake, they pop the exhaust valve right before the end of the compression stroke without injecting fuel which slows the engine, the new isx doesnt have the c brakes they have a engine exhaust brake that keeps a little valve open the hole time of the compression stroke which makes it really quiet comparred to the jake break,but less effective please enlighten me on the flapper brake and correct me if im wrong of cummins not owning jacobs.

i know this isnt the place for diesel talk but i am really interested.

ybsane · December 26, 2010

You can build up a Duramax for pulling just as good as a cummins these days, these guys have motor pulling 1,700hp not chump change to me.

http://www.danvilleperformance.com/

But than of course over at Big Lick in the warmer months the bickery goes back and forth between Ford-Chevy-Dodge all the time.

http://www.biglick-festival-park.com/bigli...actor_pull.html

Rob

clemsonblozz · December 26, 2010

True but thats what air to air and aftercoolers are for. i definitly hate all this emissions bull, especially if u have to use def, i drive a 2011 ram 5500 at work and it has that dumb def. wish it had a jake brake instead of that dumb engine brake, the engine brakes are not that good at slowing down a heavy load. cummins is making a mistake by moving away from c brakes.

up until the common rail engines, there were no mid range engine brakes. they were the exhaust flapper type brakes, which suck ass. now they are actual engine brakes, except for in the rams.

dodge gets what they specify. they want crrappy flapper brake to save a buck, they get it.

you have exhaust brakes and engine brakes.. engine brakes or "jake brakes" as they are known hold the exhaust valves open to allow the engine to operate as a large air pump, using it to slow down the truck. an exhaust brake is a flap that closes off the exhaust route in the pipe, causing backpressure and slowing the truck that way. the exhaust brake is less effective, and usually uses a pneumatic cylinder to operate the flap, which does not last very long with the high heat.

a C brake was an engine brake branded by cummins that was installed on the 88NT engines, and the first Step timing controlled N-14 engines back in the very late 80's and early 90's. They look and operate like jacobs brakes, but are different and they were orpahned very quickly when cummins got into bed with jacobs.The ISX's brake is called an interbrake.. It uses very little jacobs parts, as the brake is designed to use the engine's cam, and some rocker levers to brake.. Jacob supplies the solenoids, and some slave pistons.. All ISX and QSX(industrial versions) have brake capabilities,, you simply have to install solenoids, a small harness, and enable braking through the ecm.. and also install the proper swithes in the oem side of the machine.

The common rail has nothing to do with engine braking,,, but that is when cummins had a large design change.. we specify engines by fuel systems and emissions equiptment.. like the ISX is the signature, the 02 ISX(first EGR), the 07 ISX(egr and aftertreatment), the 2010 ISX(common rail, aftertreatment, and SCR), ect... THe midrange went from VP44 fuel systems and Caps fuel systems right before becoming common rail,, and during that design change they incorporated engine brakes on that platform(and also changed the 5.9 to a 6.7 later)

Cummins owns alot that people do not know about.. They owned Onan(which is now cummins power generation), fleetguard(which is now cummins filtration), Nelson exhaust(which falls under filtration), and jacobs.

cummins owns jacobs, which is alive and well in the heavy duty market. they are making brakes and designing varible valve timing systems

i guess i dont know what the common rail fuel system has to do with the kinda of braking it has, also not sure what the flapper brake is, and not sure about cummins ownings jacobs, pretty sure that jacobs own themselves and they make the jake brake, cummins make their own c brake wich is a compression brake, they pop the exhaust valve right before the end of the compression stroke without injecting fuel which slows the engine, the new isx doesnt have the c brakes they have a engine exhaust brake that keeps a little valve open the hole time of the compression stroke which makes it really quiet comparred to the jake break,but less effective please enlighten me on the flapper brake and correct me if im wrong of cummins not owning jacobs.

i know this isnt the place for diesel talk but i am really interested.

rogerf · December 26, 2010

Now, international is not using a selective catalyst reduction system like cummins is.. They are recycling 60% of the exhaust back into the engine insted of using the urea SCR system.. Cummins reintroduces a max of 15% exhaust back intoo the engine, and the engineers tell me anything over about 25% is murder to the engine..

So, the cat/navistar experiment will not last very long..

seems like a 60 percent reintroduction of exhaust gases into the engine would raise engine temperatures. incredibly. a more massive than usual oil cooler or engine cooler would just add more cost.

seems like that would just bake the oil.

Larry

Yes, even 25% recirculation is very hot not to mention the unfiltered abrasive soot being pushed back through which is compounded by oxygen-starved combustion from the EGR. Mix that soot with oil contaminated CAC air from the closed crankcase vent & oil puking variable geometry turbo and you get an oily sludge that bakes onto internal passages. Eventually, pieces of this charcoal breaks loose and trashes everything downwind. If any of the diesel-owner wantabees ever owned an EGR diesel they would NEVER buy another.

It is very true that the Navistar-CAT marriage will not last long...as soon as Navistar starts screwing customers on warranty claims like they did with Ford, it will be over.

clemsonblozz · December 26, 2010

Now, international is not using a selective catalyst reduction system like cummins is.. They are recycling 60% of the exhaust back into the engine insted of using the urea SCR system.. Cummins reintroduces a max of 15% exhaust back intoo the engine, and the engineers tell me anything over about 25% is murder to the engine..

So, the cat/navistar experiment will not last very long..

seems like a 60 percent reintroduction of exhaust gases into the engine would raise engine temperatures. incredibly. a more massive than usual oil cooler or engine cooler would just add more cost.

seems like that would just bake the oil.

Larry

Yes, even 25% recirculation is very hot not to mention the unfiltered abrasive soot being pushed back through which is compounded by oxygen-starved combustion from the EGR. Mix that soot with oil contaminated CAC air from the closed crankcase vent & oil puking variable geometry turbo and you get an oily sludge that bakes onto internal passages. Eventually, pieces of this charcoal breaks loose and trashes everything downwind. If any of the diesel-owner wantabees ever owned an EGR diesel they would NEVER buy another.

It is very true that the Navistar-CAT marriage will not last long...as soon as Navistar starts screwing customers on warranty claims like they did with Ford, it will be over.

Temp is not an issue on the EGR system.. The gas is cooled to a level that is the same of charge air before being introduced at the mixer..

The crankcase is filtered on all of the 07 stuff. Also the crankcase air is not introduced into the intake air, what use to exit the engine through the blowby tube(or draft tube for you old timers) is now being filtered and pushed back into the bottom end of the engine.. Oil drain intervals have shortened some, and now we recomend oil changes by miles per gallon..

The VG turbo's aren't puking oil at any rate greater than the older holset units,, but they will have internal siezing problems that the old fixed and wastegated turbo's did not have(due to no moving internals).

EGR stuff is here to stay.. Thank the government for that!

shoebridge · January 28, 2012

The Cummins Diesel will see more miles than any dmax. or powerstroke will. Cummins did it right the first time. They may not be high horse power screamers out of the box but they are the one and only Million mile motor. Not to mention doing everything the competition can with 6. I plan on doing a cummins swap into my 2002 just have to find and adapter to the 4l80e and a stand alone controller. 300-350 rwhp with minor mods and 25mpg? Cant beat it, not to mention the only new diesel pick up not running urea. Means alot when you work your truck in -30c and your buddies diesels are freezing up. every truck has there flaws but when it comes to a diesel in a pick up cummins is the one. Now if only they would put a allison behind that cummins....

shoebridge · January 28, 2012

If you are going to do this swap, Id advise keep it simple and go 12 valve mechanical less electrical gremlins to deal with , easy performance mods and exceptional reliability. check out diesel power mag and there article " swap a 6bt cummins into anything"

brainpause · January 28, 2012

The Cummins Diesel will see more miles than any dmax. or powerstroke will. Cummins did it right the first time. They may not be high horse power screamers out of the box but they are the one and only Million mile motor. Not to mention doing everything the competition can with 6. I plan on doing a cummins swap into my 2002 just have to find and adapter to the 4l80e and a stand alone controller. 300-350 rwhp with minor mods and 25mpg? Cant beat it, not to mention the only new diesel pick up not running urea. Means alot when you work your truck in -30c and your buddies diesels are freezing up. every truck has there flaws but when it comes to a diesel in a pick up cummins is the one. Now if only they would put a allison behind that cummins....

Will the 4L80E handle the Cummins?

Silverado4x4 · January 29, 2012

If you are going to do this swap, Id advise keep it simple and go 12 valve mechanical less electrical gremlins to deal with , easy performance mods and exceptional reliability. check out diesel power mag and there article " swap a 6bt cummins into anything"

I think eather he did or didnt as this post is over a year old.

XRMAN · January 30, 2012

Man that is sweet....lose the Stacks. I would love to have a Chevy with a 24 valve cummins be bad a$$ for towing. I think cummins stopped making a good eng. after the N14 went away. I like the 525HP Red Head Eng.

XRMAN · January 30, 2012

The Cummins Diesel will see more miles than any dmax. or powerstroke will. Cummins did it right the first time. They may not be high horse power screamers out of the box but they are the one and only Million mile motor. Not to mention doing everything the competition can with 6. I plan on doing a cummins swap into my 2002 just have to find and adapter to the 4l80e and a stand alone controller. 300-350 rwhp with minor mods and 25mpg? Cant beat it, not to mention the only new diesel pick up not running urea. Means alot when you work your truck in -30c and your buddies diesels are freezing up. every truck has there flaws but when it comes to a diesel in a pick up cummins is the one. Now if only they would put a allison behind that cummins....

There is a controller for the 4L80 look in Summit Racing Catalog.