Grumpy Bear

Is that too simple or what?

Call Mark Johnson at IPSCO.org upper hose inline thermostat housing. Gut factory housing. Do not block or remove return hose to tank. It keeps the pump happy. Drill bleed hole in flange .0625 to .0781. This is not to make it cooler but to provide some water movement past the min flow bypass in the stock housing to give the wax pill something to work with. Stant Supersant 160 F Part # 45356 Requires some tuning. Mainly used on boosted motors. Not really a street item otherwise. Reische 170 F Part # NB54 I expect this is the Dayco part. a $10 part Imported from Australia with silly shipping charges. Dayco 170 F Part # DT14E Both Dayco and Reische are over $50 this side of the world. Stant Superstat 180 F Part # 45358 My favorite. Removes 20 to 30 F from the system, Very ECU friendly. Stant OE Type 195 F Part # 13359 Could also use the factory housing and GM # 12674634 actually 197 F. Stant OE Type 205 F Part # 13352. A choice if you swap thermostats with the seasons.... Flepro #35710 Seal required and supplied with one of the Stant thermostats of your choice by IPSCO. After three gasket failures from OEM type replacements, JET, Summit, Mishimoto, etc I quit. Whipple has a 160 F all brass gasketless for the stock housing for boosted motors. I do not have a part number for that one. Great idea that needs a few more choices. The fancy machine work is not standard. Mark did this at my request. Clip from my build thread: pg 24: [First outing today 184-186 F water. 153-163 F transmission. 204 - 210 F engine oil. 82 - 87 F air temperature. 60% humidity. 55 - 60 mph. 12 - 15 mph wind on my 12 then on my 6 round trip.] Trans is thermostat delete.

Jon A, You ever finish collecting the 160 F trans stat heat profile? Would love to see it.

Line-X dealer that did the undercoat and bed liner was suppose to do the rustproof as well. He got his $400 for that part of the job but when the tail gate panel and a door panel and front fender inner panel were examined...not a drop of anything, anywhere.... You can't even pay people to work anymore. Sadly this is all to common.

Good to know, I'll stay up hill and up wind. BTW, which way is it flowing in this thread?

Oh man, I thought the title of this thread was....Catch Can Septic. My eyes are getting bad.

See updated Blackstone Universal Average labs below

Thank you. Photo's like this are useful to everyone.

The gasket on the OEM works okay but the JET tossed gaskets like a ticker tape parade. Glad someone figured it out. Thanks Jason!

The thermostat hasn't a gasket? How does it seal?

Photo please of the stop 'after' sitting on the ground like you did the before please.

Tire Pressure Note Being anal about tire pressures I've noticed something about Pepper I have no explanation for, just an observation. Having a very nice tire gauge I can measure a fly fart in a windstorm. For quite some time I've thought the unusual reading in right front pressure displayed on the DIC was some fluke in the program as no matter what tire I put in that position during rotation the warm pressure eventually reads a pound higher than the others even though they are set meticulously cold. Then the other day we had a day that was roughly 30* warmer than average and after a short time driving and noticing the ride was awful I scrolled to the TPMS page to see pressures hot were over 40 psi. As much as I hate to adjust pressure hot but knowing that they, with this tire and on this truck, run about 2 psi over cold I reset them to 37 and left the screen up and drove another half hour. Left front rose another pound so I rechecked them all and it was what it was. Reset the right front back down to 37 where it remained with all others at that setting the rest of the day. This morning Rex waking up earlier than the chickens I wondered out to get a cold reading expecting them to be all over the map. What I found was the right front 1/2 pound lower that the other three which were even. On the DIC they all read the same so there is some rounding error in that position but by gauge reading that position is generating more heat that the other three. Enough to require a half pound adjustment cold to get even pressures hot. Just can't explain it. Yes alignment is good. Weight? My chunky and a gas tank on the drivers side? More caster and less camber in this position by a quarter degree each. If weight then why is it not affecting the right rear as well? Rake? Weight distribution? Road Crown? It isn't hurting anything just a curiosity. An itch in need of a scratch. Rear axle notes It will be early next week before I get together with Ben to order parts and acquire lead times. After repeated emails to Red Line I have the lubrication issues handled. There were more choices than I imagined and that need resolution before I lay down project money of this sort. I will also be adding a new diff cover to the list. PLM or B&M alloy.

Why thank you Stan. I learned restraint the hard way. Took me about 6 gearboxes one summer when I was young dumb and broke to find that cord between my right foot and my pocketbook and to cut it. Walking stunk but eating was nice.

You are right. That is not as uncommon as most people think. But it does have it's limit. I've run enough miles in fifth gear tow mode M6 at 55 to know that the equivalent 4.10 gear the creates cost me about 10% in fuel. Even thought the AFM in that case in on nearly always. Currently the other changes I've made have increased the use of the AFM allot and part of the reason she does so well in open country. I'm looking to maintain the current duty cycle while increasing the severity of conditions it will maintain it under. I.E. take a bit more head wind before dropping out. Climb a bit steeper hill before kicking back a gear. Thinking tac hammer not sledge hammer. Honestly, if yesterdays outing would have showed me a bit more oil pressure at WOT Red Line I'd go 3.73 and change project direction entirely but having access to such leverage and not feeling comfortable using it would be an itch that sooner or later I would be compelled to scratch with no good outcome. The gear spacing v the engines torque/hp spread would have me increasing the red line to cover the spread. She hasn't enough to cover the current shift rpm. IMHO. It bothers me enough I will be looking into that. On the tires. We have Conti Contacts on the wife's Buick and I am impressed. They both share the same tread pattern too. Crazy.

This is VERY useful. The OEM tires on her at 31.1" tall. I will be needing tires sooner than later and was curious how stacking changes would effect her. I know you've tired a number of combinations and haver first hand knowledge. To that end...I have made a choice then. 3.42 PLUS a set of Continental Cross Contact LX-20 in 255/65R-17 that are one inch shorter and weight the same as the Duelers. Lower inertia moment a plus. That gives an effective ration of 3.53 and fills the hole between the 3.42 and 3.73's I've been waffling over. A 9.4% increase! Your tire example worked out to 7% (effective ratio 3.66) and if you felt that was huge I'm sure I will not be disappointed. Again....THANKS!!! Look at that, two choices in one day.

Yeeeeeeeeesssssssssss?

Took Pepper for a hard walk today. Something I rarely do. Warmer her up, reset the data recorder and laid her ears back for two gears. Shift point 5443 RPM. Maximum oil pressure 50 psi. Oil temp 201 F. Peak TPS position 83%. MAP 14.3. BAR 14.3. Ergo more blade isn't more flow. While the recorder shows 50 psi peak the dash gauge is pegged past 80 psi. Smart guy would set the WOT shift point back a few hundred rpm, eh? There's nothing there above 5K anyway. Got my first real good taste of torque management. Pulls timing like crazy during the shift. While I see it's upside it does feel odd. Sounds odd too. Like a turbo on spool up. So why did I do this? I wanted to know what sort of motor I have. Oil volume is set by the pump but oil pressure is at the mercy of internal clearances. Apparently mine are generous assuming GM is still living by the 10 pounds per thousand rpm rule. I also learned that despite having 6 forward gears the ratio gaps are still wider than the spread between peak torque and peak horsepower. That is disappointing for a VVT motor and even more disappointing given the fact that GM could choose any set of ratios they liked. It is definitely built with economy of operation in mind. Bottom line, she's not what I would call a scrapper. I'd think differently if she would have shown me 60 psi oil pressure. So much for a 4.10 gear. 3.73, 3.42 and 3.23 are still on the table. Pretty reliable rumor has it that there are some Engineers at Eaton using synthetics in their Trutrac diff's. I also see that Diablo has some tuners now for the new 4.3's.

Talk about a rapid response team. Eaton Performance (Eaton Performance Support) Mar 18, 17:04 ADT Hello Marty, Thank you for your inquiry. Regarding the Detroit Truetrac differential: A quality petroleum GL5 rated (mineral) based oil is recommended. Synthetic oils may also be used if desired per axle manufacturer’s recommendations. Friction modifiers should not be used however, as they will decrease overall performance (reduce differential bias). As far as oil weight and quantity, please consult your vehicle's owner's manual. We do not recommend any specific brand. Thanks! -Eaton Performance Support ********************************************************************************************************************** Marty, There isn’t a technical reason that a friction modified synthetic gear oil can’t be used with a Truetrac as it’s operation doesn’t rely on friction so isn’t affected by the slipperiness of the fluid. I am unsure why Eaton includes this statement. Regards, Dave P: (+1) 707.751.2914 | O: (+1) 707.745.6100 | 6100 Egret Ct | Benicia, CA 94510 Red Line Synthetic Oil ************************************************************************************************************************************ Full synthetic oil simply increases the torque bias a bit in the TrueTrac, in my opinion it is well worth the extended service life with synthetic oil. Ben Brazda Filthy Motorsports 720-545-2279 ***************************************************************************************************** I did receive conformation that Phillips has discontinued Red Line 75W90NS Gear oil. It has been my go to for the primary case for the Electra Glide. Would have been my go to for this project as well. I thought something fishy. My understanding of worm gears is that while you can rotate the worm gear by worm, it is usually not possible to rotate worm by using the worm gear. Sort of defeats the purpose of their use otherwise. Great I can use what I like and I like Esters for this service.

Second round of emails to Ben and now Red Line and Eaton. After visiting the Eaton site I have more questions than answers on carrier break, bearing selection and lubrication that will need answers before I plunk down this much money on an optional modification. Happy to do it however. I love to learn and doing in depth research on my projects is my prime tool. From the first round of talks I learned that industry wide around 200K is considered average service life for the average diff that is not equipped with a clutches. More to do with seal and the 10K bearing life that ring a pinion, spider gear wear. Learned the reasons deeper gears tend to use more power. Hypoid gears that is, not gears in general. Learned that the average OEM fit and finish will provide a energy transfer efficiency between 92 and 96 percent. As diff life is more about bearing life than gear life, things like shot peening or cryogenic services would be of benefit only if you intend to abuse the unit regularly. That might mean heavy towing if that state is the majority of the machines service duty cycle. Just thought that interesting. That items like 'super finishing gear teeth and deburring and back lapping can provide measurable decreases in operating temperatures and quitter running, which can also be accomplished with some synthetic lubricants but without the added frictional drag of same. With the added benefit of lower initial debris accumulation during the bedding in process. Improves chances of reaching the 10K bearing life numbers under 'average' service. Lastly the Eaton Trutrac is the most versatile diff available. That they can be used in both ends of a 4WD system and about the only thing they don't excel at is Rock Crawling. Seems they don't care to have one wheel completely off the ground. Lastly and most concerning to me it that Eaton recommends that the Trutrac no be lubricated with ANY NON-MINERAL BASED or LS ADDITIVE added synthetic. The latter I understand. It doesn't work by use of clutches. Yes is a fiction driven system employing worm and worm wheels but I personally can't imagine that a Synthetic fluid could reduce friction to the point to render two gears whose teeth intersect at a 45* angle ineffective. It's just an opinion and mine might be wrong so I will leave this one to the experts thus my queries to Phillips and Eaton.

So Ben (Filthy Motorsports) has been swamped. It's race season. I should do these projects earlier in the winter, right? Anyway I got his first response back on some questions I had asked about some gear services: magnafluxing, cryogenics, shot peening, micro-polishing, deburring and base grinding. Crown Gear has some extensive services that can quadruple the cost of the gear and carrier. Crazy right? I'd just like to decide on the ratio....waiting on financing. Which means getting and cashing a check. Retirement account. So, in the mean time I took the Scan Gauge II from the Buick and installed it into the Honda. Also changed headlamp bulbs in the Honda for Silver Star Halogen. I like to learn from all my children. 2006 Civic 1.8 comes from the factory with a 180 F thermostat STILL. Closing in on a quarter million miles on that one. All the sudden the 180 Stat in the truck doesn't seem so extreme. This car gets about 38 mpg summer and 32 winter. I had 'eyes' on the ECU or all of 10 minutes and found the 'sweet spot' 200 miles into this tank and over 45 mpg making turns for 2,000 rpm. Love this tool. Nasty weather doing it too. Great bulb and great improvement too but I still need lamp assemblies. SO a little story. Had the shop source some headlamp assemblies for the Honda. Quoted $125 each. You have to take the bumper cover and grill out to do this job. Had the nose off the car and......wrong lamps. Right lamps are $250 each????? I say button her up and pay $80 for the R&R. Then spend 5 minutes on the internet and fine the right lamps with a replacement bumper cover for $250 total. Honda wants $1,000 for the bumper cover alone. I google a MOOG sway bar end kit for Pepper. Get prices for the same name brand part from $7 to $45. Moral of the story is??????????????????????????????????? I use to put head lamps in my 65 Ford for $3 from Kmart. Quad 5" rounds. They worked better too and never EVER yellowed. NAPA, O'Reilly's, AutoZone, Car Quest, all in the $230 to $260 range for the Honda lamps. Auto Anything, Rock Auto half that price or less. Local shops use local vendors. I'm not paying a 150% plus markup for a store front and have struck a deal with my mechanic. Most of these guys don't install parts your bring yourself but John see's how stupid this is. I bring what I bring, show an invoice and he charges labor and I give him a percentage of the parts cost. Just like he would get if he bought local. We both win.

No argument their. However that, as you mention, is a tuning issue and not a mechanical flaw. These things are programed to hold a gear till the cows come home if GM thinks that it will cough up a tenth of an MPG. They all do that and Black Bear or similar is the cure for that ill. Mine improved with age. They are constantly learning and adapting. It does a few things I'd like to see some improvement in or just modify but overall. I really REALLY like my six speed.

That's a very specific set of circumstances and driver reactions don't you think? "Doctor, it hurts when I do this". Doc says, "Don't do that"! Seriously I have one small hill coming into Monroe Illinois where the speed limit changes from 55 to 40. If I cancel the cruise control as I reach the change of speed limit warning sign 500 feet earlier and coast to 40 it will reach the very base of this 2% hill exactly as I hit the cruise button again. Timed like that it will still be in AFM and just above the down shift point leaving it a gear to tall to pull the hill with the AFM active. The response I suppose is what most here call the 'shutter'. So....I don't do that. Coast to 39, tap the cruise and give the up button one click up to 40, it drops a gear smartly....smooth a silk, and the only place within 500 miles of home it has ever done it but I can make it do it every time. I can also avoid it every time. I don't see this as a GM screwed up and needs to buy my truck back issue. The AFM doesn't 'cause a shutter'. Being in a gear to tall for the power on hand for the task? Just like starting up a hill from a dead stop with a manual four speed in third gear and it getting Silly Willy isn't a design flaw. It's an operator error. GM can tighten every loose nut in a truck except the one behind the wheel. (C'mon man, where's your sense of humor)

Your is more detailed than mine. I must be getting lazy. On another note: K2** sway bars in order of roll stiffness: 1.) 34 mm / 1.339” (1.73) 1.0 X stiffer GM RPO Z85 2.) 36 mm / 1.417” (2.08) 1.2 X stiffer GM RPO Z71 3.) 35 mm / 1.375” (3.57) 2.1 X stiffer ADDCO/Belltech 4.) 38 mm / 1.500” (5.06) 2.9 X stiffer Hellwig Bold type is the actual diameter. Bars 1 is a tubular bar with a 6 mm wall, while 3 & 4 are solid. Bar #2 I’ve assumed a common 6 mm wall. Number in parentheses is a stiffness ‘factor’ based on the fourth power of diameter. It is not an actual torsional rate. Tubular bar values are compound. Bar diameter value minus bar bore diameter value. A little goes a long way. For solid bars an exact 26% increase in the bars circumference will double roll stiffness. Tubular bars are a bit more complicated as wall thickness my vary for the same diameter across different manufactures. You can only compare bars of like materials and like geometry. Steel v steel and so on. A 1.25 bar for a Camaro cannot be compared to a Mustang bar of like diameter.

85,000 Mile Service Oil change. Quaker State 5W30 and WIX XP filter. Yes back to 5W30. Wife drives like she has a fire to put out so wasting the fuel efficiency efforts. She's better served with more protection. This thing needs a bath bad. Bought over a case of ZECOL -35 F windshield wash/deicer. Evacuated system and refilled. Actually did this between services during last two day warm spell that let the system thaw. I had that 'talk' and it went well. Good. Tires at 5/32" and very even. Working well yet in snow, wet and dry. I'll keep going. Rotated. Bead leak seems fixed.

Last night I created a spread sheet from this thread to create a service log. A record to be kept with the truck. It includes: Routine service. Modifications & Enhancements. Damage. Repairs. Recalls.