Newbie Question #1

NewbieZ71 · July 15, 2001

Been trying to become more knowledgeable so bear with my "Newbieness".....

When a race car is drafting it has the advantage of not having to move the air in front out of the way. It is then faster because it is using its horsepower to move the car, not the air, thereby going faster. However, because of the leading car, the trailing car in a drafting situation does not have the force of the air pushing down the front end. This should hurt the cars performance in the turns because the tires arent gripping the track as well.

Which advantage outweighs the other or is it as simple as draft on the straight aways, back off in the turns?

(Edited by NewbieZ71 at 1:23 am on July 15, 2001)

MountaineerTom · July 15, 2001

It depends on how the car is handling. At the Super Speedways (Daytona and Taladega) they pretty much draft all the way around the track.

General Lee 01 · July 15, 2001

It depends on what part of the track you're on.

If the 2 cars are just coming onto a straightaway, then the lead car is screwed. cause the car in the draft has a whole straightaway to pass the lead car. If they're in the turns, and the car in the draftgets too close he gets two problems, 1 "Aero-push" which is the thingie you said about tires losing grip due to lack of downforce, or he begins to overheat due to no air geting in thru the grill.

MountaineerTom · July 15, 2001

Newbie,

Two terms to learn to make it easier to understand what they are talking about on TV.

Tight (or Pushing) is when you want to turn, but the cars tries to go straight.

Loose is when the back end wants to slide out from under you (usually in the turns).

I think it was Sterling Marlin that once said "Tight is when you wreck nose first into the wall and Loose is when you wreck back end first into it". LOL

(Edited by MountaineerTom 99Z71 at 1:48 am on July 15, 2001)

NewbieZ71 · July 15, 2001

Ahh, so its not as simple as those two issues (draft=gain speed, draft=lose grip/handling). They have to play all the factors you guys stated....gain in speed, loss of handling, lack of air flow, etc.

It sure looks simple when they do it... why are they able to draft all the way around at those tracks you mentioned Tom? What is different about them than say Darlington?

General Lee 01 · July 15, 2001

Cause at Daytona and Talladega you don't need to hit the brakes and you don't turn as sharp as you would at Darlington.

Drafting doesn't really work much at Darlington anyways.

NewbieZ71 · July 15, 2001

Why not?

Sorry for being...well you know....

General Lee 01 · July 15, 2001

Quote: from NewbieZ71 on 2:05 am on July 15, 2001
Why not?

Sorry for being...well you know....

IMO The straightaways aren't long enough for drafting to play a big part. You need a good lengh of straightaways for drafting to make any difference.

I don't know, Tom, would you agree?

MountaineerTom · July 15, 2001

Darlington is 1.36 miles long and has fairly sharp turns (at least at 160-170 MPH) that are banked at 25* on one end and 23* on the other. Daytona is 2.5 miles long with 31* banking in the turns (except the tri-oval, where the start/finish line is, which I think is around 18*) and Taladegs is 2.66 miles long with 33* banking with a tri-oval similar to Daytona. Taladega is a little wider than Daytona though. The longer and faster the track, the more the draft helps you.

NASCAR makes the teams use a restrictor plate, which is basically a piece of metal with 4 holes in it, that goes between the intake manifold and the carburator. What this does is restricts the amount of flow in to the engine. I can't remember what size the holes are because they change them every now and then to keep the speeds down. I think they are somewhere around 7/8 on an inch now. Anyway, because of the plate, the drivers are able to run pretty much full throttle all teh way around the track. If restrictor plates were not used, I would guess the cars would run 230-240 MPH at Taladega now. 1987 was the last year they ran without the plates and Bill Elliott qualified at 212.809 MPH. With all the aerodynamic's of the cars now and advances in performance, it wouldn't suprise me to see the 230-240 speeds there. Now, the reason plates are used is for the safety of the drivers and fans. At those speeds, cars were flipping when they started spinning out and got sideways. Bobby Allison took out a huge section of the fence on the front stretch at Taladega around that time. The racing that you see now at Daytona and Taladega where the cars are all bunched up in a big pack is caused by the restrictor plates. They are all pretty much going full speed. They don't have the power to pull away like an unrestricted motor does. They do still flip somtimes though.

(Edited by MountaineerTom 99Z71 at 2:53 am on July 15, 2001)

General Lee 01 · July 15, 2001

A legend by the name of Cale yarborough also Qualified over 200mph At Daytona, he ended up spining out and flipping on his 2nd lap trying to outdo his first lap.

NewbieZ71 · July 15, 2001

I dont think there is a way to make the cars safe at that kinda speed. 230-240 mph is just too fast.

The United States Air Force has a name for cars going that fast - Airplanes

July 15, 2001

Quote: from General Lee 01 on 1:42 am on July 15, 2001
A legend by the name of Cale yarborough also Qualified over 200mph At Daytona, he ended up spining out and flipping on his 2nd lap trying to outdo his first lap.

Bill Elliot- 212 mph qualifying at Talledega. That will probably always be a record.

MountaineerTom · July 15, 2001

Quote: from Friz on 12:36 pm on July 15, 2001
Quote: from General Lee 01 on 1:42 am on July 15, 2001
A legend by the name of Cale yarborough also Qualified over 200mph At Daytona, he ended up spining out and flipping on his 2nd lap trying to outdo his first lap.

Bill Elliot- 212 mph qualifying at Talledega. That will probably always be a record.

I agree.