Transmission Replacement Recommendation

05Quadrasteer · February 26, 2009

To all,

Well my transmission is starting to slip going from second to third. So started doing some research and found the Raptor guys down in Louisana.

First are they a good alternative instead of having the dealership or a shop rebuild the transmission? I have access to a auto hobby shop on the military base so a lift and all the tools I need won't be a problem, also I am mechanically inclined so doing the removal and install won't be a problem.

Second, looking at the differences between level 1 and level 2 transmissions with them is it worth the price difference? Here is the link to show the prices and what is different; http://www.transmissioncenter.net/4l...#Price%20Chart

Being as I am not knowledgable when it comes to the transmission the first area that jumps out at me is Band, level 1 gets stock while level 2 gets Carbon Fiber and Thicker. A couple other areas that are different is the servo, reaction shell, and performance valve.

My truck has been modified as you can see by the signature. Overall it is a daily driver tha I also use to pull the boat an hour down the road at least 6 times a year, boat weights in at about 3,000 pounds.

Thank for the help and have a nice day.

Bill

seadoons · February 26, 2009

I don't have a suggestion for you as to which tranny to pick but I will throw out that it is disappointing to see a truck that is three years younger than mine already having transmission problems. My truck is pushing 125,000 miles and i am still on the original. Do you know for sure that the slipping indicates an impending failure? Do you drive it hard / have you made modifications that are harder on the tranny?

Good luck with it all.

05Quadrasteer · February 26, 2009

This will be the second transmission. The first rebuild was done at 30,000 under the original warrenty. It now has been a bit over 70,000 miles further and things are happening that happened the first time.

As for hard driving I would say I have been a lot easier then I was the first 30,000. Modifications to my truck are listed in my signature area.

As for maintenance the tranmission has had its filter and all fluid changed at 65,000 miles and 95,000 miles on the truck. That work was done by the dealership.

Have a nice day.

Bill

Trash · February 27, 2009

Sux to hear that your on 2nd rebuild. If your thinking about mail order transmission, i personally think that could be a nightmare in the making, the thought of any problems, shipping tranny back?? I couldn't do that. Seems like overkill tranny's though, have you tried calling some local tranny shops, forget the dealer, maybe a shop that does high performance rebuild's with an aftermarket shift kit, you can talk to him about how you'd like to have truck shift for you and such, just my 2 cents.

Does your truck have towing package? sounds like maybe tranny was overheating could be you need tranny cooler? if you do job yourself don't forget to flush tranny lines/ trans cooler.

Good luck...

05Quadrasteer · February 27, 2009

I haven't checked into local shops yet. That is on the agenda for next week.

Yes, I do have the tow package on the truck with tranny cooler.

The one good thing about the place in the links is they don't require me sending the old tranny back to them. On other forums that particular company has been talked about highly which is what sent me to them for research.

When you say overkill tranny's do you mean they are built pretty tough? Above what a normal person might be wanting?

Thank you and have a nice day.

Bill

knnhon · February 27, 2009

I haven't checked into local shops yet. That is on the agenda for next week.

Yes, I do have the tow package on the truck with tranny cooler.

The one good thing about the place in the links is they don't require me sending the old tranny back to them. On other forums that particular company has been talked about highly which is what sent me to them for research.

When you say overkill tranny's do you mean they are built pretty tough? Above what a normal person might be wanting?

Thank you and have a nice day.

Bill

I can't understand this... it SHOULD be a 4L65E, shouldn't it?

I have a 454/4L80E['96] with 130,000 miles, put amsoil in it at 56,000. pulled 6,000 boats almost all it's life, and i have NOT a HINT of slippage.... the RPM is the same as when i bought it in '96... 2,500 rpm @ 70 mph....it still has that comb..... i am gonna change oil/filter... but, now that I'm not towing boat, i thought about going to a 4L60E/4L65E for more dig off the line, and more O/D.... if i used a same year tranny, i've heard that the elec. conn's would plug right in??? just need diff. yoke, and shorten driveshaft-move X-member.

slomo007 · February 27, 2009

I realize trannys go out occasionally on all sorts of trucks (tuned and not) but I do wonder about your Westers tune. How many miles did you have on your truck when you got it tuned? What kind of tune did you get (ie, how aggressive)?

need-for-speed · February 27, 2009

To all,

Well my transmission is starting to slip going from second to third. So started doing some research and found the Raptor guys down in Louisana.

First are they a good alternative instead of having the dealership or a shop rebuild the transmission? I have access to a auto hobby shop on the military base so a lift and all the tools I need won't be a problem, also I am mechanically inclined so doing the removal and install won't be a problem.

Second, looking at the differences between level 1 and level 2 transmissions with them is it worth the price difference? Here is the link to show the prices and what is different; http://www.transmissioncenter.net/4l...#Price%20Chart

Being as I am not knowledgable when it comes to the transmission the first area that jumps out at me is Band, level 1 gets stock while level 2 gets Carbon Fiber and Thicker. A couple other areas that are different is the servo, reaction shell, and performance valve.

My truck has been modified as you can see by the signature. Overall it is a daily driver tha I also use to pull the boat an hour down the road at least 6 times a year, boat weights in at about 3,000 pounds.

Thank for the help and have a nice day.

Bill

First of all - your mods aren't that extreme, so it is questionalbe as to why you've had another failure.

Assuming it's really bad:

I agree that there is no reason to go with the (overpriced) Chevy dealership option. More and more peeps are going with the mailorder option with good results. Plenty of folks on nastyz28.com have done the same (different supplier) with good results. But it would be a pain in the ass if you had to ship it back.

Are you near a big city or a reputable rebuilder? If the answer is yes, and you had a way to haul it to them , and leave your truck on the base - then I would remove it myself, take it to a tranny shop, have them rebuild it. I've done that in the past - many years ago with the Turbo 350 my Camaro before I converted it to a 700R4. I would flush the lines and cooler, and then re-install it along with a new or rebuilt torque convertor. If there was no local rebuild shop - then I would go the mail order option. I would buy the level one and pay for the 3-4 clutch upgrade. Add a cooler if you don't already have one. You really don't need the level 2 unless you just want to buy the extra "insurance" of the more better tranny build.

05Quadrasteer · February 27, 2009

I have had the tune in the truck since about 20,000 miles. Honestly I had the thought maybe the first transmission problem was brought on by the tune but after it got rebuilt and I didn't have any problems until recently figured that the tune had nothing to do with the failure.

Next week I am going to try and do some research around here to see if I can find a good transmission shop. I am about 40 miles west of Washington DC. So just have to see what is around here.

Please continue with input. Thank you all and have a nice day.

Bill

need-for-speed · February 27, 2009

I have had the tune in the truck since about 20,000 miles. Honestly I had the thought maybe the first transmission problem was brought on by the tune but after it got rebuilt and I didn't have any problems until recently figured that the tune had nothing to do with the failure.

Next week I am going to try and do some research around here to see if I can find a good transmission shop. I am about 40 miles west of Washington DC. So just have to see what is around here.

Please continue with input. Thank you all and have a nice day.

Bill

Considering where you live - you should have no problem finding a local shop to rebuild your tranny.

Generally speaking - crisper shifting is better for the tranny since clutchplate wear occurs during the transition period between shifts. Crisper shifts (in most tunes) allow for less time for the clutchplates to slip and wear since shifts occur faster. However, tunes could also alter transmission line pressure. You might want to consider going back to the factory tune. That's a lot of $ spent on tranny's. Good luck.

Rat4go · February 27, 2009

Generally speaking - crisper shifting is better for the tranny since clutchplate wear occurs during the transition period between shifts. Crisper shifts (in most tunes) allow for less time for the clutchplates to slip and wear since shifts occur faster. However, tunes could also alter transmission line pressure. You might want to consider going back to the factory tune. That's a lot of $ spent on tranny's. Good luck.

I agree with the above with one small difference....the 4L60e does a 'handshake' on the 2-3 shift where you drop the 2-4 band and apply the 3-4 clutch, so what FEELS like a firmer/faster 2-3 might be both clutches on at the same time for a brief moment. If both the 2-4 band and the 3-4 clutch are on and holding some torque at the same time, you're effectively in 4th gear, even for only a moment, but since pressure is going away on the 2-4 band, you're really doing a 2-4-3 shift, and working the 3-4 clutch really hard in the process. From what I've learned, the production "tune" uses torque management DURING the shift to limit the likelyhood that there's enough torque during the shift to hurt the 3-4 clutch. If your tune disables or reduces the TM limits, I'd bet that it's the tune that's toasting your 3-4 clutch.

Aftermarket clutch material might make the trans last longer, but they won't fix the problem. The bigger servo mentioned might get you closer to where you need to be, but I know too many folks who got 'tunes' that messed with things like TM during shifts and they had much shorter trans life because of it, and I'm still convinced that the TM that happens during a shift is for a short enough time that doesn't hurt real performance.

As mentioned above, you might wanna rethink the use of the tune or see if you can at least get the TM back to 'normal' and keep the rest of the tune.

As far as I'm concerned, when you choose to modify the vehicle via a tune or other go-fast parts, "You rolls the dice and you takes your chances!" with the risk being broken parts sooner than for an unmodified production truck and the reward a truck that performs closer to your desires.

Z71kris · February 27, 2009

Generally speaking - crisper shifting is better for the tranny since clutchplate wear occurs during the transition period between shifts. Crisper shifts (in most tunes) allow for less time for the clutchplates to slip and wear since shifts occur faster. However, tunes could also alter transmission line pressure. You might want to consider going back to the factory tune. That's a lot of $ spent on tranny's. Good luck.

I agree with the above with one small difference....the 4L60e does a 'handshake' on the 2-3 shift where you drop the 2-4 band and apply the 3-4 clutch, so what FEELS like a firmer/faster 2-3 might be both clutches on at the same time for a brief moment. If both the 2-4 band and the 3-4 clutch are on and holding some torque at the same time, you're effectively in 4th gear, even for only a moment, but since pressure is going away on the 2-4 band, you're really doing a 2-4-3 shift, and working the 3-4 clutch really hard in the process. From what I've learned, the production "tune" uses torque management DURING the shift to limit the likelyhood that there's enough torque during the shift to hurt the 3-4 clutch. If your tune disables or reduces the TM limits, I'd bet that it's the tune that's toasting your 3-4 clutch.

Aftermarket clutch material might make the trans last longer, but they won't fix the problem. The bigger servo mentioned might get you closer to where you need to be, but I know too many folks who got 'tunes' that messed with things like TM during shifts and they had much shorter trans life because of it, and I'm still convinced that the TM that happens during a shift is for a short enough time that doesn't hurt real performance.

As mentioned above, you might wanna rethink the use of the tune or see if you can at least get the TM back to 'normal' and keep the rest of the tune.

As far as I'm concerned, when you choose to modify the vehicle via a tune or other go-fast parts, "You rolls the dice and you takes your chances!" with the risk being broken parts sooner than for an unmodified production truck and the reward a truck that performs closer to your desires.

That like a saying we have here at my work, "You get what cha get, so don't though a fit!"

jjrobo · March 2, 2009

Try to find a local tranny shop. most around me offer a 100k mile warranty or lifetime for the same owner. Plus they can build it the way you want with the proper upgrades.