Oem Audio Upgrade - Thoughts And Opinions

DofD · August 23, 2008

I have on order a 2009 LTZ (due to arrive end of October) with nav (no DVD) and the Bose 10 speaker Centerpoint system. By all accounts the audio quality is only okay. So I am planning an audio upgrade.

What I am planning is to keep the OEM HU and upgrade all the speakers, and sub with these.

Boston Acoustics Pro60 x 4 (or maybe 6)

JL Audio Stealthbox

JL Audio HD600/4 x 2

Rockford Fosgate 3SIXTY.2 (as I am keeping the OEM amp)

One of the questions I'm pondering is that since the OEM system has a center channel speaker for the simulated 5.1 surround, do I replace that with a component or just forget about that speaker in the dash and just mount two components in the rear. The question arises since after replacing the 4 door speaker and tweeter pairs and using 2 channels (bridged) for the sub, I still have 2 channels to play with. Maybe 6x9's in the back?

The details the amplifier connector show that the connector has 7 output channels which are all accounted for in the OEM speaker setup. My question is if anyone knows if the individual output channels are all full frequency or frequency limited by the OEM amp? This relates as to whether channel summing will be needed.

Other planned mods are for VizuaLogic A-1290 Headrest Monitors, Passport 9500ci detector, GMPP CAI, Corsa sport exhaust, and a Blackbear tune.

Thoughts, optinions, suggestions?

Wingnut · August 23, 2008

My one and only opinion on something like this is...DO NOT BUY BOSE IN YOUR CAR IF YOU WANT TO UPGRADE IT IN ANY WAY LATER.

Get the cheapest crappiest stereo that GM will let you put in that truck and replace it with aftermarket later. It's cheaper and easier to do it that way.

nbscanuck · August 23, 2008

My one and only opinion on something like this is...DO NOT BUY BOSE IN YOUR CAR IF YOU WANT TO UPGRADE IT IN ANY WAY LATER.

Get the cheapest crappiest stereo that GM will let you put in that truck and replace it with aftermarket later. It's cheaper and easier to do it that way.

+1

Bish · August 23, 2008

I have a very similar setup in my 08 and did a lot of research. Here's what I found. First off, here's what I have.

OEM Nav head unit

Stock bose amp (have to keep it i you want the head unit)

Alpine 4x100 and alpine 1x350

Infinity kappas in rear, components in front

JL Stealthbox

JL Cleansweep

JL Summing unit (Can't remember model)

I left the center channel as is still powered by bose. The sub output is definitely low frequency and it gets less output as you turn up the volume. I THINK the doors are tuned as well. As for the rears pillars, I would think they would be as they are really only tweeters. If you want to keep head unit balance and fade controls, I think you need to sum at least the sub and four doors. I think it would sound good if you could get some 4x6 or similar for the very back and put a little power to them. You could drive them through the spares in your amp. I'm not sure how much room there is back there. If you don't care about controlling that channel, you could drive them off the same summed channels as the doors. If you want to keep individual control, I think you need 7 summed outputs AND inputs from the amp. Mine are still powered by the bose amp but I can barely notice them not that I have good power going everywhere else. I chose to forsake the 5.1 and any bose "features" and basically drive the four doors and sub. Also, the infinity tweeter fits in the stock a-pillar location with minor modifications and remains behind the cover for stealth.

Make sure you have a wiring diagram as there are many differences between models and model years. It took me a good while to figure out all the wiring on my setup.

BTW I still get onstar and phone through speaker and also chimes if the volume is turned up

DofD · August 24, 2008

My one and only opinion on something like this is...DO NOT BUY BOSE IN YOUR CAR IF YOU WANT TO UPGRADE IT IN ANY WAY LATER.

Get the cheapest crappiest stereo that GM will let you put in that truck and replace it with aftermarket later. It's cheaper and easier to do it that way.

According to the dealer (here at least) with the LTZ with nav, this was the minimum setup I could go for. Of course now after doing a lot more research I could have gone base stereo for LTZ (which is Bose anyway) and installed an Avic and complete after market.

My initial thoughts were that the stereo wouldn't sound any worse than the Delco in my current Tahoe which actually has really decent sound. At least that is what I thought until I heard the Bose system in my Dad's Escalade. The overall frequency reproduction and imaging with it is utter crap.

DofD · August 24, 2008

I left the center channel as is still powered by bose. The sub output is definitely low frequency and it gets less output as you turn up the volume. I THINK the doors are tuned as well. As for the rears pillars, I would think they would be as they are really only tweeters. If you want to keep head unit balance and fade controls, I think you need to sum at least the sub and four doors. I think it would sound good if you could get some 4x6 or similar for the very back and put a little power to them. You could drive them through the spares in your amp. I'm not sure how much room there is back there. If you don't care about controlling that channel, you could drive them off the same summed channels as the doors. If you want to keep individual control, I think you need 7 summed outputs AND inputs from the amp. Mine are still powered by the bose amp but I can barely notice them not that I have good power going everywhere else. I chose to forsake the 5.1 and any bose "features" and basically drive the four doors and sub. Also, the infinity tweeter fits in the stock a-pillar location with minor modifications and remains behind the cover for stealth.

Make sure you have a wiring diagram as there are many differences between models and model years. It took me a good while to figure out all the wiring on my setup.

BTW I still get onstar and phone through speaker and also chimes if the volume is turned up

That's a good idea to leave the centre channel powered by the Bose amp and to sum just the door and sub channels. The 5.1 or simulated 5.1 isn't of any importance to me as the HU isn't DVD. I could of course add a good DSP processor to the system to create better surround and effects.

A couple of the nice things about the HD600's is that with just two I can power all the channels and they are low profile so they will both fit under the second row bench (the bench works better with car seats and little kids). A nice thing about the 3Sixty is that it will also do the channel summing without needing a separate unit (I was looking at the Cleansweep units initially). I any dealer actually had a Tahoe around here I'd go and poke around to see what good locations would be for speakers in the rear.

What do you think of the bass response from your Stealthbox?

Your Denali is really close to my Tahoe as I'm getting the red jewel as well and the 09's have most of the similar external trim. The only big difference is I am getting the 5.3 (I tried to update my order to a 6.2 but was told I couldn't).

Yeah the wiring diagram is going to be a pain, though I think the one in this thread could be the correct one (Bose wiring diagram).

Bish · August 24, 2008

The stealthbox is good to very good but not excellent. Way better than stock but not huge thumping. Nice tight snappy drums but not booming which I don't really care for anyhow. The sub should compliment the overall sound, not dominate it. Besides, I hate vibrating license plates For the money of the stealthbox, I think you could build better particularly if you went with a bigger box in a diufferent location. But for plug and play it worked very well and I had no fitment issues whatsoever. I had an 01 Tahoe and I replaced the 8" sub and it was better than stock but did not compare to the stealthbox. Overall I am happy with it but I think it is slightly overpriced.

My amps are under the second row tilt up seats. Tight fit.

I had an 01 Tahoe that I put 210K on it over 7 years. I LOVED that truck. When it came time for new, I was going to get another Tahoe then I drove the Denali with the 6.2L/6-speed and there was no turning back. Amazing how fast they can get a 6000lb brick to move. I turned a 14.7 in the 1/4 mile at the track stock And the best bonus, I get 2mpg better on my commute compared to my Tahoe and I have over 100HP more. I think the six speed REALLY helps highway mileage as I'm only turning just under 2000 rpm at 80mph. I looked at the Escalade and decided you really did get anything for an extra 10K except for HID and 25HP more so I bought EFILive and a tune and saved a bunch of cash instead.

Regarding the Red Jewel, I was somewhat reluctant when I purchased it. I bought off the lot and there were really no decent colors in the 08 IMO. Won't do black again. Silver and gold cars everywhere. Many dark grey choices and no blue choices. So I reluctantly went red. After 6+ months I'm really liking it. It details to a really deep color that shines nicely. It has some minor orange peel in the paint but most new cars do these days. It hides a reasonable amount of dirt.

BTW- I have a complete 08 wiring diagram but I don't think it will help you. Let m e know if you are interested.

DofD · August 24, 2008

The Stealthbox sounds like it should do the job I am looking for (other than being over priced). I'm not looking for something booming either, doesn't fit the music I listen too and with being a daily driver and family hauler, booming isn't good for the little ones. Adding a box elsewhere doesn't work either as the space is needed for hauling stuff (camping, skiing, etc).

Yeah, imo the colour selections over the past few years just haven't been very good or anything that really catches my eye. The red jewel sounds like it will be really nice. I did pass and Enclave in red jewel and thought it looked good.

Thanks for the offer on the wiring diagram. If you can pass it along that would be great. I'm trying to compile as many as I can that sound right so that when the time comes I'll have a few options to compare against.

Those are really decent performance numbers for your Denali. Yeah from what I've been able to gather the new Tahoe should get better mpg than my 97 even with over 50hp more.

Cheers.

Bish · August 25, 2008

HERE'S a link to the 08 schematic.

DofD · August 25, 2008

Thanks! The diagrams are very much appreciated!

prhuseby · September 2, 2008

HERE'S a link to the 08 schematic.

Over the weekend, I installed a Clean Sweep CL441dsp and it is not working well at all. Here is what I have going: 2006 GMC Sierra Crew Cab w/ Bose 6 CD changer stereo system - NOT the Lux - just the standard Bose system/amp. About 6 months ago, I did the following:Replaced the door speakers (both front and back - 4 total) with Kenwood 2-way speakers, model KFC-X1700Added Kenwood Powered Subwoofer, model KSC-SW1Added a Soundgate auxiliary input converter, model AUXGMV3Added a PIE adjustable line driver with subsonic filter, model LD-1 (volume on added aux input was too low) After all of the above, I still wasn't totally impressed with the sound quality, but didn't want to change out the HU.....so I came upon the Clean Sweep CL441dsp and thought I would give it a try. I also purchased a Rockford Fosgate Punch 4-channel amplifier, model P450.4. The biggest problem I ran into is trying to figure out what the Bose wiring diagram would be and what wires I should tap into for feeding the CL441dsp. I finally spliced into the actual speaker wires at the doors and that is what is feeding the CL441dsp. When I try to "calibrate" the unit, it comes up with 3 good channels and 1 bad - the front right speaker (shows solid red status). But the sound is terrible. If I try fading to the front - I have sound in the front left speaker....if I fade to the back, I have very little sound if any. The sound I had before adding the new amp and sound processor was pretty good, but this is now terrible. One note, I am splitting my rear speaker output from the CL441dsp and one line feeds the Kenwood subwoofer and the other feeds the Rockford Fostgate amplifier. Here are a few questions I have that may also help to shed some light on this problem:

If I only tap into the door speaker wires, what about the sound that is going to the tweeters or "tune ups" in the front of the vehicle...or the Bose subwoofer? Does Bose use a crossover filter and therefore the sound going to the doors does not have the full range of sound - only the "mids" - no high or low frequency?
Should I be tapping into the wiring that is coming directly out of the back of the 6 CD changer head unit rather than the wires going to the doors?

Maybe it's a simple improper wiring, but I would feel much more confident if I knew that I was tapping into the correct audio lines of the Bose system. Do you also have the wiring diagram for a 2006 GMC?

Bish · September 2, 2008

Something is not right...obviously. I had lots of trouble figuring out the bose wiring WITH a schematic.

First, the door channels are crossed to provide mid and high. The sub channels (2) are crossed only for lows. I had to use J&L's summing device (can't remember model). It took the output of the 4 doors and the sub and provided 4 full range outputs that plugged directly into the cleansweep. Balance and fade should work fine with this setup.

I don't think you can tap off the head unit. At least on mine, the head unit outputs are constant volume regardless of the volume knob. Might be different on yours though. I tested it by hooking up a speaker to the outputs from the head unit.

Lastly, the one bad channel could be as simple as one channel has the polarity off (+-) compared to the others. You could swap channels on the cleansweep and see if the red light stays with that speaker or that channel.

Regarding the tweeters. You could simply disconnect them. I ran components up front so I used a separate crossover for the tweeters.

Lastly, regarding splitting the signal, why don't you just use line out of one of the amps? That's what I did. Splitting is not a favorite of mine as it reduces the signal to both devices.

prhuseby · September 4, 2008

Something is not right...obviously. I had lots of trouble figuring out the bose wiring WITH a schematic.

First, the door channels are crossed to provide mid and high. The sub channels (2) are crossed only for lows. I had to use J&L's summing device (can't remember model). It took the output of the 4 doors and the sub and provided 4 full range outputs that plugged directly into the cleansweep. Balance and fade should work fine with this setup.

I don't think you can tap off the head unit. At least on mine, the head unit outputs are constant volume regardless of the volume knob. Might be different on yours though. I tested it by hooking up a speaker to the outputs from the head unit.

Lastly, the one bad channel could be as simple as one channel has the polarity off (+-) compared to the others. You could swap channels on the cleansweep and see if the red light stays with that speaker or that channel.

Regarding the tweeters. You could simply disconnect them. I ran components up front so I used a separate crossover for the tweeters.

Lastly, regarding splitting the signal, why don't you just use line out of one of the amps? That's what I did. Splitting is not a favorite of mine as it reduces the signal to both devices.

Thanks for the information! I talked with a "techy" from JL Audio and they said that with my Bose stereo system, I need the summing device to take the audio signal from the Bose amp and feed it into the summing device (http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_cleansw...php?prod_id=387) and then into the Clean Sweep. The Clean Sweep needs a "full range signal" coming in and when the signal comes out of the amp, it has been filtered - cross over - and the signal is not full. The summing device combines all of the signals together to create the full range signal before going into the clean sweep. Sure would have been nice if JL would tell me these things before I bought the clean sweep....AARRGGHHHH!!! If I get this all to work, I'll let you know and post the information, wiring etc. Oh Yeah...I have a friend with a friend that works at a GMC dealership - service department and I now have print outs of the stereo and amp wiring diagram.

Bish · September 5, 2008

Something is not right...obviously. I had lots of trouble figuring out the bose wiring WITH a schematic.

First, the door channels are crossed to provide mid and high. The sub channels (2) are crossed only for lows. I had to use J&L's summing device (can't remember model). It took the output of the 4 doors and the sub and provided 4 full range outputs that plugged directly into the cleansweep. Balance and fade should work fine with this setup.

I don't think you can tap off the head unit. At least on mine, the head unit outputs are constant volume regardless of the volume knob. Might be different on yours though. I tested it by hooking up a speaker to the outputs from the head unit.

Lastly, the one bad channel could be as simple as one channel has the polarity off (+-) compared to the others. You could swap channels on the cleansweep and see if the red light stays with that speaker or that channel.

Regarding the tweeters. You could simply disconnect them. I ran components up front so I used a separate crossover for the tweeters.

Lastly, regarding splitting the signal, why don't you just use line out of one of the amps? That's what I did. Splitting is not a favorite of mine as it reduces the signal to both devices.

Thanks for the information! I talked with a "techy" from JL Audio and they said that with my Bose stereo system, I need the summing device to take the audio signal from the Bose amp and feed it into the summing device (http://mobile.jlaudio.com/products_cleansw...php?prod_id=387) and then into the Clean Sweep. The Clean Sweep needs a "full range signal" coming in and when the signal comes out of the amp, it has been filtered - cross over - and the signal is not full. The summing device combines all of the signals together to create the full range signal before going into the clean sweep. Sure would have been nice if JL would tell me these things before I bought the clean sweep....AARRGGHHHH!!! If I get this all to work, I'll let you know and post the information, wiring etc. Oh Yeah...I have a friend with a friend that works at a GMC dealership - service department and I now have print outs of the stereo and amp wiring diagram.

You'll get it done. Then you can smile when you crank your kick@ss stereo. It will sound great once you get it setup right...I know mine does