Chuck FB

I read this thread with interest as I've thought about it as well in the idea of having a slide in camper to use to travel around a bit and have the very same truck platform as you do. Looking at what my brother has done over the years as he has used the truck camper theme quite a lot, the trucks being used under the campers he had were one ton long box crew cab duallys and not even an option to have less of a truck for the camper he has used for the last number of years and its not like it has slide outs ( adding even more weight ) but its got the basement for the tanks of a fair size water tanks and the true queen sized bed up front, nice bathroom with a shower to the side of it. I look at a camper like that and it has all these nice creature comforts although due to its year built it lacks much of a solar system. Its designated as a 10'8" camper That measurement listed of my brothers and other campers I mention here, that would be from the from the front of the box where the front of the camper base is to the back of the camper, the front bed overhang is not included in that measuring scheme. So I look at camper specs on manufacture websites of something that would seem nice but scaled down to fit into a 6'10" box although with the overhang as well out the rear of the box and while lots of claims are made by manufacturers of yes such and such model is for a 2500 or 3500 standard box single rear wheel truck, the weights of some of these newer campers are way higher than they used to be years back. Also a lot of manufacturers are very good at manipulating the weight figure and even the weight figure sticker right on some campers can be a bold lie just for the structure of the camper if it has options beyond a "base" model spec. Camper weight specs do not include the weight of batteries or propane and definitely not the weight of water. Then if an air conditioner is an option that is not included, typically if one has a built in generator that seldom is added to a weight. I looked up the specs for Jakes camper model which is meant for an 8 foot bed and is called a 8'6" camper for reference and it lists the base dry weight at 2114 lb but there is a very long list of options for that camper and I can just see from the photo that Jakes has various options added on, but an example of base weight vs realistic weight with the desirable features. I wish I would have kept track of the information that a youtuber had talked about in having bought a Northern Lite 8-11 and I he optioned it right out with the generator and everything. The NL camper website lists the weight of that camper in its deluxe version at 3050 pounds which he had so that would have included quite a few options but not the generator for sure or batteries. He had a one ton short box truck that he bought the camper specifically for and of course the sales guy says oh yeah your truck can carry this no problem. He buys it and is a dealer states away from where he lived and gets it mounted in and then he found out as he loads it up with water and gear, how badly it handled at least in his mind as per camper sway and I think he said with all his gear in it and fresh water tank full the truck was 1000 lb overloaded. He ended up selling his truck and bought a dually and then slid that short camper which is not meant for a long bed into it and made a wooden stop in the box so the camper would come up against that. He claimed it was working out ok and was not taking weight off the front axle of the truck but realistically the camper should probably have been sold for a wonderful loss and bought the correct box length camper. That took the wind out of my sails in a sense as that was one of the campers I was thinking in terms of although I have an issue with many campers and that is I am 6'4" and a lot of these mid sized campers don't have a high enough ceiling height and that was the issue with this NL 8-11 as well. I don't at all mean to make my comments come off as a downer, there certainly are campers out there that are lighter but certainly some of them would potentially have less features and am speaking in terms of hard sided walk in at a moments notice type campers like Jakes. Like Jon pictured with his pop up camper but again his is a full 8 foot bed truck, there are pop up campers made to fit these shorter trucks without a doubt but that style of camper would be a different type of RV experience but with that its a lighter unit and pushes far less air down the road and not the top heavy unit of a tall camper with a basement for its water work and far easier could be used on I will call it light off roading trail situations that the big campers are not suited for ( unless its certain youtubers out there doing stupid things for views as I shake my head ). It all depends on your wants/needs and expectations as one person enjoys the simpler more frill free way of going RVing or tent camping for that matter which allows more freedom to go certain places and I have certainly done since I've never had an RV while the next person may want a literal house on wheels and there is everything in between. But going back to the beginning, the "actual" weight of the camper both out of the factory in what it truly is vs what the manufacture claims it is as well as once its all loaded up with the kitchen sink ready to hit the road is one of the big factors to watch out for in choosing a camper for any truck and certainly a single rear wheel truck even though it is a one ton and "seems like" it should have all kinds of capacity.

With all the issues I have seen with some vehicles drawing down a battery if left sit for even a few weeks, never mind a few months as its stone dead by then, I already planned or should say was resigned to the fact that this 2025 is going to have an issue if left sitting for a while. Soon after I bought it I mounted up a tender under the hood that has the option to hard mount it into the system with eyelets on the 12 volt side of the charger, hooked the positive up to a spot in the fuseable box on top of the battery and the negative to a bracket bolt on the fender. I do have to pop the hood but have the cord protected with split loom to avoid vehicle use vibration damage to the cord and its end tucked away just behind the passenger headlight area when not being used. That is the good part about these trucks ironically that they don't have an underhood light that comes on to drain a battery, so if I figure I won't be using the truck for some days I will plug it in and its doing its thing and should help out some with cold weather starting since the battery should be topped up ready do do all it can. I haven't left it sit for more than a week without using the tender but I experimented with checking the voltage on both batteries hours after it was parked and as the days went by the main battery was slowly loosing some voltage where as the secondary battery on the gas is isolated when the truck is not turned on electrically and it says up pretty much with no issue at the same time the main battery is trending down. The tender is only charging the main battery, it can't feed into the aux battery since the solenoid is not powered up that connects the two together.

It is odd or at least compared to my one 6.6 vehicle I have been around much as an example. Do try the hand test at the tail pipe though, without burning your hand in the process of course

Like Jon explained with his, I will sometimes notice what seems like the odd misfire when its started cold although by cold I mean above the freezing point ( I haven't used it enough yet in actual cold Canadian weather to know its reactions ). Initially when it starts its revs up quite a bit but its after it settles down that I have noticed it but only sometimes if I am standing by the front of the truck. When its warmed up or shut off for a while at stops in town I haven't noticed anything. So your issue, can you tell its doing this as your sitting in the truck and not only hear it but feel the truck have a reverberation travel through objects in the cab. Also what does it do when its warmed up and your in drive with your foot on the brake as that causes a small load on the engine. If you have not taken it to a dealer and not sure if it would have diagnostic warranty coverage now but to have it checked to see if its showing misfires or of course if you have your own fancy diagnostic tools ( I am guessing you don't own ) or have an independent shop you know well to do the check. Also and this may sound odd but when its doing this go to your tailpipe and not only listen but hold the palm of your hand in the exhausts air flow and feel for the disrupted puff feel, if you've been around crappy running carbed engines you will know what I mean !.

Have you talked to the dealer or had them listen to it yet or would they prefer it comes in on a tow truck after it grenades. My guess is that may be preferable or unless they would say now, will install a new transmission. You've certainly had the trans oil changed, one has to wonder if its the fault of the tech or its just crappy parts, or when the other parts were failing it damaged other internals of the transmission. Years ago when I bought a new chev half ton, 6000 miles into ownership the trans was slipping its 2/4 band and it also slipped the 3/4 clutch pack and what they found was a cut oring from the factory assembly on the 2/4 piston servo that applies the band. They went through the trans and replaced what needed it beyond a trans clutch kit and it actually did last for quite a while, I've lost count with how many transmissions have gone into that thing as the 4L60E had a horrible track record and I rarely towed anything. The price of a reman trans was NOTHING compared to what these transmissions cost now.

I wonder then if its the shocks that is mostly or owes all the credit for how the suspension is reacting and that would apply to both the front and rear end.

Have you gone over any speed bumps yet and that really depends on their profile and speed as to how a turned up limited droop travel suspension reacts but with an older truck I have that I have the bars turned up, that shows up quite evidently as it doesn't handle some of the speed bumps well. The front suspension compresses initially but that forces the front of the truck up into the air and then as the tire goes over the bump the suspension uses up its limited droop travel and I feel a "hit" as that happens, then the front of the truck drops back down with more speed than it would otherwise because the tire would literally be off the ground I suspect for a split second and that causes a harder landing since the suspension/tire wasn't able to remain planted on the ground. Driving on relatively smooth surfaces one would never know it would have that type of reaction although in its case I certainly would say it stiffened up the ride a bit in the front and it does not like going over frost heaves at highway speed. That's a half ton truck I am speaking of, my new one ton goes over those same speed bumps with less harshness, I think that says something right there ! LOL. Don't get me wrong as I am not claiming anything about your aftermarket leveling kit, just comparing two trucks of mine and that the half ton did ride differently before I jacked around with the suspension which in my case had a purpose which was off road clearance ( I have spacer blocks under the rear leaf's )

You got me wondering about your truck and being a custom in theory its lighter than a more optioned truck off the assembly line. Of course the cover adds weight but what tire size does your truck have and are they a finer tread pattern than some of the more clunky all terrains out there. Also do yo run high pressures or have them lowered, all of that makes a difference to rolling resistance. What fuel type are you using or if the pump tells you as per ethanol content and also the octane your running. Is that a crew cab short box 4x4 or another configuration ?. Of course there are other factors, the highway lay of the land, air temp, altitude and wind ( tail wind ) and so on. I still have not been on any longer drive to get a more proper idea of what mine is capable of doing and we have hills and river valleys etc so its never the same as places where its flat.

That sounds like an excellent trip and time of year I would think as well. It literally is death to be in death valley during the summer in July and the only time when I went through there and managed to survive it and was 118 that day with a stiff wind which I was told was right on average temp for that time of the year and they also said at the park office, good thing you were not here last week when it hit 129 !. I've heard if the desert has had good rains which some parts will get more commonly but death valley I gather is a special event when it does. That summer after I went through death valley I drove up highway 395 from the west side of DV park up to Lee Vining and then west on highway 120 over Tioga Pass into Yosemite NP, that is quite the fantastic National Park with the landscapes and the huge Sequoia trees ( I did manage to hike to the top of Half Dome somehow ). Did part of the number 1 coastal highway and just wow, also the coastal redwoods in the northern part of CA. The natural beauty in some of those area's of the states is unreal. A friend of mine from the states has talked about really liking to go to the Saguaro National Park just west of Tucson to camp during the winter into the new year time frame and also has taken in the Arizona Sanora Desert Museum which is both a botanical garden and a zoo with various desert animals, I haven't seen any of that myself but if its something you might be interested in you can look into it, that is if you thought you might be going into that area. And there is Sedona and the Grand Canyon in the Flagstaff area and which I went through the one and only time I was in AZ for a bit years ago during the winter. Yes, you will get some good use out of your truck and camper this winter exploring down there !.

I think I know what you've had on the brain the last while, counting down the days on the calendar

I was thinking that had it been an aluminum multi flex tailgate, that would have knocked the whole house off the foundation to have dented it in that much Obviously I am joking and yes its pretty sad what pickups can't take that they used to easily withstand years ago. I don't know what a replacement one piece steel tailgate would cost and more than likely it would have to be painted rather than bought factory finished, but a multi flex tailgate would so I hear be many thousands to replace the whole thing and it comes only as pieces that have to be assembled and of course all would have to be painted. How stupid things have become price wise.

I don't think you caught what I was trying to explain as I was not referring to the added truck height that the ZR2 has over a stock truck as that certainly is evident and the knuckle is creating a portion or perhaps all of that additional height. What I am referring to and for this measurement and it would not matter if the fenders were uneven on the truck as its being used as a reference point only to measure off of, is the difference in distance between the hub center and fender with the full weight of the truck allowed to settle on the suspension / vs the remeasured distance from hub center to fender with the front of the truck lifted off the ground so the tires are dangling in the air. That difference is the "droop travel" of the suspension and with a torsion front suspension that is going to vary with how the keys were set. So for example with a stock LTZ for example it may be around 3 1/4 inches of droop travel give or take depending on how the factory set the keys. With a ZR2/AT4X it was stated in a video I watched that he found there was only 2 1/4 inches of droop travel on his AT4X and again I expect that could vary slightly from truck to truck as well due to the hands that were on it at the factory. That owner of his AT4X was finding that his truck was not riding as well as he felt it could due to the reduced droop travel over a basic stock truck and decided to spend the big money and put a lift on it so he would not lose total height while at the same time backing off the torsion keys to create the 3+ inches of droop travel he was striving for. All I was inquiring about was what have others found with their ZR2/AT4X as per how much droop travel there was from the original factory setting and if similar or not to that finding of that individual. And the ZR2 could have its torsion keys adjusted differently to create more or less droop travel much like a standard non off road truck.

I had considered a Weather Tec or Husky or for that matter a similar looking plastic type formed mudflap that the Chevy dealer was selling through their aftermarket parts here in Canada but in the end I decided to to for more coverage and got what is referred to as kickback mudflaps and these ones are made in Alberta ( this company is called Bulletproof ) but there are various brands out there of off shore or USA made ones. They are more expensive and they are a combo stainless steel upper ( black powder coated available ) and heavy lower rubber flap and they hang down further which was what I was after for even better winter road and rock protection for the truck and if pulling a trailer. I just figured out that the dealer was in fact selling the Weather Tec flaps but they didn't name them as such but the part number is the same so they were just flogging them through their dealer aftermarket accessory system. If a person is not looking to get that much coverage, certainly the Whether Tec has a sleek formed look and not saying the Husky don't but they are a little different. However I believe one has to have the standard so called mudguards from the factory and not the optional longer hanging down plastic extended units as those I don't believe are compatible with some of these molded flaps, nor would those factory optional flaps have worked with these kick back flaps as they required the standard factory units to be compatible.

I believe it was on this forum where some said they had the Rancho shocks leaking for example quite early on mileage wise but also have noted some youtube videos of trucks that were not being controlled well in using a speed bump at relatively low speed and in one case the person had created a before and after video with low speed video to show the amount of up/down after effect after going over the speed bump with front and rear axle action, then replacing the shocks and repeating the process again on the same speed bump. Pretty sure it was the Rancho shocks that had been stock and with surprisingly few miles on the truck. As per this members truck, if the measurements he gave before are an indication I have a feeling a fairly heavy trailer may have been pulled and we have some crappy roads up here in Canada, so hard to say where that truck had been driving and with how much load and stressing the suspension. For all I know that truck could have gone to Alaska or further up into the Yukon and there are some BAD frost heaved roads up there. Anywhere I have happened to be in the states and not claiming there would be no bad roads in the lower 48 but up here in northern Alberta we can have some horrible frost heave highways and as I mentioned in the Yukon and Alaska its perma frost issues that cause the road to crater or heave like moguls on a ski hill, there is a reason why so many travel trailers break leaf springs up there or bend their frame on one trip. I was up there once and watching how some people drove, hardly a brain cell in their head behind the wheel of some RV's LOL. But that is how one can take a vehicle and pound the living piss out of it by driving too fast carrying weight ( going 60+ when they should be going 15 mph over some of that mess ).

What you describe in how floaty the truck is and the lean issue in going around corners, that typically is a classic sign of completely bagged out shocks. That with the rather dismal track record in how these factory Ranch shocks seem to last, I suspect any decent set of shocks put on the truck and I don't mean kings or even Fox for that matter but as I mentioned the Bilstein options, that should get the truck back to behaving properly without spending a huge wad of cash. I also was thinking and your truck and because of buying it used it may not cover it but in theory the 36000 mile ( 60000 km ) bumper to bumper warranty for the original owner was supposed to cover shock issues, maybe. There is one other thing that you definitely should check out on your truck and that is all the hardware and rubber bushings associated with the front sway bar. From the rubber half blocks that clamp the sway bar to the trucks frame, to both ends of both end link rods to make sure a bushing hasn't blown out or that the bolt hardware isn't all loose. You never know when it comes to used vehicles, people have gotten the brain wave to remove one end link rendering the sway bar useless or they removed the whole thing from the vehicle. Again mine being a gas may seem slightly different but it does have the lower rate torsion bars to match up with the lower engine weight but from my perspective in going around corners and I mean like a sharp turn from a light in town so its a quick sharp turn, it feels like its more on rails than anything and does not have a snap back effect from coming back from a lean because there was little lean of any to begin with.

I had a look at mine for the fun of it but already expected to see what I did and that is a red colored droplet hanging there at the lowest point of the curvature of the idler arm as well as on the tie rod center assembly that the idler arm slips into, and going over to the pitman arm basically the same thing with a droplet formed on the underside of the arm there as well. When I sprayed fluid film under my truck I purposely tried to get some on the center tie rod link and some is on the idler and pitman arms as well so that has mingled with what I presume is the oil from the grease having dropped out of the grease carrier. I also use red Mobil grease and it seems to have a really bad habit of the oil oozing out of the grease, I never used to have that happen with the older Esso Unirex ( blue dye ) grease or the Mobil grease I used that had a bit of moly content which made the grease look grey/black. There may be one drip onto the cement but nothing of consequence. The trans lines or I assume that is them where they swag into the flex line right above the idler arm, they look completely clean. It certainly can make a guy wonder though simply because of the color of the dye in the grease and hard to distinguish between it and trans fluid. When you notice speckles of oil mist on your rear bumper and tailgate and then look under the truck at the front of the rear diff axle housing and see it dotted up if not covered with a wet substance, that's when you know a trans or engine oil cooler line is leaking rather excessively !.

What you picture there, wouldn't that just be the assembly itself able to hang down further due to the different knuckle that the ZR2 has which equates to the raise in the trucks height when all said and done, either the parts added as you did or if one bought a ZR2 off the lot ?. Put another way, taking a stock ZR2 from the show room floor and how the factory adjusted the torsion bars, measuring the fender to hub center and then lifting it with a jack or shop lift to allow the tires to hang in mid air, then remeasure the fender to hub distance. The only item I came across lately and wasn't even looking for such information but was watching a youtuber that had just recently bought a AT4X and his claim was that the droop travel from factory on his truck was reduced over a non X truck, I believe he talked about it being around 2 inches of droop they measured. I was surprised at that as I assumed it would have had the same droop travel. But then again there is only so much that can be done with the same length A arms and why race trucks ( and often were two wheel drive ) have wide A arms to increase that stroke distance. The only way one would gain more over all travel is to do like some have done and hack the UCA droop travel stop off and rely on the shocks stroke to extend to its limit I assume with a shock that had a long enough travel but also did not bottom out on the up stroke. In fact see where your truck is at now by doing that droop test measurement, full weight on the front and driven to the level flat spot you would do the measuring, then lift up the front and remeasure. It would depend on how you set up your torsion key adjustment as to what droop your truck has as you could very well have more than a factory set up truck, hard to say until one measured.

I didn't think that was your plan as per cranking the heck out of the torsion bar keys to do what they demonstrated there but there are guys that do that and don't grasp why its just a bad idea in a few ways and then learn after their steering goes to crap and find out they have a lot of worn out parts with relatively few miles on them. And like I mentioned before I have a feeling from your front measurement that you are riding on the jounce bumpers a little more than what is ideal and all due to suspension taking a settle, the torsion bars that is. I'd be curious to know how many threads are visible on the factory torsion key adjuster bolts, one side will more than likely show a bit more thread than the other but I am guessing there is a certain amount of adjustment available within the stock keys/adjusters. Of course I can almost feel the itch you have to spend some ( I mean a lot ) Canadian monopoly money on US priced parts LOL. I will say that sounds like an excellent tire size for the reason that its just slightly taller than the 20" wheel stock tire but a bit wider tire and a lot taller side wall because of being on an 18" rim. That gives you a higher carrying capacity tire assuming it is the E rated LT tire and I believe it is since that is the only type/size listed for Falken under the AT4W tire if that is the model you have. An opportunity to run lower pressures over the door sticker pressures and in your case not loading the truck down heavy on the rear, quite a lot lower than that 80 pounds by a wide margin and even some on the front. The lower the tire pressures the more the tires become a part of the better ride and less work the shocks have to do in controlling an over inflated basket ball, if that makes sense. I have talked about this before on this forum and it takes weighing the individual axles with the weight that is planned to be run and then using a tire inflation guide for the size of tire being run to find the minimum safe tire pressure to run at highway speeds for the weight being carried. Another words doing it the safe way without guessing and running too low a tire pressure and risking a blow out. There is a thread going in the next main heading down under the 20 to 24 HD trucks category "mods" where a member is going to be installing a leveling kit on an HD shortly and will have photos up and so forth, that could be informative for you to look over once that is posted after the install.

Your truck would have the standard torsion bars for the crew cab short box, actually it would only be the dually or if a snow plow prep package was on it that it would have had the maximum 6000 rated torsion bars. I've had some experience but with a half ton with 9000 rancho's, they worked ok but they have their own issues as per the adjuster seizing up. From what I hear and be it on this forum or others, the stock ranchos that come on the Z71 are just an economy shock that seems to wear out awfully quick, its all hyped up with vehicle manufacturers claiming its something great but its smoke and mirrors. I have few km's on my truck so its not given my factory rancho's the chance to fall apart yet but new out of the box they seem fine as per controlling the weight of a factory sized tire/wheel combo on a nearly empty truck but I realize at some point I will have to be replacing them with something and I don't plan on modifying my suspension beyond my slight turning up/evening up the torsion bar height I already have done. I may try out a set of Bilstein 4600's as the 5100's are said to be by some and also by Bilstein themselves to be somewhat more firm and its the 5100's that can be had in longer lengths for lifted vehicles as the 4600 is for stock height only. In theory the stock length shock on the front with the stock UCA and the UCA stop still in place should not hinder the suspension travel. So the company or shop you have been talking to, would they or if you do the work yourself be planning on cutting the UCA droop stop pad that is welded to the frame off ?. I am not sure if aftermarket UCA's allow for any more droop travel "if" the stop is still in place, they would however help with that issue of the factory UCA ball joint angle being in a bind if the torsion bars are cranked up too much. Like I said, I don't have the experience at all with these new trucks, only an older truck but with the same theme in mind and finding out the downfall of limiting the droop travel as its more important then some give that part of the suspension travel credit for. I call these leveling kits the poor mans lift kit because they do cost a lot less than a full out lift that lowers all the pivot points and puts new steering knuckles on that corrects the operating angles of the tie rods and corrects the drive axles running angles. The problem with the poor mans kit is the suspension and drive axle parts that wear over time literally and ironically put one into the poor house with all the future parts that wear out and need replacing far more often. I haven't priced out King shocks for this application but whatever prices I have seen on that brand of shocks are typically insane and I have a hard time in my head putting on a low grade lift as it were with very expensive shocks in the hopes of coming out with a great end result. Again, those are just my thoughts and view point, take that for what its worth as others on here that have been dabbling in lifts and shocks may have come up with a decent middle ground with a combination of parts and within a certain height parameter over stock. Here's a video I believe i had linked in another thread on this forum, it shows the extreme of a torsion bar lift/level and yes some guys do that and it works great in the mall parking lot, it would be awful to drive in every day life. Vs an actual lift that really drops the diff down and all pivot points and replaces the knuckles etc and you can see the extreme difference in the angles from one lift style approach to the other with the same physical lift height. Also keep in mind that the larger shocks job is to help control larger/heavier tires over the stock size tires.

Ok so it should be very much like mine and if its a crew cab standard box then its exactly like mine for all intended purposes dimension wise. Where it would be different is the rating of your front torsion bars being the diesel so they are more than likely 5600 pound rated ( you can look at your front axle weight rating on the door post sticker ) but again that is just to carry the extra weight of the diesel and in the end is adjusted the same as the gas version height wise. Like I mentioned about doing anything radical with the front, there are these youtube channels out there pushing "leveling kits" like crazy because they sell them so of course they will spew bs about how great it is but they end up making the ride stiffer and they crank them too far and they don't have much suspension droop left. And all the high wear that then takes place with the tie rods and center link, the pitman arm ball joint, the drag link ball joint all take a real beating with angles they were never designed to run at and last. Outfits that sell the leveling kits don't want to hear talk like that. Perhaps if you explain what type of use you plan on for your truck on here, that might help as a few on this site have recently put a different brand of rear leaf spring pack on that at least in theory was designed for a better ride but with less weigh carry capacity, again all depends on what your future use is for your truck.

Your right, I never commented on that aspect although suspected an assumption that he assumed his front and rear fenders would be at the same height if the truck was level and therefore expecting the rear measurement to be much higher than it is. Never the less just going off of what he said measurement wise, it would at least seem that his rear springs have settled a lot due to a prior load it probably carried. If he did as he was thinking in raising the front, that really would make his truck look front end high and at that point may actually be front end high. I might be thinking wrong in terms of what is "level" on one of these trucks but I've assumed it would be the main portion of the frame under the cab that is straight, and if its parallel to the ground front to rear that would be level ?. The fender height would be way out of whack at that point per a visual standpoint and make the rear look much lower than it actually is.

Although my truck isn't exactly like yours since I have the gas engine and therefore the 11.5 rear axle, otherwise if yours is a crew cab with the standard 6'10" box length it would be very similar otherwise as yours being a Chev also will have the same fender profile as the GM probably measures slightly different. I do have the Z71 package but being a High Country that only adds on the rancho shocks and the so called skid plates as mine already came with the 20" wheels where your trim probably added the wheels with its Z71. Pretty much semantics with that Z71 as it does nothing for the actual fender to hub distance. Like some trucks seem to be from the factory, mine was not even from side to side on the front for the torsion key adjustment ( just sloppy workmanship setting it up ) as the low side was 24 1/4 and the high side was 24 3/4 from brand new. I would say that yours probably has settled in and may have been 24 1/2 or slightly higher give or take when new. What I did with mine and this was based off of information from companies that make lifts as well as work with these trucks a lot and the recommendation was not to go higher than 25 inches on the front in order to retain close to that 3 inches of droop travel and also to retain the good cv and tie rod angles. Just my two cents, I would recommend you save your money and not bother changing anything parts wise on the front end for UCA and just replace or maybe you already have replaced the shocks with a factory length/non lift shock of whatever brand you go with. I would be surprised if your keys would not have enough adjustment to bring you up to that 25" or close to that height. Droop travel is important, I know what its like from a prior truck in cranking them up and not having the best droop travel and as well the ride gets stiffer as one cranks it up too much due to the angles that develop. I did get my truck realigned after I increased the height but it really had not thrown anything out much at all but it would have had I continue to lift it up more. The rear, that is a good question as to what happened there and it would almost seem like the springs did sag out some but I doubt as much as you are assuming they have. Now again with my truck I had a bak flip and thick rubber mat and rear flaps which are somewhat substantial installed before I was able to do the measuring and my truck also has the fifth wheel prep and the spray in liner which all adds to the weight. I was sitting at around 25 1/8 from fender to center of hub on the rear with those mentioned items on the truck. So your truck is measuring about 1 1/2 inches or so lower in the rear as a comparison with the figures I have to work with on mine. I can only speculate that they were either hauling something heavy in the back of that truck or they had a heavy ball hitch trailer or a heavy fifth wheel trailer and the springs never bounced back from that weight. Your probably right that the ideal thing to do would be to install new main packs and add the existing top overload springs to the pack. Just to be sure as per your main pack ( not the two thin upper overloads that hit the frame pads ) that you have what they refer to as a 4 + 1 spring pack. Another words the thick tapered bottom leaf with four leafs of varying length of the same thickness that sit on top of that bottom overload spring. There would be a way of raising your rear end some if you felt the rear springs were still serviceable and didn't want the hassle of swapping them and that is to round up the special spacer block that has the hole on the topside and the stud shape on the bottom that engages the axle spring pad perch that is welded to the axle housing, then using longer Ubolts to fasten your leaf packs down. Perhaps a spring shop that is familiar with the GM trucks might be able to shed some light on if this is a common thing for the springs to take a sag and if a lift block would be ok or if you should start out fresh. I guess it depends on what your doing to do with the truck use wise. Mind you I have to ask since you never said one way or the other, this is a single rear wheel truck and not a dually ?. Oddly enough the dually is a 3 + 1 main pack and then 3 upper overload springs.

Interesting, so my chev stock before I did some re adjusting of the torsion bar keys "averaged" between the two sides to be 24.5 inches from hub center to fender and averaged 40.5 from the ground to fender on the front with the stock 20" wheel/tire combo. Droop, that I never recorded but did that experiment after I had reset both sides to 25" and from memory I am going to say I had around 2 7/8 droop or just under that as one side was slightly different then the other by an 1/8, so that would be somewhere around 27 7/8 or just under in total droop going off of memory. My total droop distance would of course not changed with my adjustment of the torsion bars but my actual droop would have by around a 1/2 inch more before I touched the torsion keys so again a little speculation that my average factory keys setting droop would have been around 3 1/4 or a bit more. What I don't believe I had done though was actually look to see if the UCA were resting on the frame perches, I "assumed" they would be. My rear, again the average between the two sides was 25 1/8 to the hub and 41 5/16 or so to the ground and I already had a bak flip cover, mud flaps and the Chev accessory rubber mat in the back by then which would make a slight difference to the rear weight and keep in mind I have the factory spray in liner and the fifth wheel prep as those items would add up as well. Oh and I had reduced the front tires down to 40 pounds and the rear to 35 before this measuring was done so the fender to ground height would have dropped a bit accordingly from fresh out of the factory measurements. So definitely its not bs about the ZR2/AT4X having less droop than a stock truck and "maybe" as much as an inch less it would appear like. That is not exactly what I would have expected GM to do, I would take a wild guess it was not what a suspension engineer was hoping for as there are always compromises made when it comes to big business and take the Allison transmission name, marketing vs substance.

From what I have noted in looking at videos of the Husky liners for the GM HD trucks, if they only make the one style that would be flat across the lower inner part of the well insert from front to back of the liner assembly, that isn't going to work in the 3500 or the max tow diesel 2500. It is indeed those overload spring pads that are fastened to the outside of the frame that are in the way and if one looks at a 2500 that has the factory wheel well liner, I believe they are the same as the 3500 and they have a fair section of a flat surface molded into them to use the three clip/screw holes on the inner lower part of the steel wheel well and then the factory liners are molded to jut towards the tire if you will to accommodate those overload spring pads. So if no aftermarket company makes ones that are similar to the factory shaped liners, they would not fit without some major hacking up of the liner and that wouldn't make much sense to do. So more than likely if one needs liners for a 3500 its going to be the factory ones that will work such as they are with them not hanging down further to hide the frame rail.

Everyone's use case for what they will generally do with their truck can be different and I too was tempted to buy the diesel because I know its certainly more capable for towing and they are very popular if for some reason I had to sell it in the area I am located. But I knew that would come with the potential negatives and dealing with cold weather for half the year and the diesel typically takes quite a bit longer to warm up. I just wasn't as gung hoe anymore to deal with the downsides and yes these days diesel fuel as I figured out locally would be about 95 cents CAD more per US gallon, very different from years ago when diesel was quite a bit less than gas. Of course the rig pigs up here, I don't know if they can get away with it now but years ago that was the huge incentive to have a diesel pickup as they were basically stealing diesel from the oil rig they worked on site at and the all did it and imagine the company knew it and just let it happen. I had thought of getting the 3.0 mini duramax had I gone the half ton route but I have an uneasy feeling about that engine long term, great fuel economy but ... However if one planned on lifting a truck to the sky, the diesel has a lot more going for it to drive that billboard sized frontal area on large tires down the highway. I am guessing that the extra weigh of the front bumper and skid plates and potential for mounting a winch may have a roll in GM putting the 5200 bars in the front, but you do still have those other bars if you ever want to swap them in for an experiment. I could not tell as it was too dark under that guys truck when he was showing the factory suspension in droop without the tire on but it almost looked to me that the upper A arm was not resting down on the steel pad that stops the droop travel. Something you should look closely at when you do your droop measuring test and you could at that point take the tire off for access ( using jack stands for safety ) unbolt the bottom end of the shock and see what additional travel the hub would droop to. That is "if" the droop stop is not being rested on with the shock bolted up. The guy I referred to, I looked at a few other recent videos of him using a prior modified 2020 half ton with the 6.2 and when he gets something modded on his truck, does he ever as that is quite the rig with that long arm front suspension lift with the various shocks and the rear end cut through the box with taller shock towers to turn the truck into a longer travel desert pre runner and the fiberglass widened body panels, $$$ was put into that truck and then being able to fit 40's on it, that guy likes his toys !.