04 d-max

dcsnyder · June 2, 2006

I'm considering buying a 04 D-max with 28000 miles on it. It has a superchip installed and runs like a beast! Without the superchip installed the D-max is sort of underwhelming. I'm a chevy guy but I try to maintain an objective point of view. I thought the Cummins felt a lot stronger as a stock engine.

I've been doing a little research and finding opinions all over the map on this LLY engine. I've read milage anywhere from 10mpg to 21 mpg. I've read "no complaints at all" to lack of power, black smoke, injector problems, turbo issues ETC.

Anyone know what the story is with this LLY engine? There dosen't seem to be any sort of general concensus.

snoman · June 2, 2006

I'm considering buying a 04 D-max with 28000 miles on it. It has a superchip installed and runs like a beast! Without the superchip installed the D-max is sort of underwhelming. I'm a chevy guy but I try to maintain an objective point of view. I thought the Cummins felt a lot stronger as a stock engine.

I've been doing a little research and finding opinions all over the map on this LLY engine. I've read milage anywhere from 10mpg to 21 mpg. I've read "no complaints at all" to lack of power, black smoke, injector problems, turbo issues ETC.

Anyone know what the story is with this LLY engine? There dosen't seem to be any sort of general concensus.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Myself I would never buy a used chipped diesel engine because regardless of brand it does ad more wear and tear to drive line that you will find out over time as to how much. I would rate the Cummins basic block as the sturdiest because its basic design goes back many, many years before it even appeared in a Dodge truck, I would put the Dmax second and the 6.0 PS behind them. (the 7.3 PS was and still is a very rugged engine) GM beefed up the Dmax in the latest 360 HP version and if it was that solid, they would not of made some of the changes that they did to it and thee ally hooked to it. Also if it is a stick, they had a lot of trouble with the two peice flywheel on them that was redesigned in June 05 and can be retrofitted on older Dmax's At the link below you will find a list of changes in the LBZ engine and the Ally itself if yopu want to know if you are sitting on the fence between a new one and a used one (I would choose a 06 over a 04 unless the 04 was a steal because there are a lot of good changes in 06 models) Also I would rate the Dmax the smootest running over it total RPM range of all of them as the Cummins does not like to be wound up much past 2300 RPM as it will do it but it does not fell happy about it while the Dmax seems the thrive up there at times.

One more thing, the 06 has a improved cooling system (bigger radiator and fan) and the difference is plan to see if you look at then side by side.

Click Here

dcsnyder · June 3, 2006

I'm considering buying a 04 D-max with 28000 miles on it. It has a superchip installed and runs like a beast! Without the superchip installed the D-max is sort of underwhelming. I'm a chevy guy but I try to maintain an objective point of view. I thought the Cummins felt a lot stronger as a stock engine.

I've been doing a little research and finding opinions all over the map on this LLY engine. I've read milage anywhere from 10mpg to 21 mpg. I've read "no complaints at all" to lack of power, black smoke, injector problems, turbo issues ETC.

Anyone know what the story is with this LLY engine? There dosen't seem to be any sort of general concensus.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Myself I would never buy a used chipped diesel engine because regardless of brand it does ad more wear and tear to drive line that you will find out over time as to how much. I would rate the Cummins basic block as the sturdiest because its basic design goes back many, many years before it even appeared in a Dodge truck, I would put the Dmax second and the 6.0 PS behind them. (the 7.3 PS was and still is a very rugged engine) GM beefed up the Dmax in the latest 360 HP version and if it was that solid, they would not of made some of the changes that they did to it and thee ally hooked to it. Also if it is a stick, they had a lot of trouble with the two peice flywheel on them that was redesigned in June 05 and can be retrofitted on older Dmax's At the link below you will find a list of changes in the LBZ engine and the Ally itself if yopu want to know if you are sitting on the fence between a new one and a used one (I would choose a 06 over a 04 unless the 04 was a steal because there are a lot of good changes in 06 models) Also I would rate the Dmax the smootest running over it total RPM range of all of them as the Cummins does not like to be wound up much past 2300 RPM as it will do it but it does not fell happy about it while the Dmax seems the thrive up there at times.

One more thing, the 06 has a improved cooling system (bigger radiator and fan) and the difference is plan to see if you look at then side by side.

Click Here

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for the info.

The 06 LBZ is out of the equation for me at this point. I 'm just not willing to put out that kind of money for a truck that I drive 3000-4000 miles per year. I drove one tonight and it was pretty powerful. It made the 04' seem tame.

I also drove the cummins and that motor just feels RIGHT. I agree, it doesn't like to hit 2500+ rpm much. But then, it makes it's power lower in the RPM range as well. I think the d-max red lines at 4000. The cummins red lines at 3000.

I know what both engines are rated at for horspower and torque. I would say that the cummins felt at least as strong as the LBZ d-max. The figures don't support this but it's my objective opinion. The dodge wasn't as shift happy as the Allison when I demanded more power with the gas pedal either. The LBZ was quieter idling and driving than the cummins. I thought the 2004,LLY, was quieter while at idle but no different when under power than the cummins. Probably because the cummins was turning 1000 rpm lower at any given time.

I'm not sure if the 5speed/6speed is a positive for the d-max either. I find the shifting of my gas engine annoying at times. The Allison shifts more often as well

As much as I hate to admit it I like the Dodge better. I would be switching from a crew cab in the Chevy to an extended cab in the Dodge. That's a minus.

Can you provide any additional info. on the LLY engine? That's what I need to look at as far as potential pitfalls are concerned.

.

cowboybinkz71 · June 3, 2006

The LLY is the second generation Dmax engine. It came out in 2003 as a means to address the major fuel system woes of the 1st Gen LB7 motors in the '01 and '02 trucks. The changes made were a new fuel delivery system featuring new injectors and new fuel delivery lines run outside of the heads (the LB7s fuel lines were under the heads). I think they also changed the fuel filter and injection pump slightly, but I"m not certain. Other than that there wasn't much chage that I"m aware of on the LLY, but this did seem to fix many of the early problems.

What affected teh LB7 was that the fuel filter was not filtering out the small particles of dirt, and due to the tight tolerances of the Bosch fuel system, the dirt particles were eating up the fuel pump and injectors. My '01 had this affliction and it casued my truck to be down for 2 weeks while the entire front fuel delivery system was replaced including 8 new injectors, 8 new fuel lines, and a new high pressure fuel pump.

Now I could be wrong, but the LB7 trucks were the 1st Gen with 300 hp and 520ft-lbs. The LLY came next and was rated teh same for '03 and in '04 the power numbers fo rthe Allison trucks went up. Maybe that power bump came in '05, but I thought there was a different engine designation.

Mark_in_Tulsa · June 3, 2006

What year of Cummins were you driving?

jake111 · June 4, 2006

I believe the LLY came out in the mid-year 2004 model (so we 2004 LLY's are usually called 2004.5). "Mid-year" of course means about January 2004.

LLY went until 2006.5

I haven't had one single problem in 2 years; starts and runs flawlessly. Of course, I only have 13k miles and Southern California isn't the coldest place around.

I do tow a 5k-pound toybox over the mountains from San Diego to the desert, and back up the I-8 grade (sea-level in the desert to 5,000 ft.). It blasts up the hill.

duramaxHD · June 7, 2006

2004.5 LLY (first produced in December 2003/January of 2004)

differences:

variable vane turbo

injectors outside valve covers

valve covers

heads slighty different to accomodate different injectors

injectors operate on 48 volts (LB7-96volt)

ECM changed from LS1-architecturee to LS2 style

emmissions controls (recirc PCV and EGR)

intake manifold

fuel press regulator (different plug to fit around new intake mannifold)

I may be missing some other small thigns...injector pumps (CP3) are the same, however the fuel rails and fuel plumbing is slightly different, as is the pressure relfief valve....

2006 LLY is "NOT" a 2004.5-2005 LLY. Its completely different. The 2006 LLY's are literally an LBZ with 310hp/605tq programming in the ECM.

Ben