1 Ton Van

kmborland · February 16, 2015

Hey boyz & girlz,

Been awhile since I have been on, life getting in the way and what not, just had an interesting view on something that I would like to shear. This is going to be a little long as I have a good bit to say.

For work (this is my last week at this job as I am starting my new job as a diesel mechanic the last week of February, FINALLY!!), I am a parts driver for VA Truck Center in Weyers Cave. My route for work starts at Weyers Cave to Charlottesville, then north to Warrenton. Sometimes have to run down to Palmyra for deliveries, then back to Weyers Cave at the end of the day. Most days, I average 250 miles a day driving anywhere from 5-7 hours a day. As most who are in fleet or delivery work, we drive cargo vans. These vans have it rough there entire life. Being driven hard, overloaded daily, not properly maintained, crappy regular gas, so on and so forth.

I drive a 2005 1ton long wheelbase GMC Savanna cargo van. It has the lq4 6.0, 4l80e and 4.10 gear combo. This van has 231k miles on the factory drivetrain. Since I started working here, I have put over 8k miles on it. Now that some of the back story has been said, this thing got some B**LS!!! Sorry ladies, the 6.0 doesn’t seem to like being pussyfooted around when driving, she wants her midrange while accelerating (my personal truck is the same way; I’m guessing it is just the nature of all ls motors).I’ve had this thing over loaded (this van has a 4195lb payload capacity) and it will still pull Afton Mountain on I-64 east in overdrive at 70mph. This is probably due to the .8 overdrive gear as well as rear gearing and just brute strength of the lq4. I’ve flat footed the throttle from a stop fully loaded and it would burn rubber (both tires) halfway through 1^st and pulls hard 60-70mph with ease. Having a higher stall with the 4l80 seems to aid in this as well as shifting through gears in normal driving. The biggest thing I’ve noticed while driving is that the 6.0 loves to rev and it pulls harder as the revs climb. Driving hard or like a grandpa, she’ll get 14-15 mpg. I keep mileage records on this van since I started and it has overall mileage average of 14.56 mpg since I’ve been driving it.

We also have fairly new (2009) Ford 1ton vans. I don’t drive them much, only when my van needs service. The one I drove had the triton 5.4 (idk if it was the 2 or 3 valve motor), feels like a 4 speed trans and I don’t know what rear gear it has. This one has less than 100k on it. I do not know a lot about Ford’s spec sheet and I am sorry about that. Driving the same way as with the GMC (basically same loads and route); I’ve notice a big difference in the Ford. It doesn’t like to rev, it wants to stay under 2500 rpm. Flatfooting it with give fast acceleration in 1^st then it just falls on its face, takes forever to get to 65-70mph (kind of like my old tbi 350, fast in 1^st only ha). It does seem to move fine with the weight in normal driving but it doesn’t feel like it has the brute strength the 6.0 has. When driving up Afton Mountain with the same load, it won’t hold overdrive. And when it would downshift into a lower gear, it would lose more speed, like it doesn’t have the power higher in the revs to move it with a load. I would back off the throttle to let it upshift then be a little lighter on the throttle to get it to pull the mountain in overdrive. It felt better pulling the hill at 60-62 mph, felt like it had the power at that speed to pull it. Another thing I’ve notice is that the throttle is really touchy. The 6.0 feels more linear in throttle input; like when you push the throttle 20% the engine gives 20%. The 5.4 seems more aggressive when you tip into the throttle; like it is giving you 35% when you only ask for 20%. Because of this, it jumps when you accelerate normally from a stop. You get used to it and adjust for it but it makes it feel weaker the more you give it throttle. I am going to give this feeling to having a lower stall and high rear gear. Ford also returned about the same mileage, mostly on the low side of 14.

Now, I do a lot reading on these 2 engines and seen plenty of comparo’s on both GM and Ford sites. I know that 5.4 was designed to make peak torque low (look at all the dyno sheets) and made for pulling/hauling supposedly. The lq4 is basically an lq9 with less compression and that it is based off the ls1 car motor from the C5 corvettes (so it’s a car motor in a truck). Both being the base truck motor for both brands ¾ and 1 ton vans and trucks of these years; I feel it is fair to compare them. The 5.4 is all low end grunt, it feels the happiest in the lower rpm range. The 6.0 has power everywhere, low mid high, doesn’t matter. You need power, you have it in spades. Also, the bigger displacement motor got better mileage. I think this goes back to having more power to pull in a higher gear or the fact that even though the 6.0 is revving higher at speed, it is pulling less vacuum which intern means better mileage.

This my opinion and review on this and I am sure it is different from some people. But this is what I noticed in driving these and hope this my shear some light on how different these animals are. I am a GM man and I know this sounds like I am heating on the Ford. But this is my truth when driven back to back.

kstruckcountry · February 16, 2015

I wouldn't say the LQ4 is that closely related to the c5 motor. Yes, all "ls based" motors share some features but at the end of the day the LQ4 is an iron block motor made for pickups.

I've driven a 5.4 and they're pretty much dogs... The V10 is better but I'd still rather have a GM 6.0. The 5.4 has to downshift for just about everything.

kmborland · February 16, 2015

I would for the most part. Has the same cam as the ls1, same basic architect as the ls1 as they both are gen III V8s, the 317 is just a 72cc (if I remember right) version of the 243 heads. If you overlay the dyno graphs, the ls1, lq4,lq9,and lm7 have the same torque/horsepower curve (not numbers) just shifted up or down with the engine's displacement and tuning. You are right, the Lq4 is an iron block version of the ls1 that was meant for truck duty; and boy does it do a great job at it. After driving this one for work, I can understand why GM hasn't let this iron horse out to pasture yet.

Even most of the ford guyz will say that in the 3/4 and 1 ton application, the 5.4 just isn't strong enough. I have not driven the v10 so can not comment.

KMGZ400 · February 16, 2015

I have a 2 2010 e350's with 5.4's for my buisness and they are dogs... They burn oil too. The body of the ford vans is 10x better then the express though, the express has crap paint and the body panels are thin and weak... GM drivetrain in a ford chassis would be ideal! IMO

kmborland · February 16, 2015

Yup, my van's paint is peeling along with the other 2 gm vans in the fleet. Hell, the 2 GM vans I see for sale on my route have peeling paint ha. But, all the GM vans have over 200k, the duramax van has 250k on it with no issues. 3 of the new fords knock really bad when first cranked in the morning and they all have around 120-130k on them. I haven't noticed the body issues on either as it is too crazy in the morning to think about the body panels. I am more about the driving experience and how the drivetrains handle the weight.