New Car and Driver

[PaulSter]

Ouch-- did you see the comparo of all the full-size crew cab trucks in the latest Car and Driver? Our beloved Chevy came in a distant last place. The others from 2-4 were only a point apart.

 

1. Nissan Titan 187pts

2. Ford F150 180pts

3. Dodge Ram 179pts

4. Toyota Tundra 178 pts

5. Chevy 1500 LD 164 pts

 

Oh well, I still dig my truck! I'm also confident that GM has big plans in store for the next-gen full-size trucks. It reminds me of leap frog. Remember before the latest Dodge Rams came out? The Rams were riding high for a few years when their new, radical at the time, big-rig body style came out, then after a few years were left at the back of the pack when they kept the truck unchanged and outdated for so long.

 

Whoever is last to the party knows what the others are doing and knows exactly what how high they need to raise the bar. I'm confident that it will be GM's turn to take the lead spot again with the next gens.

 

PaulS

[01BlackZ71]

When is the next redesign going to come out? And I don't mean like a 02-03 cosmetic type of change, more like a 98-99 complete change.

[gave20]

They should send a pair of rubber boots along with every issue for all the crap they spew onto the pages. I just read the Oct Motor trend article comparing the RC Hemi 2WD to the SS, SS beat the Hemi in everything but the slalom in which it was a second slow. Then when it came time to choose MT picks the Ram hands down because of $$ and agility as the SS was to slow ( by 1 second), of course they forgot to mention rack and pinion will always out perform a steering box. These writer play to the uninformed who actually do their research from these articles, I know the next Lamborgini I buy I will research MT and Car and driver for an indepth look so why write about it? I get so sick and tired about how well designed the Titan, Ford and the Ram's interiors are when in actuality they are two dimensional pictures. A cars interior needs depth and character like that of GM in the dash and consoles but also in the seating, Dodge doesn't even offer captains chairs. So next time do your self a favor and don't even pick up the magazine.

[ToeJam]

I can't wait for the article now....

 

But it does already smell.... The crew cab on the Dodge is tiny. It feels about as big as my extended cab.

 

It is all about the "leap frog" syndrom however...and Car and Driver are pretty open about how they like "Cars" not trucks.

[PaulSter]

I can't wait for the article now....

 

But it does already smell.... The crew cab on the Dodge is tiny.  It feels about as big as my extended cab.

 

It is all about the "leap frog" syndrom however...and Car and Driver are pretty open about how they like "Cars" not trucks.

Here's more from another forum:

_______________________________________________________

Originally posted by 1badgmc

Yeah, I read it. I don't take much heart in their truck comparos. C&D is my favorite magazine, but they're not truck guys. They only test 4x4 trucks too. Sometimes they seem to forget that not everyone buys a 4x4 when they buy a truck. Everytime they compare trucks they come in in a different order. Like you said, it's all about the new guy with truck comparos. The new guy almost always wins with the old guy bringing up the rear. When they test the new Silverados in a few years, Chevy will kick everyone's butt. That's just how it goes. I'm still loyal to GM and will remain that way no matter what any mag says.

 

****NOW MY REPLY TO THE ABOVE POST***

 

I agree. In fact, did you notice the payload capacities? The Chevy's was 2780#, while everyone else's was between 1300-1600#. Over a thousand pounds more payload and they don't mention a word about it??? Granted, the Chevy's tow rating is 7900# (about the same as the Dodge) while the Titan and Ford are over 9000#.

 

Some of the other things are totally subjective too. I've always found the seats in my truck, as in Tahoes, 'burbs, etc, to be some of the most comfortable seats I've ever sat it. They slagged the dash too. I have always felt that the GM trucks have had the best designed dashes of all of them. I really like how they angle toward the driver. With the center console, you feel more like you're in a cockpit which I really like in a large truck. Anyway--those things are totally subjective and really don't mean much.

 

PaulS

_____________________________________________________

Whatever the case-- I do agree that GM has the oldest iron in that test and we're due for a juicy updating of the platform. In light of that, you would have to pull my truck keys from my cold, dead hands as opposed to getting me into any of those other "trucks"

 

PaulS

[Red2500HD]

How about GMC truck owners. were any of them poled or are their #'s included in Chevy"s?

 

It seems that the pole might be incomplete.

[tmf6902]

I guess I could care less, because I love my truck and I could really care less what anyone else thinks of it

[Bruce03Silverado]

I guess I could care less, because I love my truck and I could really care less what anyone else thinks of it

Agree there and you have to consider the source.....they might as well have had Consumer Reports do the test...don't care what anyone says...I love my Chevy and no matter what the magazines say the sales numbers of foreign trucks will never hit the numbers of the big 3...one thing i have learned is that the big 3 truck owners are some of the most loyal to their brand of any vehicle out there and that is something nissan or toyota will never have to the extent that we do

[MCourson]

Lets see them do at 100 or 200k miles test, lets see whos on top then.

 

I dont believe the crap they shovel out.

 

The Titan is up top because it is new.

[PaulSter]

How about GMC truck owners. were any of them poled or are their #'s included in Chevy"s?

 

It seems that the pole might be incomplete.

"Poll"? What poll? The article had nothing to do with owners.

 

PaulS

[JayMan]

 

Geez, here we go again.

 

Another "informed" test involving slalom, 0-60, etc. Just the "proper" test for a pickup. I read a C&D once and a Motor Trend a couple of times. Those magazines stink if you're upwind of them!

 

About the only thing consistently worse is Consumer Reports or "We hate all domestic-made vehicles and domestic-based companies and will automatically recommend a foreign company and a foreign car. Oh, and we won't tell you about the $1,300 you'll have to cough up at 60,000 miles to replace the timing belt, adjust the valves using special one-time-use shims, and replace the leaking water pump. And we'll also completely ignore all the junk 3.0 V6's Toyota will make that will blow head gaskets and leave you stranded somewhere. Cuz we're smarter than you are and we know best."

 

Based on Consumer Reports, I bought my 1990 Toyota 4Runner and my 1992 Honda Prelude. Nuff said on that disaster! I think ImportHater can relate!

 

Most of these yuppy larvae are spoiled rich kids who automatically poo-poo a "working man's" (Translation: poor man who has to work for a living like 90% of us folks do) truck or anything associated with it. Quite frankly, they can take their opinion and shove it up their a**.

 

If I want a good report on what a truck is capable of doing, I'll read Trailer Life. I've said it before: fill those pickup beds right up to the top with Ash or Poplar green firewood and see how they accelerate and handle then. Or hitch up identical heavy trailers and see how the trucks handle them with respect to stability, cooling systems, etc.

 

A Nissan Titan as a serious tow vehicle or work truck. Yeah, right. Well, maybe on Hollywood Blvd in LA. Not here in BFE.

 

Regarding tow ratings, was the Heavy Half running 3.73's or 4.10's? With 4.10's, tow ratings should be at least 10,000 lb on the receiver or 5th. Payload is also very important and considering the Titan has a MUCH lower payload # than the Chevy CC, how can it be stable towing a heavy trailer??

 

This really pushed my buttons! What bull****!

[MoJo]

It's like Motor Turd's evaluation of the Chev/GMC 2004 trucks. They referred to the numerous storage spaces as "parts bins". But, look at their review of the VW Turdedge, they call the same sort of storage compartments "handy cubbies"! What a crock! Can't the average reader of these 2 crap spreading rags see the bias they have for "You're-a-peein' and 'Japo'" stuff? The real joke is the Tundra!

[Chris97K1500]

I think almost all comparisons done by "independent" people are a joke. The best way to find what you like, go drive all the ones you are considering. At least then you'll know what you are getting from personal experience, not someone else's. And on another note, that Titan is hideous looking . Looks like a Frontier on steroids, and who cares how wide the door opens! I'm lucky to get the 3rd door open with as small as all the parking spots are, much less swing all the way back! I don't know how they are selling in general, but around here I've only seen one, it's been sitting on the dealer's lot for at least a month if not longer. What happened to the Titan being the beginning of the end for the big 3??? Chris

[MCourson]

Oh, and we won't tell you about the $1,300 you'll have to cough up at 60,000 miles to replace the timing belt, adjust the valves using special one-time-use shims, and replace the leaking water pump. And we'll also completely ignore all the junk 3.0 V6's Toyota will make that will blow head gaskets and leave you stranded somewhere. Cuz we're smarter than you are and we know best.

Been there, done that......the hard way.

 

Toyota - "The head gasket blew because YOU used the wrong antifreeze"

 

Oh yea, wrong antfreeze, and its our fault, ESPECIALLY since the thing had 20,000 miles on it.

 

In the end at least they ate it.

[PaulSter]

It's like Motor Turd's evaluation of the Chev/GMC 2004 trucks. They referred to the numerous storage spaces as "parts bins". But, look at their review of the VW Turdedge, they call the same sort of storage compartments "handy cubbies"! What a crock! Can't the average reader of these 2 crap spreading rags see the bias they have for "You're-a-peein' and 'Japo'" stuff? The real joke is the Tundra!

Well-- that stuff is definitely true and I'm no fan of MT either. I like Car and Driver--but not for forming opinions of the cars they test, but just to see what new stuff is out there, what's coming out and things like that.

 

Something else about CD-- you can often see vast differences of opinion when you read the sidebars of what each tester thinks. I can usually find a tester with opinions that match my way of thinking. It's not uncommon to have one tester love the vehicle and another one despise it. I like when that happens and they give a hard time to the curmudgeons on the staff.

 

As far as MT's concerned, though I don't like that rag, in fairness, they don't always choose imports over U.S.

 

Motor Trend® Names F-150 2004 Truck of the Year.

 

BUT-- I think Consumer Reports is the worst offender of all. I wonder if they just wait for all the cars to come in, then automatically choose the Toyota first, put the U.S. cars at the bottom, then mix the rest in the middle somewhere.

 

I also laugh at their comments on something purpose-built like the Vette.

"We found the low sill height made getting ingress and egress difficult and we don't like that. We found the ride was very rough and the slightest input on the round object in our hands made the car move wildly. Then the slightest pressure on the pedal to the far right made our back depress into the seats too hard. We don't like that. We found the sounds coming from that compartment in front of the windshield and from those round hollow objects at the rear of the car to be unpleasant and frightening."

 

They're a bunch of nerds who need a hard kick in the ass and need to grow some cajones so that they can understand that not everything about the worthiness of a vehicle can be "measuring" with a meter, ruler, protractor, computer, etc.

 

PaulS