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Rear brakes lasting 22k miles????

AbzDad
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Chuck FB Enthusiast

Chuck FB

Posted
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On 12/22/2025 at 2:45 PM, AbzDad said:

That's the thing. It has never been near the ocean or any boat launch...ever. I don't own a boat. I use it to tow my dump trailer or my camper, but only in the summer. I live in NH, but the truck is rarely driven in the winter and garaged year round.

 

The caliper pins all looked fine. I greased them up and put them back in. Replaced the rotors, pads and parking brake shoes. Both sides.

 

Just to give you a heads up in case you never noticed the answers Newdude gave me on wondering about the braking system as in foundation brakes as well as the park brake system and what if anything required a scan tool. So as he explained a scan tool is required to calibrate the park brake shoe system after having replaced them. 

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AbzDad
AbzDad

Update. I had to take it to the dealership. They confirmed that the caliper is bad and are replacing it under warranty.   Thanks for all the help on this.

newdude
newdude

This procedure is only documented in the manual for 1500s as the park brake is a part of the caliper.   HDs don't require any sort of "serivce mode", not even for replacing the park brake sh

newdude
newdude

Looks about right for a salt state.  We do them here in NY all the time.    Gotta open everything up once a year and clean and lubricate everything.     Also something to consider

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AbzDad Enthusiast

AbzDad

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Update. I had to take it to the dealership. They confirmed that the caliper is bad and are replacing it under warranty.

 

Thanks for all the help on this.

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bruceb58 Enthusiast

bruceb58

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On 1/15/2026 at 8:39 AM, Chuck FB said:

 

Just to give you a heads up in case you never noticed the answers Newdude gave me on wondering about the braking system as in foundation brakes as well as the park brake system and what if anything required a scan tool. So as he explained a scan tool is required to calibrate the park brake shoe system after having replaced them. 

It is also required if you replace the rotor or caliper as well.

 

From the service manual.

 

image.thumb.png.35372931fb53f813e21a93011e322660.png

 

 

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Chuck FB Enthusiast

Chuck FB

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24 minutes ago, bruceb58 said:

It is also required if you replace the rotor or caliper as well.

 

From the service manual.

 

image.thumb.png.35372931fb53f813e21a93011e322660.png

 

 

 

Is that out of the 2024 service manual specific to the HD trucks ?. 

bruceb58 Enthusiast

bruceb58

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6 minutes ago, Chuck FB said:

 

Is that out of the 2024 service manual specific to the HD trucks ?. 

Yes.

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Chuck FB Enthusiast

Chuck FB

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2 hours ago, AbzDad said:

Update. I had to take it to the dealership. They confirmed that the caliper is bad and are replacing it under warranty.

 

Thanks for all the help on this.

 

I gather it was doing funky things as per dragging the brake pads some with that caliper, like your temp gun was indicating something was happening hit and miss on that wheel end. 

 

I had a question about the park brake shoe replacement, I had found some videos that were attempting to show replacing of the shoes and looked like it was a real bear to get some of the springs undone and not sure how they got the inner spring hooked up for the new shoes. With the drive hub in the way, that isn't helping anything either. And once you finished the shoe swap did you put the drum on and reach from the back to adjust up the adjuster or adjusted from the outside by slipping the rotor on/off and testing for drag and readjusting. Since I don't have a manual I don't know what sort of adjustment spec they have for clearance but obviously would not want much if any drag. 

 

I imagine they would last for a long time if never near anything but dry roads with no salt. Obviously the reason others have had to pull theirs apart is from the same theme of corrosion or a malfunction. 

bruceb58 Enthusiast

bruceb58

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12 minutes ago, Chuck FB said:

I imagine they would last for a long time if never near anything but dry roads with no salt. Obviously the reason others have had to pull theirs apart is from the same theme of corrosion or a malfunction. 

I can't even remember if I have ever had to replace brake shoes on a vehicle with disc brakes and a separate parking brake drum/shoes. It should never happen. Of course I am in sunny southern California with no salt.

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AbzDad Enthusiast

AbzDad

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In lieu of the scan tool, you can just go through the process to put the brakes into service mode. Requires you to turn on truck, but not start. Set parking brake. Hold brake pedal and parking brake button for 15-20 seconds. There is an orange light that comes on the dash showing the brake is in service mode. The icon has a wrench under it. Then you have to remove your negative battery cables. Then change the brakes. Then pump the pedal back up. Reconnect the negative battery cables. Then take is out of service mode by holding the parking brake button. There are a few videos that show it. 

 

The springs were a bear, but I used a pair of long curved needle-nose pliers to get them hooked back on. Put the back spring on first, then the front spring. There is an adjuster, just like normal parking brakes. Adjustment was just like you described. 

 

They said the pads were dragging because the pistons were not backing off when the pedal was released. They weren't sure if that due to the hose or the caliper, so they replaced both. I did have to pay for a brake flush, which was recommended due to the heat I was seeing on the rotor/caliper. But cheap insurance. 

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newdude Senior Enthusiast

newdude

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31 minutes ago, AbzDad said:

In lieu of the scan tool, you can just go through the process to put the brakes into service mode. Requires you to turn on truck, but not start. Set parking brake. Hold brake pedal and parking brake button for 15-20 seconds. There is an orange light that comes on the dash showing the brake is in service mode. The icon has a wrench under it. Then you have to remove your negative battery cables. Then change the brakes. Then pump the pedal back up. Reconnect the negative battery cables. Then take is out of service mode by holding the parking brake button. There are a few videos that show it. 

 

 

 

 

This procedure is only documented in the manual for 1500s as the park brake is a part of the caliper.

 

HDs don't require any sort of "serivce mode", not even for replacing the park brake shoes.  They only require a park brake calibration if the shoes are replaced, and it is a scan tool commanded procedure.

 

The park brake calibration procedure can be completed using the following steps:

  1. Block the drive wheels.
  2. Install a scan tool to the vehicle.
  3. Ignition On/Vehicle in Service Mode.
  4. Select Control Functions from the Brake System Control Module menu.
  5. If available, select Configuration/Reset Functions from the Brake System Control Module menu and perform the Park Brake Calibration procedure.
  6. Apply and release the park brakes using the park brake switch to ensure that the system is functioning.
  • Like 3
davester Senior Enthusiast

davester

Posted
Posted

I have had to replace the parking brake shoes on both my '04 3500 and '12 3500, not for wear, but because they repeatedly got soaked in gear oil when the inner hub seal failed...

Chuck FB Enthusiast

Chuck FB

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25 minutes ago, davester said:

I have had to replace the parking brake shoes on both my '04 3500 and '12 3500, not for wear, but because they repeatedly got soaked in gear oil when the inner hub seal failed...

That's a good point about hub seals letting go and soaking the shoes, always was a risk with true drum brakes through the years. So when the hub seal leaked did it fling oil up onto the rotor and oil soak the inner brake pad as well ?. 

 

Curious if the hubs that leaked, if there was found to be bearing wear and/or excessive end play of the hub or if it was simply seal and seal contact surface wear causing the leaks. 

davester Senior Enthusiast

davester

Posted
Posted

Most of the time, the disc brake pads were fine.  So far, it's just been the seal.  The bearings have always seemed fine, and feel good.  The seal sometimes lasts just months, other times it lasts years and years.

 

I couldn't really tell exactly where it failed, as pulling the hub off generally wrecks the seal, sometimes pulling it in half.  I would say it's most likely that the seal was leaking in the middle, as it's a two piece seal, then possibly where the seal slides on the axle.  I've always had to work to pry off seal from the hub, so I don't think it's been leaking there.

Chuck FB Enthusiast

Chuck FB

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4 hours ago, davester said:

Most of the time, the disc brake pads were fine.  So far, it's just been the seal.  The bearings have always seemed fine, and feel good.  The seal sometimes lasts just months, other times it lasts years and years.

 

I couldn't really tell exactly where it failed, as pulling the hub off generally wrecks the seal, sometimes pulling it in half.  I would say it's most likely that the seal was leaking in the middle, as it's a two piece seal, then possibly where the seal slides on the axle.  I've always had to work to pry off seal from the hub, so I don't think it's been leaking there.

 

I have not seen photos of these HD trucks with a hub pulled to see what type of setup they have, from the spindle nut retainer system to the type of seal they use. Over the years I've worked some on the heavier highway tractor wheel ends and imagine there would be some similarities although much larger in size/scale, that is unless GM reinvented the wheel LOL. I would not have any of the odd ball socket sizes for these HD wheel end spindle nuts etc. Sounds like from what your describing that it is a seal type they have used for years now from the factory for highway tractor and trailer hubs that spins/seals internally and presses or slips into the hub and also slides onto the spindle and has molded rubber ribs to both grip and contain the oil from getting past the spindle ?. Just taking a guess on that based on the two piece seal wording. I know the issue with the large truck and trailer axles is that on salty roads corrosion takes effect on the spindle surface where the factory style seal is gripping onto the spindle and after that heavy pitting happens a new seal of that style won't seal on the spindle anymore and have to go to a different style seal that utilizes a speedy sleeve pressed onto the spindle. I've never installed one of those factory two in one style seals, have some that came in kits but the spindle rust meant staying away from that seal type as that as I was told was when premature wheel seal end leaks started happening, when the factory assembled hub was pulled to service the brakes etc. I imagine if a truck/trailer never saw a winter road it would be fine for years with installing new two in one seals and they are much quicker to replace and don't require the seal driver kits. 

 

Can you recall what size socket your past trucks took for the rear axle nut and who knows if that has changed or not for the newer trucks. Also are they using a paper gasket for sealing the drive axle flange to outer face of the hub or are they using some fancy oring system instead. 

davester Senior Enthusiast

davester

Posted
Posted

The axle nut uses a special socket with extruded pins (the nut has a bunch of holes in the side of it), and it's different between the '04 and the '12 I have.  no idea about newer trucks.

 

The seal itself is a single part, but the inner and outer pieces are fixed in place on their respective mount (the hub and axle housing).  So, you install the seal into the hub (I made a large driver to hammer it in), then you install the hub onto the axle, and as part of screwing in the axle nut, it pushes the seal onto the axle housing.  It's considered a 2-piece seal because the sliding part of the seal is between the inner and outer parts of the seal instead of between the seal either the axle housing or the hub.

davester Senior Enthusiast

davester

Posted
Posted

both my trucks use a gasket for the axle shafts to hub surface.  I'm using some felpro metal ones, which I've been reusing, and haven't had a leak there.

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