Are there any honest dealers out there?

fulldingle49 · August 29, 2015

So frustrated with my local GMC dealer right now. Normally I do my own repairs on my vehicles but with the warranty work and free oil changes I have been forced to take my 2014 Sierra to the dealer I purchased it from. After the first oil change I noticed a fresh scratch in the paint. I didn't bother complaining because I had no proof. The next time I had it in for warranty work on the back seat and had another new scratch on it afterwards. This time I complained and explained how I had noticed a scratch on it after the prior visit. Now my truck goes to the body shop for a day and upon my return the newest scratch was still very visible. Leave it for another day, now the scratch is much less noticeable(of course my eyes are drawn to it every time I pass) so I take the truck and go on my merry way. I most recently had it in to have the radiator replaced due to a small leak which the dealer claims was a factory defect, whatever, I'm getting a new radiator right? Now when I pick up my truck and go to sign the paperwork I notice the line ADDITIONAL LABOR TO REPAIR MODIFIED TRUCK 3.0 hrs. ????. Yes , I do have a RC Leveling kit which I installed and afterwards brought to this dealer to have aligned per the installation instructions. Now I'm wondering what additional labor was due to this leveling kit being installed and question the cashier, she calls over a service advisor who was very dismissive and rude. She claimed that my leveling kit had to be removed to access the radiator. RIIGGHHHTTTT, I was a college trained ASE certified automotive mechanic in the late 80s, ran a repair shop in the early 90s and have been an industrial mechanic for twenty years now. Don't try to bs me! Now a second service advisor comes over and and explains to me that when replacing the radiator the truck needs to be lowered to give the technician better access to the engine compartment so that's why the leveling kit needed removed. Aha, now I understand. Wait a minute, wouldn't it be easier just to take the wheels off and lower the lift? And now that the kit has been removed and reinstalled doesn't it need re aligned? Ok, now he goes and asks the technician. No, the kit wasn't removed and the truck doesn't need re aligned. Ok whatever, now I'm just ready to get out of there because they're talking in circles. Two days later I get a call asking how I would rate my visit, I was still fuming but was very cordial. The young lady asks if I would like to have the service manager contact me. Now he has been helpful in the past but I really don't want to be that guy that isn't pleased no matter what and as I said, I ran a shop for several years and know that there were certain customers that just couldn't be pleased but let him give me a call if he wants. After explaining this whole situation to him he investigates and calls me back. The technician is actually his shop manager and is his most competent mechanic. The service manager admitted that the leveling kit wasn't removed, no need for an alignment. If they get a vehicle that has a lift of any kind on it they just charge GM for an additional 3 hrs. ? Really, so you're not being dishonest with me, you're being dishonest with GM. That makes me feel better, you would never lie to me right? Anyway, sorry for the long rant but what do I do now? My truck has several issues which should be covered under warranty but I can't trust this dealer. Has anyone had a similar problem with their dealer? Any advice would be appreciated!

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Rawyzf · August 29, 2015

This is sad to read.

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Storekeeper · August 29, 2015

The 3 GMC dealerships I went to are the same only you get an extra, they always tell you there's no problem the truck is operating normal

patriot · August 29, 2015

Tell GM that dealership is ripping them off.

j-ten-ner · August 29, 2015

"Are there any honest dealers out there?"

I'm surprised that you managed to get those two words into one sentence.

All fun aside, this is really disturbing.

I wouldn't bother to talk to those guys. I'd take my truck elsewhere.

Maybe 1 customer doesn't hurt. But 10 do.

And the next dealer might be smarter and appreciates to make business with you.

Ok, easy for me to do since I have at least 10 GM dealerships within 50km.

so long

j-ten-ner

krzyd · August 29, 2015

So frustrated with my local GMC dealer right now. Normally I do my own repairs on my vehicles but with the warranty work and free oil changes I have been forced to take my 2014 Sierra to the dealer I purchased it from. After the first oil change I noticed a fresh scratch in the paint. I didn't bother complaining because I had no proof. The next time I had it in for warranty work on the back seat and had another new scratch on it afterwards. This time I complained and explained how I had noticed a scratch on it after the prior visit. Now my truck goes to the body shop for a day and upon my return the newest scratch was still very visible. Leave it for another day, now the scratch is much less noticeable(of course my eyes are drawn to it every time I pass) so I take the truck and go on my merry way. I most recently had it in to have the radiator replaced due to a small leak which the dealer claims was a factory defect, whatever, I'm getting a new radiator right? Now when I pick up my truck and go to sign the paperwork I notice the line ADDITIONAL LABOR TO REPAIR MODIFIED TRUCK 3.0 hrs. ????. Yes , I do have a RC Leveling kit which I installed and afterwards brought to this dealer to have aligned per the installation instructions. Now I'm wondering what additional labor was due to this leveling kit being installed and question the cashier, she calls over a service advisor who was very dismissive and rude. She claimed that my leveling kit had to be removed to access the radiator. RIIGGHHHTTTT, I was a college trained ASE certified automotive mechanic in the late 80s, ran a repair shop in the early 90s and have been an industrial mechanic for twenty years now. Don't try to bs me! Now a second service advisor comes over and and explains to me that when replacing the radiator the truck needs to be lowered to give the technician better access to the engine compartment so that's why the leveling kit needed removed. Aha, now I understand. Wait a minute, wouldn't it be easier just to take the wheels off and lower the lift? And now that the kit has been removed and reinstalled doesn't it need re aligned? Ok, now he goes and asks the technician. No, the kit wasn't removed and the truck doesn't need re aligned. Ok whatever, now I'm just ready to get out of there because they're talking in circles. Two days later I get a call asking how I would rate my visit, I was still fuming but was very cordial. The young lady asks if I would like to have the service manager contact me. Now he has been helpful in the past but I really don't want to be that guy that isn't pleased no matter what and as I said, I ran a shop for several years and know that there were certain customers that just couldn't be pleased but let him give me a call if he wants. After explaining this whole situation to him he investigates and calls me back. The technician is actually his shop manager and is his most competent mechanic. The service manager admitted that the leveling kit wasn't removed, no need for an alignment. If they get a vehicle that has a lift of any kind on it they just charge GM for an additional 3 hrs. ? Really, so you're not being dishonest with me, you're being dishonest with GM. That makes me feel better, you would never lie to me right? Anyway, sorry for the long rant but what do I do now? My truck has several issues which should be covered under warranty but I can't trust this dealer. Has anyone had a similar problem with their dealer? Any advice would be appreciated!

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I'll play devils advocate here, I'm not in automotive service, but I am in an industry where we get reimbursed warranty labor from the manufacturer. I can tell you first hand that there is an attempt by every manufacturer we work with to "short" us on labor claims, actually, they succeed since they write the checks. If GM accepts the extra labor allowance for a lifted truck, and your truck IS lifted, then no one is being dishonest. The dealership may be exploiting a loophole, but I assure you it goes both ways.

patriot · August 29, 2015

I'll play devils advocate here, I'm not in automotive service, but I am in an industry where we get reimbursed warranty labor from the manufacturer. I can tell you first hand that there is an attempt by every manufacturer we work with to "short" us on labor claims, actually, they succeed since they write the checks. If GM accepts the extra labor allowance for a lifted truck, and your truck IS lifted, then no one is being dishonest. The dealership may be exploiting a loophole, but I assure you it goes both ways.

...so you're saying it's OK to bill the manufacturer for work that wasn't performed? ex: Remove and reinstall a lift kit as stated in the OP?

Wow. ...and I thought that was fraud. Thank you for clearing that up for us.

I also do warranty repairs, and NOTHING gets billed that isn't actually performed. We do work for various .govs/.mils. Fraud means jail time in our business.

krzyd · August 29, 2015

...so you're saying it's OK to bill the manufacturer for work that wasn't performed? ex: Remove and reinstall a lift kit as stated in the OP?

Wow. ...and I thought that was fraud. Thank you for clearing that up for us.

I also do warranty repairs, and NOTHING gets billed that isn't actually performed. We do work for various .govs/.mils. Fraud means jail time in our business.

Like I said, I'm not in that business, if it's a labor allowance because the truck is lifted, then no, it's not dishonest. I guess it all depends on the wording, again, I don't really have the paperwork in front of me though. I hear what you're saying about working as a gov't contractor, everything is on the up and up in that sector...for sure.

fulldingle49 · August 29, 2015

Apparently we need a forum on the meaning of the word dishonest. If they are submitting charges to GM for work that wasn't truly performed they are being dishonest and displaying to me a lack of integrity. Now I can no longer do business with them and feel comfortable that they aren't doing the same to me when I'm responsible for the bill. Just because GM may do the same to them doesn't mean that no one is being dishonest unless I've been misinformed all these years and two wrongs truly do make a right.

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fulldingle49 · August 29, 2015

so there's the paperwork, "other labor hours requested for removal of front tires and strut lift kit to get truck to a position it could be worked on". Does that mean that every time a vehicle is slightly modified the modification needs to be removed to perform needed repairs. We are not talking about a 6" or 8" lift here but merely a 2" leveling kit.

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krzyd · August 29, 2015

Apparently we need a forum on the meaning of the word dishonest. If they are submitting charges to GM for work that wasn't truly performed they are being dishonest and displaying to me a lack of integrity. Now I can no longer do business with them and feel comfortable that they aren't doing the same to me when I'm responsible for the bill. Just because GM may do the same to them doesn't mean that no one is being dishonest unless I've been misinformed all these years and two wrongs truly do make a right.

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You stated the work order said ADDITIONAL LABOR TO REPAIR MODIFIED TRUCK 3.0 hrs, then you questioned the technician, who fumbled around, and I guess he lied to you. I'm still not convinced the dealership is at fault, if the technician removed the wheels in order to lower the truck to access the radiator is that time not "extra labor", what about putting the wheels back on? I know that doesn't take 3 hours, but what if you had a 8" lift and the radiator repair took 6 hrs? How would you feel about the dealership charging you for the difference? I'm betting the dealership is operating within GM guidelines, but that is just my opinion I guess.

krzyd · August 29, 2015

so there's the paperwork, "other labor hours requested for removal of front tires and strut lift kit to get truck to a position it could be worked on". Does that mean that every time a vehicle is slightly modified the modification needs to be removed to perform needed repairs. We are not talking about a 6" or 8" lift here but merely a 2" leveling kit.

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Looks pretty clear to me, technician REQUESTED removal of wheels and struts, got the wheels off, discovered he didn't need to remove struts (I'm assuming that, because that is what you indicated in the first post), he then completed repair, at this point, you really don't even know if:

A)The dealership will try to bill GM for this

or

B)If GM will disallow the request should A actually take place

My advice is to not worry too much about this.

patriot · August 29, 2015

Who is the dealer?

fulldingle49 · August 29, 2015

I don't have an 8" lift and I don't have a problem paying for work that was truly performed if it is not covered by the manufacturers warranty. What we are talking about here is a technician seeing an opportunity to charge 3 hours extra without actually having to do any additional work and that I have a problem with.

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krzyd · August 29, 2015

I don't have an 8" lift and I don't have a problem paying for work that was truly performed if it is not covered by the manufacturers warranty. What we are talking about here is a technician seeing an opportunity to charge 3 hours extra without actually having to do any additional work and that I have a problem with.

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Don't most automotive places use "flat rate" or "book rate" pricing these days? Wouldn't that apply here? Your truck is modified, they did "extra work". Did they charge you for anything here? Maybe the technician is being dishonest, maybe the technician is doing what he is instructed to do, maybe he could have actually charged you for the "extra work". If you found out the tech gave you a freebie, would you run to his boss with the honesty 101 speech? I didn't think so.