99 Suburban Will Not Start - Factory Alarm Problem

[sierradenali11]

hello all,

 

we have a 1999 chevy suburban in the family (original owners), about 185K. for a period of time we had problems that it would not want to start in the mornings, particulary on rainy, damp days. happened once in a blue moon so we tolerated it. then one day it would not start at all and the security light was lit on the cluster. but it would start up here and there, but also starnding me a few times. stored factory code was "vehicle alarm". it has the factory key fob with an unlock/lock typical factory thing. the dealer did add on an alarm to the factory system with the original key fobs. so i end up replace the harness that runs inside the steering column all the way up by where the ignition cylinder is. apparently there is this ring that is part of the harness that goes around the ignition key, now the funny thing is that the ignition key des not have a transponder in it - i am 110% sure of this. now i was told by the parts counter guy that if the ring that goes around the ignition cylinder get damaged when someone attempts to start/steal the vehicle by messing/or slapping out the ignition cylinder it sends a signal to the computer to not allow the engine to start- the security light will come on or even flash.

 

 

so i replaced it and it was all good for quite some time, until a month ago when dad got up and proceeded to go to work at 5am with the car not starting. now im getting the code again "vehicle alarm". further investigating shows that the wires (according to the codes are not getting/or are not at the proper resistance. now i now many years ago when everyone would get aftermarket alarms, the installers would cut the starting wires leading from the steering column and connect them with the alarm module, problem was though that many times the installer would just tape the wires back together and over a period of time they would loosen or fall out of place and that would be an electric/resisitance issue.

 

 

 

i have a family member that has a shop and is pretty savvy with stuff like this. he hasa friend with a tech II and he suggests that he connects into it and permanantly bypasses the alarm alltogether so that we wount have this problem again. i will keep you posted. thanks

 

p.s. when i had put the new narness in the column with the ring around the ignition cylinder, i had found out that the ignition needed programming, from this site and a few others i read that you have to turn on the ignition for 10 minutes at a time while the security light flashes, and this has to be done 3 TIMES!!!, so a total of 30 minutes. my friend from the dealer with his tech II said this is true but is has to be done with the tech II, because the computer has to be reset by the tech II, for a total of 600 seconds each time, 3 times, and thats what cured the problem the first time. now my friend with the tech II is away and im going to have to wait till next week - tune in folks for this soap opera drama

[sierradenali11]

so i think our saga has come to an end. we brought it to a "a guy" that my family recommended (they have a shop). seems this problem of a no start is pretty common. after all the trials and tribulations, we had this guy do some special programming. he bypassed the factory alarm, also known as PASS KEY II. in the 80's and the early 90's you may remember that gm cars were widely susceptable to being stolen by "columnizing", where they would take a screwdriver and crack off the left side of the steering column by the tilt wheel lever, pop out a plastic half circle gear and then pull back on the teeth of the metal slider toward the inside and the car would start. GM's response to this problem was PASS KEY, or VATS (vehicle anti theft system), and then PASS KEY II. Even with these new measures in place, it helped reduce car theft significantly. PASS KEY I had a pellet chip or a resistor (with one of 15 values) on the ignition key and there was wiring in the actual ignition cylinder, which had a wiring harness lead from the steering column to a little black box buried somewhere deep in the dash board.

PASS KEY II, to further combat the theft problem, because some guys figured out a few ways of bypassing it (by having a blank key and a black box that matched - 1 out of 15 - and would plug their box in and insert ket blank into ignition to read the proper resistance - or code - and then would be able to trick the computer into starting the car - theyd still have to columnize it though.

 

So what GM came up with was PASS KEY II, where as it would have no pellet or chip in the key, but rather contain the entire system in the steering column. take for instance the chevy's - p/u's, suburban, vans, etc, all with the newer squarish or rectangular steering column head. the anti theft system would be completely encased into the column, with a harness (only one because everything was integrated) and on that harness would be this wire that stuck out from the body of the harness with a ring, or an "O" which fit around the ignition cylinder. with that there was also the key ignition cylinder with a resistor inside of it. now the idea was that if anybody would try to slap out the key ignition cylinder with a dent puller, or jamming a huge screwdriver into it and prying/forcing it to turn forward to turn on, anything that slightly moved out of place would trigger the factory alarm "security light" and throw the car into the help im being stolen mode, which would cut the pulse of the fuel supply. now through normal troubleshooting of a vehicle when its not starting, you check for battery power, if the engine is turning, spark, fuel supply (which is all there), and all this can literally drive a mechanic to the brink of insanity. i can imagine how many countless people have gone ahead and changed fuel pumps and still no results. this is a very tricky problem that we're facing with theses cars now for several reason - the cars last alot longer than they used to, and with all the bumps, banging, rattling, shaking from over the years (our suburban has 190k on it but its driven everyday over the nyc crappy roads which will beat up a car - no matter what type - because there are smoother roads in afghanistan and iraq) but the vehicle gets beat up over the years. all thats shaking and moving eventually starts to move things around on the inside,and when things are meant to be in a perfect harmonious balance, it doesnt help.

 

so this guy bypassed the entire PASS KEY II system, he had a tech II and several other computers, looked like the car was getting put on the surgery table or something. vehicles exported outside the country dont have the pass key system, so he used that program, reflashed the computer, and now we have a suburban that starts and does not drive us insane. he charged a pretty penny for it, but when you consider the alternative, which is how a dealer would take it on, they would have to install a new cylinder, harness, programming fee, labor, youre definitley looking at over 1000, if not more id say, and you know the dealer mantra - that may not even fully cure the problem.

 

so anyone with a no start problem, but the engine turns, and you have fuel pressure, spark, good battery, this is definitly worth looking into - i think

[thegeniusguy]

wow...what a drama...now i know why the GM cars dont have a transporter in them like ford.

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On a 99, it didn't have a pellet, instead the code was stored inside the ign. switch. Which made them really easy to steal, all you had to do was pick and insert a blank key(cut all the way down), and start. And no, it costs no where near a grand for the dealer to fix it. It actually can be bypassed really easy with a couple of radio shack resistors.

 

And also, in 07 they started using transponders like ford, they're much more reliable.

[sierradenali11]

On a 99, it didn't have a pellet, instead the code was stored inside the ign. switch. Which made them really easy to steal, all you had to do was pick and insert a blank key(cut all the way down), and start. And no, it costs no where near a grand for the dealer to fix it. It actually can be bypassed really easy with a couple of radio shack resistors.

 

And also, in 07 they started using transponders like ford, they're much more reliable.

 

 

yes, thats what i said, there was no pellet key on the suburbans, and i remember here in new york with the stolen vehicle scene, very few tahoes, suburbans were ever stolen. now to do the radio shack resistors, that means opening up everything down to the circuit board, and having to solder very precisley, but what value resistors and where would you solder them to? my way with the computer bypass (i think) is better because nothing has to be opened up, messed with, any soldering coming loose from bad roads, potholes, time, etc.

 

 

the harness inside the column leading up to ignition switch - 240, the ingition cylinder itself - 350, labor @105 per hour, say 3 hours (at least), and programming, by the dealer. you do the math, and then the possibility of it going haywirre after a while down the road ...... no thank you

[mazdog93]

I am having the same problems as described, truck is pretty reliable most of the time, it is a 99 chevy old body style with the 5.7 vortec, then today for instance it is wet and humid and it will not start. It turns over and starts for a second then dies back out, it has done this many times and now that i think about it it has been on a humid or wet day most of the time. Now i really suspect the wiring in the column now because about 2 years ago i got into some trouble and had to have a breathilyzer put on my truck and then when it was removed is when i started having the problems. If this person just tapped into the wire it is possible that i may only have a couple of strands still attached, i will have to look under there and find and let yall know for sure this truck only has 72k on it, it was a friends grandpa's truck so no hard use.