Could It Get Any Worse?

GatorFan · July 17, 2008

Well fellas,

Sorry I have been a ghost these past few weeks but I have been working my behind off and dealing with this house. Speaking of the house, we WERE supposed to close this past Tuesday but now everything has changed.

I got a call from our morgtage lender on Friday and he told me the VA appraiser under-valued the house by $18K so the lender and builder both spent Monday and Tuesday running around trying to appeal this guy's decision. Basically my wife and I had to sit around and wait for the outcome. We also were nearing the end of our apartment lease and we were worried that IF we didn't get the house, we might not have a place to live because they could rent the apartment out from under us. These apartments are ALWAYS full so that was another fear. Anyway, the lender called me late yesterday evening and told me that we could switch over to a FHA loan BUT there were fees involved that were not applicable to the VA loan. Because we would have to pay morgtage insurance, the cost of the house went up as well as our payment (the payment shot up another $200 per month). This would raise the morgtage payment over the personal limit the wife and I agreed we would not cross, so we were stuck with a big decision and only given hours, not days, to make up our mind. We weighed all the options and decided the increased payment wasn't worth the risk and I hate being pressured like that in making a huge decision like this. It really sucks because the wife did an awesome job designing everything but I guess it will be for someone else now. Lucky for us, the apartment was not rented yet so we ran over yesterday right before the office closed and let them know we were staying. This house felt like a damn curse with all the issues we had AND we still will probably lose over $5K in money we dumped in the house. Since we "changed" the house a little, they told us we would probably default our earnest money because the house was not "as per original specs" (what BS). Also, we paid 25% out of pocket for all the upgrades we selected and we may lose that too because prespective buyers may not like the PRO SERIES STAINLESS STEEL APPLIANCES, who doesn't like stainless appliances! That right there told me this builder was not genuine and was treating us like a used car salesman would. Well maybe this is for the better and we are not really counting on getting the money back but if they have a conscience it will be a treat to begin our house fund with $5K.

I am not really that mad..I guess you can call it disappointed. My dad always says, "The best lesson is the bought lesson" and this does ring true.

tobias · July 17, 2008

Holy shit, dude. That's absurd.

Way to stick to your guns. Now you might want to go use one!

geektoad · July 17, 2008

I am not really that mad..I guess you can call it disappointed. My dad always says, "The best lesson is the bought lesson" and this does ring true.

You are a better man than I. I would be seething. Sorry things didn't work out for you.

Darkanion · July 17, 2008

Wow - I'm sorry to hear that, Rob. I know you guys had put a ton of time and energy into that place -- and it wasn't even your's yet. Man! That sucks..!

Spoonman · July 17, 2008

Sorry to here the bad news. Can you request another VA appraiser?

I have heard of this happening to folks trying to refinance lately, their house is not worth as much as it was a year or two ago. People owe more than their house is worth. The housing market is going thru a correction in many parts of the country.

You might be able to renegotiate with the seller, you have an appraisal for actual market value. It is doubtful that the seller will get his price from anyone else, maybe there is some middle ground.

That 25% of upgrade money means that you own 1 of four of those appliances, take what is yours

good luck..........

2000DV4.8 · July 17, 2008

Wow. That really sucks. I would be beyond pissed if I was in your situation...

Darkanion · July 17, 2008

Ok - I just re-read this... I want to make sure I'm reading it right (this time through).

The builder is claiming the house should be worth $x, but the appraiser is saying "no, it's really worth $x - 18k"...? But, the builder won't sell it for that price? If it's the builder who is saying "no way, no how" and won't go through with the deal, it seems to me that you should be getting your money back.. What am I missing here??

svensk · July 17, 2008

I'm in the middle of refinancing and I can tell you the only loans going through right now are FHA loans. Also ran similar issue with the appraiser, we dropped that company went with different one and different appraiser and he came up our house being worth 50,000 more than the first guy.

Jackson · July 17, 2008

I say you start grabbin appliances. now

**** that man. I would definitely be pissed off.

99silveradoz71 · July 18, 2008

That definitely sucks. Glad that you and the wife are disciplined about keeping yourselves comfortable. It'll all come together for you, maybe not right now, but eventually. I ran into issues with 1 bank giving me a ridiculously low estimate of what I could pre-qualify for, so I got discouraged and stopped looking for a while. Then I paid my 99 Silverado off early and started saving and it eventually worked out.

pennzoil29 · July 18, 2008

IMO, what they're doing is a bunch of shit. Housing is at an all time low. You and your wife should be intitled to something back. I can't believe they won't work out a better deal with you. I mean damn, you signed an agreement for a certain price. The only thing hurting you is the fact that you did change the specs a little bit. You know Rob, this might be the man in the sky's way of saving your ass. Look at how fast they built it, and who they used, and the problems you had with them through out the build. I'm glad you're still able to keep the apartment. Good luck.

GatorFan · July 18, 2008

Thanks for the support guys. My wife was pissed until the sales person started playing those annoying little Used Car Salesman games; you know... "Let me talk to my manager...", or "Let me work up the numbers again and I'll call you back..." I did some digging yesterday (had a friend in the realtor realm) and found out that houses in that area are actually around $15-20$K lower than what the builder is listing them for...which means they thought we were gullible because we were new buyers AND they figured they had us because we designed the house...F*CK THAT, I might have been born at night but not last night! The sales person kept calling me all day yesterday and stating they were "working" with the numbers to try and get it down to what was comfortable for us. The last time we talked, I told them to get the monthly payment below $1,900 per month and then we "might" reconsider. I also told them they had until 5:00PM because I was signing the lease on my apartment at that time so the clock was ticking. Well, she called me about 4:50PM and said they were still "working" the numbers and she asked her "manager" to buy down the interest rate so the payments would be around $1,920 per month. I told her she had 10 minutes to make the payment like I said earlier...BELOW $1,900 because when we first signed the deal the payment was around $1,860 per month with the VA. Since the VA under-appraised the amount by $18K, the only other way I would deal with them would be for them to pay the $18K difference or lower the price of the house so I could still use my God-Given right VA loan. I did not want the FHA loan because of all the damn fees associated with that loan.

All in all, they didn't meet the deadline so the deal is off. I really feel a lot better knowing that I was not taken advantage of and my wife and I both agreed there are more houses out there. Yeah it sucks because we designed a house that someone else will live in BUT they will be screwed in the deal not me!

Anyway, I wil find out today whether or not we get all of our money back. I am really not counting on the earnest money because we did change the house (took out the fireplace to make the living room bigger) BUT that was when we knew we were getting the house through VA. On the other hand, if I don't get my money back for those upgrades, I might be a little on the pissed-off side! I told the sales person last night that if they can get an appraisal for the house at $274K, then they can easily sell it to someone else. What I am guessing is they are pissed because their USED CAR SALESMAN tactics didn't work so now they will pay taxes on that house until they sell it, so they will try to worm their way out of my $3,300 upgrade money. The only option I will have is if I take them to court for the amount but that will end up costing me a shit-load more than the $3,300 so they know I will write it off.

I did find the tax assessors website for that county AND the neighborhood and most of the houses in that area were all sold for around $245K so I feel good about not taking the deal. If it costs me my $$$ to learn this lesson then so be it. It will suck, I mean really SUCK!!!!!! but it seems that is the way of the world now days. Just look at the gas prices and that should be enough of an example. Jeff, I think you're right, the Man Upstairs is looking out for me. That is the only thing that would explain these events. I even told the salesperson who was I to trust; the appraiser from the VA who doesn't know me or is not associated with the builder in any way or the "other" appraiser who is friends with the morgtage lender and has worked with the builder in the past...GEE, that one is easy. I still say the VA is good about helping out VETS. My friend also told me most people/builders don't like to deal with the VA because they are harsh when apprasing homes. Good for them! I'm proud to be represented by those guys... Thanks again guys for being with us since I made that first post about the house. At least Jeff (VMAX2007) did tell me the best way to prep and paint the garage floor. I can use that when we do finally get a house.

Looks like I am on the market for another home. My wife and I are actually considering buying some software and designing our own home. This software even calculates the materials and costs AND prints out valid blueprints. We have nothing but time and are putting back money this time so we are better prepared. Lesson Learned...Get a Realtor first before seriously looking for a home.

kutu · July 18, 2008

I don't think that you will have to spend a lot of money to get all your money back. I believe there is a Gerogia Real Estate board option and "small claims court" obtion. Advice from a real estate attoney, or even a friendly, non-involved, real estate agent might be helpful.

Don't give up it's your money!

the hammer · July 18, 2008

Even though I am a Nole, I will not nail you to the board on this one and no Gator jokes.

Instead, I agree that unless there were specific written agreements regarding your pre-purchase monies spent toward the amenities you and your wife paid to change, then you need to get it back. If the builder changed it, without clausing to you that you could not recoup the money upon a no sale situation, then it is yours and they need to give it to you. You paid for it, it is yours.

Basically, if they changed the design to better sell the house, they would pay for it anyway if there was no buyer to begin with. I say it is their mistake for changing a property prior to sale. That was just stupid on their part.

But you have to remember that they will look at it from the other perspective, as you have paid them money and they did work. Yet, you have no product that is your own, therefore what did you pay for? You paid for changes on a home that is not yours and you do not own? That is crazy. Get your money back or the products you bought.

Small Claims court is the way to go. And definitely consult the Realtors Association in GA. Don't get taken advantage of.

Jackson · July 18, 2008

I did find the tax assessors website for that county AND the neighborhood and most of the houses in that area were all sold for around $245K so I feel good about not taking the deal. If

Tax accessor websites do not list the sale price of the home to my knowledge they list the tax appraisal which is ALWAYS much less than the sale price. that's so property taxes aren't gouging the tax payer.

we have that in our county to and you can look up anyone's home to see what the tax appraisal is...........however the purchase price will never be listed.