The truth about trucks.......

SupadaveGMC · June 17, 2005

I'm sure everyone else is familiar or aware of this ford propagande site, however I need to vent.

Did anyone else notice that there is not a single shred of numerical evidence to back up any of the claims on that site. If the fords suspension a-arm is bigger it is stronger if something else on the ford is smaller, then its lighter and the competition's is too big and bulky.

When would the bolts that can lift a truck up be necesary? And how do we know that the bolts that have a few less threads (heve and Dodge) aren't strong enough to hold up their respective trucks?

I challenge anybody who believes that Ford trucks are tougher than any other trucks to prove it. I dont want to hear that your grandpa had one and drove it over a mountain, I want proof.

And on a side note when would the solid front axle on the F-350 be much better than a GM HD, where does it say that The front independant is weaker?

silverad03 · June 17, 2005

I may not remember correctly, but don't they actually chain the truck up by the bumper in that commercial?

How does hanging a truck by the bumper/frame prove that the bed bolts are strong anyway?

silvershake · June 17, 2005

Solid front axle is just stronger. It isn't as pleasurable driving with a solid front compaird to an IFS on the road, but like when towing and being offroad it's drasticly better because it can articulate much better. IFS sucks once you lift your truck, it will make your sub shafts have horrible angles which give you the worst ride. I've heard you really don't want to go over 35'' tires on IFS because stuff will wear out fast. That doesn't mean you can't do it, because obviously people do.

Think about an axle that is split in two places, then having two angled shafts to the wheels. With basically a subframe to old it in place, compaired to one beefy peice of steel across the front end. I hope I'm making sense.

To answer your question on "prove it to me?" I don't know what to say it's just common sense to me.

My truck has IFS, and I like it because it stays on the road 90% of the time and I don't tow heavy loads. Ford and Dodge both have solid front axles (last time I checked) and they don't do it because it's cool. I'm sure GM will figure it out sooner or later. I'm still confused why hummers h2's have ifs, maybe because they're built for the mall, who knows?

ben

facn8me · June 17, 2005

As far as proving it that would be hard. But i buy chevy cause they are easier to work on and part's are cheaper. Plus they are faster and better looking IMO Case in point. The new ls2 has 400hp and is naturally aspirated. The mustang with the blower has 385hp. nuff said.

Reliability with both is determined by service and driving. My favorite commecial is the most tq at 1000rpm one. I mean really how often does your truck run 1000 rpm. Never when driving. Only takin off.

Hecktorx · June 17, 2005

I'm not saying one is stronger then the other, but I would like to see some failure rate statistics. I'm talking strength not fuction. I've seen plenty of ford bearing failures on the claimed superior solid axle with mild tire size increases. Now I think ford has improved their bearing design. I just think it would be nice to see a third party with the capability to quantify the failure rates into some statistics so this debate can be supported with facts and not opinion.

It's kinda like the red dye you can put in your swimming pool so you can tell if someone is peeing in it. A lot of people believe such a substance exists as fact, but it doesn't.

SupadaveGMC · June 17, 2005

Solid front axle is just stronger. It isn't as pleasurable driving with a solid front compaird to an IFS on the road, but like when towing and being offroad it's drasticly better because it can articulate much better. IFS sucks once you lift your truck, it will make your sub shafts have horrible angles which give you the worst ride. I've heard you really don't want to go over 35'' tires on IFS because stuff will wear out fast. That doesn't mean you can't do it, because obviously people do.

To answer your question on "prove it to me?" I don't know what to say it's just common sense to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How do we know it's stronger? As far as the lift/shaft angles, thats a valid point.

But as far as being better off-road the Hummer H1 had Independant all the way around. Pretty decent off-roader I've heard.

I propose that Gm is ahead of the curve and that Ford and Dodge need to catch-up. SFA is a thing of the past.

asilverblazer · June 17, 2005

Independent suspensions have advantages off-road like ground clearance.

J-rod · June 17, 2005

I may not remember correctly, but don't they actually chain the truck up by the bumper in that commercial?

How does hanging a truck by the bumper/frame prove that the bed bolts are strong anyway?

They use one the super-duper-mega-extra strong bed bolts as a "pin" that goes through the eye on the end of the cable and through something (hitch maybe???) on the truck. So essentially the bolt should be supporting the full weight of the truck. Yeah, laaaaa-dee-freakin-da!

Nick99Chevy · June 17, 2005

You mean you guys don't hang your truck up by the bumper every night when you get home?

Wingnut · June 17, 2005

You mean you guys don't hang your truck up by the bumper every night when you get home?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yup, gots me a truck tree out back. When the twisters come, it's kind of like wind-chimes, only with trucks.

*Clunk*

*Clink*

*Clunk*

*Crunch*

Music to my ears.

100R1 · June 17, 2005

You mean you guys don't hang your truck up by the bumper every night when you get home?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

HAng i'm like a bat in a cave

I can hear it now The caped Ford man singing DO-DO-DO-DO-DO-DO-DO-DO-FORDMAN!

AS he's walking into His Garage (cave) With his F150 Hanging from the ceiling

PRICELESS!

Didn't FORD use to have commercuials with a light bulb lighting up above engineers head saying something like "A BETTER IDEA"

Cut out all the Hype and it boils down to what makes you happy FORD, CHEVY, GMC, DODGE, Studabaker Yea had to throw that in my Grandfather use to swear that his Studebaker Truck was the best truck ever built.

Mark_in_Tulsa · June 17, 2005

Solid front axle is just stronger. It isn't as pleasurable driving with a solid front compaird to an IFS on the road, but like when towing and being offroad it's drasticly better because it can articulate much better. IFS sucks once you lift your truck, it will make your sub shafts have horrible angles which give you the worst ride. I've heard you really don't want to go over 35'' tires on IFS because stuff will wear out fast. That doesn't mean you can't do it, because obviously people do.

To answer your question on "prove it to me?" I don't know what to say it's just common sense to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How do we know it's stronger? As far as the lift/shaft angles, thats a valid point.

But as far as being better off-road the Hummer H1 had Independant all the way around. Pretty decent off-roader I've heard.

I propose that Gm is ahead of the curve and that Ford and Dodge need to catch-up. SFA is a thing of the past.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dodge Rams 1500 have an IFS. The Dodge HD move up to a solid front axle.

Here is a good link on IFS vs. Solid

http://www.4wheeloffroad.com/techfaq/2819/index14.html

SupadaveGMC · June 17, 2005

Solid front axle is just stronger. It isn't as pleasurable driving with a solid front compaird to an IFS on the road, but like when towing and being offroad it's drasticly better because it can articulate much better. IFS sucks once you lift your truck, it will make your sub shafts have horrible angles which give you the worst ride. I've heard you really don't want to go over 35'' tires on IFS because stuff will wear out fast. That doesn't mean you can't do it, because obviously people do.

To answer your question on "prove it to me?" I don't know what to say it's just common sense to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How do we know it's stronger? As far as the lift/shaft angles, thats a valid point.

But as far as being better off-road the Hummer H1 had Independant all the way around. Pretty decent off-roader I've heard.

I propose that Gm is ahead of the curve and that Ford and Dodge need to catch-up. SFA is a thing of the past.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dodge Rams 1500 have an IFS. The Dodge HD move up to a solid front axle.

Here is a good link on IFS vs. Solid

http://www.4wheeloffroad.com/techfaq/2819/index14.html

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How is it that the HD "moved up to SFA" when I'm pretty sure that the pre '93 Ram 1500 (as with other 1/2 tons) had SFA then when the '94 came out they "moved up" to IFS. IFS is a progression of suspension technology.

As well that article was quite poorly written with alot of flawed logic.

99-2door · June 17, 2005

Dodge Rams 1500 have an IFS. The Dodge HD move up to a solid front axle.

Here is a good link on IFS vs. Solid

http://www.4wheeloffroad.com/techfaq/2819/index14.html

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That article leaves out a lot of info about on road performance difference between the two. Their argument about articulation is ridiculous and erroneous.

If solid axle is so much better for off-road traction, why is it that ATV brands are touting independant rear axles on the higher priced models?

If I am building a mud bog machine or a rock crawler, I'm going with solid axle. Why? Because you can make them nearly bullet proof for a lot less dough and put in tons of different locker choices in the front. If it is something I'm gonna drive everyday, I want IFS.

I love the fact that they used tractors as a comparison. If you have ever driven one down the road, they don't handle so great. Not to mention that they are not similar at all and a pretty s**tty comparison.

[]----[] versus []-^-[]

silvershake · June 18, 2005

"If I am building a mud bog machine or a rock crawler, I'm going with solid axle. Why? Because you can make them nearly bullet proof for a lot less dough and put in tons of different locker choices in the front. If it is something I'm gonna drive everyday, I want IFS."

--Because it's cheaper? Thats a weak sauce excuse, the reason you would use a Solid Front Axle is because they way it can articulate. Sure IFS is awesome on the road and for a daily driver, but it is aweful for rock crawing and mud bogging.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread....t=334698&page=5

scroll down that page and try to do this with IFS. Show me one pic of a rock crawler worth a d**n with ifs.

"If solid axle is so much better for off-road traction, why is it that ATV brands are touting independant rear axles on the higher priced models?"

--I have no idea, I ride on a honda foreman rubicon every day and I hate the ifs front end, the last thing it does is articulate well. I can't image how much the IRS is going to suck.

"How is it that the HD "moved up to SFA" when I'm pretty sure that the pre '93 Ram 1500 (as with other 1/2 tons) had SFA then when the '94 came out they "moved up" to IFS. IFS is a progression of suspension technology."

--I think you're right when you say that it's progression in technology, but my point is that offroad the IFS sucks and as far as being stronger than a solid front axle I think its not, just an opinion. I think they are more concerned with how their costumers feel while driving on the road. But in my opinon, dodge still rides like crap.

"But as far as being better off-road the Hummer H1 had Independant all the way around. Pretty decent off-roader I've heard. I propose that Gm is ahead of the curve and that Ford and Dodge need to catch-up. SFA is a thing of the past."

--The IFS on an hummer HI is like that of a desert racing truck, take a look sometime and you'll notice a big difference, even though it is IFS there is much more wheel travel,It is a different animal. For jumping and landing, solid axle won't be your friend. I don't think the hummer h1 was made for heavy articulation, I think it was made to go through the desert going fast similar to a desert racer, no for heavy articulation. You think its to heavy to go fast and jump like a desert racer, nah, a deser racer's are heavy! 37'' tires,spares with liners on rims, 65 gallons of fuel, passengers, there gear, and the tools needed to support the prerunner and the race truck so thats where a lot of the weight is. They can weigh anywhere from 5,000 to 6000lbs..... Hummers don't have any trouble with articulation and tipping over because its so big and wide. The H2's ifs is different than the h1.

Notice the difference in this ifs compaired to those on our trucks?

http://www.off-road.com/race/2003score/primm/contin.html

or this

http://www.autointell.net/nao_companies/ge..._H1006L-800.jpg

Here is the h2, which is the same design as the chevy pickup...

http://www.canadiandriver.com/previews/ima...hummer_h2_4.jpg

As far as i'm concerned this hummer is getting owned....

http://speedycars.chinacars.com/wallpaper2...H1%20-%2013.jpg

And for this, I know a solid front axle with the right suspension set up, coils, shocks, links, this wheel would be touching the ground.

http://www.powersys.com/auto_show2005/larg...20+%20H2-pt.jpg

I know it sounds like i'm trying to dog on the IFS, i'm really not; like i said in the past I think the IFS is the heat when it comes to onroad driving. It really does the best for small articlation(roads curves and such) say on the road. That's why drifters, autocross, and circut racers are putting indepent rear suspension in their cars because it hugs the road more, like I said, its awesome in low travel situations. But in my opinion, I really believe the solid axle is stronger and essential for real offroad. Sorry if this post was completely side tracked, sometimes I just go on and on and I'm sure none of ya'll really care. What do I know anyways, I just turned 21, I have many years to learn new and old things.

ben