Truck shopping. Ram 2500;gas 6.4 vs Chevy 2500

MTU Alum · June 18, 2020

What works on the track moving 4500 lbs does not compare to pulling around 24 to 26k GCW. LD trans don't work on HD applications.

#iworkforGM

wowens79 · June 19, 2020

9 hours ago, Ray Pickle said:

Rams 6 speed issues where that transmission was geared for diesel applications. G.M. 6 speed shift point issues, "Ike Gauntlet", testing by TFL are ecm related. The towing method they are using is NOT what any eperienced driver would ever use to ascend that mountain.

All of the reviews I read/watched from the press event in Washington said it felt sluggish, lackluster or something like that. Then the TFL review was the same. I’ve test driven a few of them, and it seems to always want to be in to high of a gear. These are all the same types of things I read about the Ram 6spd. I test drove the Ram and it shifted much smoother and seem to be in the right gear. I know you can use the selector on the stalk, but seems like they could better program it.

I really want to stick with Chevy, my current one has been awesome, but I plan to keep it 15 years, so I want to make sure I’m happy with it. My current 2002 with the 6.0 and 4 spd pulling my 8000lb travel trailer struggles to maintain 65-70 in 4th @2200 rpm on flat interstates, you you have to drop it to 3rd and spin 3000rpms. It will do that all day, it pulled it from the Keys to ATL for like 14hrs. I’d really like my new one to be at more of a 2500 rpm.

Ray Pickle · June 19, 2020

If you want to keep it 15 yrs. clearly get the one you have the most confidence in making it that distance with the least likelihood of major expense.

Akwagon · June 19, 2020

19 hours ago, wowens79 said:

I’m debating the same thing. I like the Chevy exterior, and the Ram interior. I tow an 8000lb RV. The 8spd in the Ram is getting rave reviews, and I’m reading complaints about shift points on the 6spd Chevy. ThIs is the same types of thing I was reading about the 6spd Ram. If Chevy had gone with an 8 or 10 spd, I’d probably go Chevy.
I’m still thinking about the Chevy, and may try to hold out to see if in 2022, they change the tranny. Currently in driving a 2002 Chevy with 242k miles that I bought new that has been great, so it kinda has me loyal to Chevy. If I hold out to 2022, that would be an even 20 years with the same truck, that would be kinda cool.

Good points. Will the gas Chevy get an 8 spd soon... probably. Same thing goes for the ram diesel 8 spd soon.

I like that the overal Chevy crew is a little larger truck in both cab and bed space. Yes the center dash is hands down better in the ram. Ram will be upgrading the software and processors for 2021 for their nav units which was badly needed (think iPhone 5 to iPhone X)
sounds like Chevy wont be doing any needed upgrades interior/tranny until at least the 2022 model.
whivh is to bad as I need a hd truck next spring.

To bad I can’t live with each truck for a few days and tow 9 k lbs some during.

wowens79 · June 19, 2020

3 hours ago, Akwagon said:

Good points. Will the gas Chevy get an 8 spd soon... probably. Same thing goes for the ram diesel 8 spd soon.

I like that the overal Chevy crew is a little larger truck in both cab and bed space. Yes the center dash is hands down better in the ram. Ram will be upgrading the software and processors for 2021 for their nav units which was badly needed (think iPhone 5 to iPhone X)
sounds like Chevy wont be doing any needed upgrades interior/tranny until at least the 2022 model.
whivh is to bad as I need a hd truck next spring.

To bad I can’t live with each truck for a few days and tow 9 k lbs some during.

After seeing the Hertz trucks for sale, I looked at Enterprises website, and you can actually rent a Ram 2500 from them, and f-250. Does not look like they have the Chevy, but maybe. It was only about $200 for Fri-Mon with taxes. I’m thinking of renting one for a weekend camping trip up in the mountains.

Ray Pickle · June 19, 2020

All I can say based on personal experience is that this truck is not sluggish. Maybe compared to a diesel although I would bet in a drag race unladen it would be a pretty close contest. Under light throttle unladen it does upshift early in an effort to maximize fuel economy. It would no doubt benefit from a 4.10 option to improve towing capability but it is superior to my last 16' 2500ccsb in towing performance and fuel economy. It undoubtedly will get the 10 speed, probably in 2022 and it will get the interior of the redesigned Suburban/Tahoe also probably in 2022. If not for covid related production delays both upgrades wouldve probably been available in 2021.

newdude · June 19, 2020

20 hours ago, MTU Alum said:

What works on the track moving 4500 lbs does not compare to pulling around 24 to 26k GCW. LD trans don't work on HD applications.

#iworkforGM

Nope. Not buying that one bit.

The 8L90 is found behind the Z06 as well as NHT optioned 5.3 powered T1 Silverado/Sierras. That's a 3600lbs 200mph sports car, and a truck with a GCWR of 16,800lbs. To add insult to injury, the 8L90 PER GM can support up to 20,500lbs GCWR. https://gmauthority.com/blog/gm/gm-transmissions/m5u/ I would have linked this info direct from GM but seems to hide it these days. Used to be really easy to find on the GM powertrain site.

The 10L80 is found in the Camaro SS as of 2019 and also can support NHT optioned 6.2 Silverado/Sierra that GCWR at 17,800lbs.

You can't say, with a straight face, that the 10L90 can't support a 24,000lbs GCWR in a 2500HD/3500HD that the 6L90/6.6 gas does in the 2020 T1 HDs. What litteraly would have to be changed, the torque converter? That sure as hell would be a quick and worthy change.

And you can take that to the engineers if you "#iworkforGM"

MTU Alum · June 19, 2020

Customers that own this package have been very happy. The majority the people complaining have never driven it. There are reasons why the majority of oems in HD segment have purpose built engine and transmissions. The duty cycles and cooling is significantly different. People that buy gas HD trucks want affordable and reliable. The L8T 6L90 provides that need.

#iworkforGM

Ray Pickle · June 20, 2020

Not sure the logic of what works for a 3700 lb car works for a truck that weighs just short of twice as much plus may tow another 7 tons or so regardless of power differences. That being said I gotta think it is a drivetrain reliability concern , as they have just introduced the new engine and also a marketing strategy. The 10 speed will be along soon.

nick112288 · June 20, 2020

This is just my opinion but I do think they'll put the HD 10 speed behind the 6.6 gas.

Someone on here mentioned they didn't think they would because it's a much heavier duty trans than the 6 speed and it might rob the gas of too much power.

I don't agree with that. Ford had no problem putting it behind the 7.3 and while slightly more powerful it's not like it's light years ahead of the 6.6.

Now what I do think will need to happen is they offer 4.10s for the gas truck again. That's where Ford has them beat. Not only do they offer lower rear axle ratios, the trans ratios in the bottom gears are also lower than GM.

Ray Pickle · June 20, 2020

I agree fully that 10 speed is coming. It will clearly "work" just fine with the gas 6.6. I believe it didn't come out 1st year to minimize potential issues with all the other changes that occured with new 2020.

KCJackson1 · June 21, 2020

7 hours ago, Ray Pickle said:

I agree fully that 10 speed is coming. It will clearly "work" just fine with the gas 6.6. I believe it didn't come out 1st year to minimize potential issues with all the other changes that occured with new 2020.

The only reason I would disagree with that is the take-rate of the diesel is significantly higher - true in all the brands of HD trucks, for that matter. GM is installing way more 10L1000s, so if it had teething problems, they would begin to show by now.

Dunn · June 21, 2020

9 hours ago, Ray Pickle said:

I agree fully that 10 speed is coming. It will clearly "work" just fine with the gas 6.6. I believe it didn't come out 1st year to minimize potential issues with all the other changes that occured with new 2020.

I would totally agree.....maybe weren't ready and didn't want to take a chance with all new truck (which is doing very well I would imagine)

when I first bought mine I thought it felt a lil underpowered for 6.6L (am no expert)…..but now after almost 3k miles its broken in and motor has woke up....in last 2 weeks it feels like different motor, revs and gets into powerband much faster and it has some balls to move as big a truck as it is.....totally happy with motor and trans feels great, couple more gears wouldn't hurt but its a good combo and hopefully bulletproof.....I Love my truck!....not so much when I first got it but its awesome, even the suspension is better now @ 3k than it was brand new....

Ray Pickle · June 21, 2020

Kcjackson 1 I dont get your point. I agree the 10 speed is coming. The truck was all new for 2020 and I believe they wanted to be able to offer something additionally new in the coming model years i.e. the 10 speed. Probably more gear options as well. In the first year with everything else new they chose to stick with the tried and true 6 speed?

KCJackson1 · June 21, 2020

8 hours ago, Ray Pickle said:

Kcjackson 1 I dont get your point. I agree the 10 speed is coming. The truck was all new for 2020 and I believe they wanted to be able to offer something additionally new in the coming model years i.e. the 10 speed. Probably more gear options as well. In the first year with everything else new they chose to stick with the tried and true 6 speed?

My point is, for so little sales of the 6.6L gas, there was no advantage of using the 6-speed - especially when Ford dropped both a new gas engine and accompanying transmission against it in their 2020 refresh. If GM had the faith to put the new 10L1000 in an otherwise all-new truck with the far better selling diesel, why bother producing such a small number of 6-speeds and skimp on those who wanted a gasoline engine?