Service Advisor sez it's normal?

[Beer Belly]

'04 Silverado 2500HD E/C, S/B, 6.0L, 4:10, 4x4, 16,600 miles. The other day, I was coming to a Red Light and noticed that the Brake Pedal traveled a little more and didn't seem to have the stopping force I'm used to. I went into a parking lot and decided to "Test" the pedal....if I hold a moderate & steady pressure on the pedal, it sinks to the floor (but does hold).....if I put heavy pressure, it sinks, hisses and gurgles as it goes to the floor, he sez "it's normal". I also "feel" a knocking over bumps thru the steering wheel, I've had the knuckle problem once before, but the Service Advisor rocked the steering wheel back & forth and said "it's normal, otherwise you could feel it while rocking the wheel". I'm gonna have it checked by a "Tech" when I go for my next service, but in the meantime, I'm waiting for a call to possibly tow a 35ft. camper to aid in the Gulf and want to make sure my brakes will stay with me....do you feel this is normal operation??

[Wingnut]

Any time the pedal goes all the way to the floor...It's bad. From what you're describing, it sounds like the brakes need to be bled.

 

It also sounds like your service advisor needs a kick in the shin.

[GM-Tech]

The truth of that matter is, we find nothing wrong with 99.9% of the vehicles under warranty that the customer complains the pedal goes "to the floor." None are ever able to show me this, though their definition of "to the floor" and mine apparently are different. If it ain't touchin' the carpet, it ain't to the floor. The brake hydraulic system is one of the most trouble free parts of the vehicles. Seals can go when they get much older, causing a loss of pressure, but that's rare on a relatively new vehicle. Sure, it can happen... I just haven't seen it since I can't remember when.

 

Here's the official test... with the brakes cool and the key off, pump the brakes 4-5 times to fully deplete the booster reserve. With your foot off the pedal, take a tape measure and measure from a point on the lower rim of the steering wheel to the brake pedal. Note that measurement. Apply 100 pounds of pressure on the brake pedal and measure again between the same points.

 

With a vacuum booster, you should have a max of 2.5" of travel. With a hydro-boost system, 3.5".

[Beer Belly]

I will admit it doesn't touch the Floormat, but it's within a Half Inch of hitting it. Just doesn't seem right, especially the sudden change in braking, definetly going to mention it on my next service, I'd feel a lot better if they had sent out a Tech to feel the pedal.....we'll see, I just posted it here to see if anyone else had the same experience.

[mmmikkke]

I had my '95 towed in for a fuel pump problem under warranty. While it was there the service manager decided he'd have my steering wheel replaced because a tiny bit of the paint (?!!) had peeled off of it.

 

Well they put the steering wheel back on crooked. I get in the truck to leave and notice this, and go back in side and tell the service manager what had happened.

 

"Nope, not possible. There's only one way they can go on, You must need an alignment."

 

I rented a puller, pulled it off, and moved it over one spline and it was back straight like the original wheel.

 

Sometimes they just outright lie to you.

[GM-Tech]

Sometimes they just outright lie to you.

 

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And sometimes they just don't know. A service manager many times doesn't have technical knowledge. They're managers, and not all were once techs.

[NRM]

Didn't GM have a problem with the hydrualic power assist assembly? I think they cracked and leaked. Maybe Im crasy but I thought I heard that somewhere.

[mmmikkke]

Sometimes they just outright lie to you.

 

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And sometimes they just don't know...

 

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And everybody would get along if they'd just admit they don't know instead of lying.

[GM-Tech]

Sometimes they just outright lie to you.

 

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And sometimes they just don't know...

 

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And everybody would get along if they'd just admit they don't know instead of lying.

 

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Agreed, but not knowing doesn't equal lying. The person may THINK they know, but really don't.

[Wingnut]

Yeah, and any "manager" that says "I don't know" with any sort of regularity won't be in a management position very long.

 

Don't I wish that were true.

[mmmikkke]

Sometimes they just outright lie to you.

 

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And sometimes they just don't know...

 

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And everybody would get along if they'd just admit they don't know instead of lying.

 

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Agreed, but not knowing doesn't equal lying. The person may THINK they know, but really don't.

 

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When I discovered the crooked wheel, I was rebuffed by the service manager. He accused me of lying that the wheel had been straight when it came in. I asked for the service tech to be summoned to confirm that there was no possibility that the wheel had been put on crooked. He refused. Then I offered to pay for an alignment conditionally, and if it was found that the wheel had been put on wrong, I would not have to pay for the alignment. He refused. The only option he would permit was that I would pay for, and receive, an alignment.

 

It was only later after I had turned down his offer that I was able to realize that the turn signals cancellation points would have been screwed up if I had permitted his stingy and dishonest remedy. That's when I rented the wheel puller.

 

Why didn't he, the expert, realize the same thing??

 

Does this sound like a service manager who has any interest in the truth? Drunk with power is more like it.

[GM-Tech]

Why didn't he, the expert, realize the same thing??

 

Who says he's an expert? He's a manager. He manages (poorly maybe), he doesn't fix cars. Not all service managers have a technical background. Some may even be less technically knowledgeable than a savvy customer.

 

Yes, he should have been more receptive to the idea that there was a possibility something was done wrong. I won't disagree with that!

[toneman]

Why didn't he, the expert, realize the same thing??

 

Who says he's an expert? He's a manager. He manages (poorly maybe), he doesn't fix cars. Not all service managers have a technical background. Some may even be less technically knowledgeable than a savvy customer.

 

Yes, he should have been more receptive to the idea that there was a possibility something was done wrong. I won't disagree with that!

 

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Perhaps so, but this particular manager would not back down from his assertion that what he said was indeed correct...meaning that if indeed this guy doesn't have a technicaly background, he definitely wasn't gonna own up to it...

 

Sorry--this manager didn't just "think" he knew...his own words/response/unwillingness to compromise when mmmikkke even offered to concede the steering wheel issue by paying for an alignment if indeed his truck was out of alignment clearly belied otherwise. If he (the manager) couldn't be "man" enough to admit that he could be mistaken when the facts almost clearly prove him wrong...then it's definitely not a matter of him perhaps "thinking" that he knows what the issue is.

[mmmikkke]

I think we're all on the same page on this.

 

People are human, and everybody makes mistakes.

 

But every situation is different. I'd even want to point out that *this* was the exception, and that most of my opportunities to deal with GM dealer service managers have not been bad experiences like this.

 

This dealership's attempt to go above and beyond by replacing the steering wheel probably made the service manager a little defensive about my not liking what "they" did. He backed himself into a corner and I came along and didn't appreciate his "help". And so he was uncooperative. He probably expected gratitude; he didn't figure on somebody who actually wanted the job done right.

[ManyCamaroz]

The truth of that matter is, we find nothing wrong with 99.9% of the vehicles under warranty that the customer complains the pedal goes "to the floor."  None are ever able to show me this, though their definition of "to the floor" and mine apparently are different.   If it ain't touchin' the carpet, it ain't to the floor.  The brake hydraulic system is one of the most trouble free parts of the vehicles.  Seals can go when they get much older, causing a loss of pressure, but that's rare on a relatively new vehicle.  Sure, it can happen... I just haven't seen it since I can't remember when.

 

Here's the official test... with the brakes cool and the key off, pump the brakes 4-5 times to fully deplete the booster reserve.  With your foot off the pedal, take a tape measure and measure from a point on the lower rim of the steering wheel to the brake pedal.  Note that measurement.  Apply 100 pounds of pressure on the brake pedal and measure again between the same points.

 

With a vacuum booster, you should have a max of 2.5" of travel.  With a hydro-boost system, 3.5".

 

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What if the travel is greater than the max. of 2.5"?