Will GMT-900 pickups have coil spring FS too?

Minimization · November 26, 2005

Looks like torsion bars are going away for the SUVs. Also, I take it we'll get revised 6.0 and/or 6.2 L engines?

Larry · December 1, 2005

Yes, torsion bars will be a goner on GMT-900 trucks below 8600 GVWR. Much better ride and fewer components to deal with. Trucks above 8600 GVWR….the jury is still out.

rcpd34 · December 8, 2005

I hear they may be bringing back the solid front axle next year...

duramaxHD · December 12, 2005

I doubt it...

Larry · December 13, 2005

I hear they may be bringing back the solid front axle next year...

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Long post sorry….guess I got carried away on one of my rants.

That is a SFA rumor is getting out of control over on another forum fuel by a dealer that would like all to believe he is in the know. Although I wish it was true but, I very very very seriously doubt a SFA will ever hang from the frame rails of any GM truck less than a C4500 for two reasons. First, GM is a cushy riding SUV, personal use pickup and rental car company. They are not interested in competing with Ford and Dodge in the commercial pick-up truck sector that would mostly benefit from SFA. Two, JD Power and Associates. You folks have no idea how influential JDPA is within GM design, marketing, package content, etc. Most hate JDPA but they did actually help GM win many awards and helped Joe Consumer somewhat realize that GM does build quality vehicles BUT they have also helped GM build undesirable cars that nobody wants that partially contributed to GM’s current situation.

I spent about 18 months of my 6-year Detroit life in the RenCen supporting all of the truck brand teams in order management. It was quite the eye opener to see how things really play out. This was in 1997/8 timeframe during the launch of the GMT800’s. Kurt Ridder for one was very opposed to SFA, base model trucks or any thing less than a personal use pickup. Roy Roberts team of GMC idiots on the “One Percenter” side of company were even worse. Not all of these people have left the company so I doubt their philosophies have changed at all. In fact, if they had it their way and the company wasn’t so broke you could count on seeing IRS in all trucks and SUV’s at and below 8600 GVWR. Probably within a few years you will see IRS and for years to come we can all complain how bad we want SRA back.

So, between JD Power and a company lead by a bunch of soft palm flit boys that believe everybody should be driving a leather cladded, low slung, POS autocrap 4wd, cream of the crap $40,000 truck…………. I again have to say no SFA for us that would love to see it back.

If GM was smart and interested in getting the attention of commercial pick up truck users (sorry, the C4500 4x4 is a failure due to co$t) they could easily score the new AAM 925 Salisbury axle from American Axle just like the one used in the Dodge 2500 and 3500 4x4 and offer it as an SEO option but that would increase plant complexity and GM would constrain it so terribly you would not be able to order it with an FM radio or tinted windows…you know, something stupid like GM always does just like manual transmission and manual transfercases.

With that said, it may be hard to tell that I bleed little GM logos when get cut. It is hard to say all this about your favorite car company but that is the way it is and I doubt they will ever change.

Larry · December 17, 2005

I am shocked nobody had anything to say after the post above. I thought this would turn out to be a flaming topic.

BlackSilver · December 17, 2005

I hear they may be bringing back the solid front axle next year...

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I hope not!

Larry · December 17, 2005

I hear they may be bringing back the solid front axle next year...

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I hope not!

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Thank you BlackSilver, your post and signature with a RV towable in the background makes my point perfectly clear. GM is currently only focused on personal use pickups for doing the things you like to do such as Rving. You are probably a boomer or later generation that has a disposable income for a RV and tired of the stiff riding leaf sprung GM 4wd solid axles you delt with 20+ years ago. Absolutely, nothing wrong with that…..you worked hard to earn that truck, trailer and freedom.

My point is, GM could gain much more light truck market share if they offered a truck for everybody’s needs and steer themselves into becoming a more profitable company once again…at least in the light truck sector. Just think if GM would offer both SFA and IFS 4wd trucks to reach out to all of their customer bases and needs….. A 8600 GVWR or greater 4wd truck with IFS targeted towards personal use and the same GVWR truck with SFA that would appeal to the snow plowers, tow truck industry (wreckers), contractors, railroad, GSA, etc, and could potentially steal thousands of sales a year a way from Ford and Dodge. This is the market GM has neglected since 1988. How many late model GM wreckers have you seen lately? Contractor trucks? Railroad? Not many....if any.

GM is fortunate and possesses the absolute best world-class powertrain regardless of gasoline or diesel…..a world-class automatic transmission (Allison 1000 series) so why is it they carry the lowest market share in the commercial light truck market? My feeling is because they only build trucks for people that should be driving cars or only need a truck for yanking an RV towards Branson and leave the commercial truck side of the business to Ford and Dodge that have commercial customers that typically are on a yearly or bi-yearly buying cycles regardless of market conditions and consumer confidence.

Elwood 2000 · December 18, 2005

Larry, I agree with you almost 100%, but I think a SFA truck with the proper suspension set up would ride just as nice as the current set up we have today. I have ridden in the '05 Ford with the coils and the difference between coils and leafs is like night and day. I feel that a softer coil for the RV people and a stiffer (super-duty-type) coil for the working class trucks that you mentioned above would be a very sweet solution, but what do I know, I am not an engineer, but a farmer who USES a truck to help do my job.

silverado3500 · December 19, 2005

Just a semi-random idea that popped into my head:

If they keep "value engineering" in order to cut production costs, they might just go back to a SFA one day. . . just think how much less work is involved to bolt an axle/springs to a truck than installing IFS.

I think GM might get more commercial customers if they sold a 4500 using the regular truck body instead the larger truck cab they sell currently.

Larry · December 19, 2005

Elwood, I agree with you as well. A coil sprung SFA like in the Dodge and late Phords ride nice and would be perfect for 2500 and 3500’s. The coil sprung IFS for the GMT900 will be a much better improvement over torsion bars in the 1500’s

Sil3500, that is a nice thought on the value engineering but I doubt it.

Minimization · December 20, 2005

Elwood, I agree with you as well. A coil sprung SFA like in the Dodge and late Phords ride nice and would be perfect for 2500 and 3500’s. The coil sprung IFS for the GMT900 will be a much better improvement over torsion bars in the 1500’s

Sil3500, that is a nice thought on the value engineering but I doubt it.

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My take:

Put coil IFS on C/K1500/1500HD/2500

put coil SFA on 2500HD/3500

label C/K3500 DRW as "C/K3500HD" (after all it, is up 1500 lb, right?), give it coil SFA too

Use new GMT-900 HD pickup body cabs AND beds (!!) on C/K4500/5500 (like Ford does on the F450/550) instead of medium duty truck body. Allow these to have leaf SFA.

So commercial would go with C/K4500/5500, and recreational towers, small contractors, and die-hard off-roaders would get C/K2500HD/3500/3500HD

daily drivers/moderate off-raoders would get the rest

oh yeah, allow for a Duramax 7800 I-6 option in the C/K4500/5500.