Vortec 8100 2003 vS. 2004

d2alio · October 15, 2003

I was just at GM BuyPower building various model GMC Sierra 2500 HD Crew Cabs with the Vortec 8100 and I notice that if you build a 2003 model the Vortec 8100 is listed at 340HP & 455lb of Torque and the 2004 is listed at 330hp and 450lb of Torque...is this just a slip up or does last year's model just pack more punch? (and costs a little less because it's last year's too...even though the models seem to be identical)...

the only difference I notice is that for the 2004 you have to select a long bed and the 2003 you have to get a shortbed, but I'm sure this is just a glitch with GMBuyPower's program because it wouldn't even let me build a 4x4 Extended cab

But, just in case, my question is:

1) Does the 2003 model pack a bit more punch?

2) Is the shortbed on the crewcab a full 6.5ft or is it shortened like Ford's crewcab's down to a 5.5ft bed? A 6.5ft bed is preferred for me, but I'd also like a crewcab model. I dont have to settle for an extended cab to get the 6.5ft bed (short bed) do I?

Cliff1943 · October 15, 2003

I have a 2003 extended cab short bed. It has the 6.5 bed. I think lowering the HP & torque rating is GM's way of admiting the 2003 really doesn't have 340 HP. I will lay money mine doesn't make 340 HP on a dyno.

I will get a lot of guys giving me the devil, but I think the new big block is a bunch of bull. It doesn't make near the HP & torque per CI the new and old small blocks make. I am sad that the Chevrolet engineers can't get the 8.1 to make the power it should.

GM should give up on this design and build a big block that makes the power it should.

Guys, don't give me hell. I have owned more GM ptoducts than most people. In excess of 40. I currently own 4. I am a Chevy fan through and through. I just can admit it when they need to make a change in the product.

d2alio · October 15, 2003

I'd be interested in hearing a bit more on that actually Because if that's the case I can just save my extra $950 that they want for it and get the Vortec 6000 and just put some aftermarket mods on it to boost the HP. Do you think the BB8100 is like Dodge' Hemi (it's garbage and doesn't stack up to what it's suppose to be)?

Rippem · October 15, 2003

Yea right...I'd like to see a 6 liter (even with light mods and a 4.10 gear) in the same truck take my 12500 lb powerboat package down the road and maintain speed in gear like my 8.1.... I can hear that small block screaming, and hunting for 3rd gear right now...

Chevyfreek · October 15, 2003

Somtimes vehicle manufactures will claim lower HP and Tq numbers to help with emission level claims and such. So as far as one being more powerful than the other, I doubt it. I have the 6.0L in my truck with a Westers PCM and it runs strong and I get decent gas mileage. The truck pulls the 5500lb travel trailer I have along with a bed full of fire wood without a problem. It is rated to tow a 10,000lb trailer and I am sure it could do it without a problem. The 8.1L I am sure has more pulling power and low end torque. Just add a Westers to which ever one you decide on and it will run the way it should have from the factory....

422 SS · October 15, 2003

I have a 2003 extended cab short bed. It has the 6.5 bed. I think lowering the HP & torque rating is GM's way of admiting the 2003 really doesn't have 340 HP. I will lay money mine doesn't make 340 HP on a dyno.

I will get a lot of guys giving me the devil, but I think the new big block is a bunch of bull. It doesn't make near the HP & torque per CI the new and old small blocks make. I am sad that the Chevrolet engineers can't get the 8.1 to make the power it should.

GM should give up on this design and build a big block that makes the power it should.

Guys, don't give me hell. I have owned more GM ptoducts than most people. In excess of 40. I currently own 4. I am a Chevy fan through and through. I just can admit it when they need to make a change in the product.

I agree with you 100%.I have owned around 30 chevys and currently have 4 of them.With out going into a big debate I'll never buy another 8.1 regardless of what they do to it.In the trucks and van I use for work it will be the 6.0 gas or Duramax.The 8.1 tows well but acceleration is marginal at best empty.My 6.0 van would kill it in a drag race and the Duramax will outrun it by several truck lengths in the 1/4 mile.The 8.1 is a dinosaur that should be put to rest.The engineers at GM can come up with a more powerful efficient engine that would do the job.The gen 3 small blocks have great power and fuel effiency.They should come up with something similar but bigger obviously.

awdvkd · October 15, 2003

Well, where to start. I own a 8.1 and I feel its the best GM engine I have owned. It has a H*LL of alot more power than the old BB's, it gets better MGP than the old BB's and its mated to a transmission that won't puke its guts after a few thousand miles like the old GM trannys, even though they are better than F**D or D**ge. Anybody that has pulled a large trailer with a BB and still even compares them to small blocks is a few bricks shy of a full load. Granted the SB's will do the job but not without hedging on abuse. Some people call the 8.1 a slow engine, it not designed to be a drag race engine!!! It is designed to develope a ton of torgue at low RPM's (90% at 1900 rpm) to move heavy objects. Plus the Allison eats up alot of HP because it is a medium duty tranny in a light duty truck. It doesn't always shift smooth, its noisy and it not fuel efficient, it a heavy duty tranny. Thats why you won't see one in a Cadillac. People need to quit comparing the 8.1/allison to the 6.0/chevy tranny, they are like comparing apple and oranges. If you are not pulling heavy trailers or loads you have no business owning one, buy a 6.0 and enjoy. And yes the Westers chip does wake up the 8.1. Both trucks are good trucks, just quit trying to compare them to each other, they are built for two different applications.

HendyPhoto · October 15, 2003

Guys, don't give me hell

WELL, if you feel comfortable without the Allison, go for it. You can ad mods and make that 8.1 as powerful as you want. WELL worth the extra money. That engine is just waiting to be woken up, and doesnt take much. That allison will deliver more HP to the RW than any other transmission.

Do you think the BB8100 is like Dodge' Hemi (it's garbage and doesn't stack up to what it's suppose to be)?

OH YEAH I FORGOT, you can HAVE the hemi, dont even start comparing those apples to GM's oranges.

CMNTMXR81 · October 15, 2003

We've discussed this twice before already and Chevy freak hit it. The differences is nothing more than how GM 's "rating" them publicly for C.A.F.E. requirements in order to stay under the penalty bar.

There is no major differences that equal a loss or increase in power. The same engine, strapped to a dyno will produce within a reasonable window, the same power regardless of which model year it is.

We've also had the discussion of the Hemi's higher HP vs. the BBC's in another thread. I'll see if I can find it. Your explanation is all in there.

CMNTMXR81 · October 15, 2003

Here,

http://www.gm-trucks.com/forums/index.php?...topic=21852&hl=

d2alio · October 15, 2003

Ok perhaps this will lighten up the situation a bit. I don't intend to tow anything any time soon, but I'm sure I will sooner or later. What I'm mostly just looking for is a nice powerful truck... good acceleration.

I will own a horse soon, which is the main reason for the truck, but the truck will also be my daily driver, so it needs to basically carry hay, feed, and i'm sure at some time I will get a trailer when I have to, but not any time soon.

My only reason for even wanting the 2500HD is mainly because GM doesn't offer a 2004 GMC Sierra 1500 Crew Cab...not at least until 2004 anyway, but it looks like it won't be that good.

422 SS · October 15, 2003

Well, where to start. I own a 8.1 and I feel its the best GM engine I have owned. It has a H*LL of alot more power than the old BB's, it gets better MGP than the old BB's and its mated to a transmission that won't puke its guts after a few thousand miles like the old GM trannys, even though they are better than F**D or D**ge. Anybody that has pulled a large trailer with a BB and still even compares them to small blocks is a few bricks shy of a full load. Granted the SB's will do the job but not without hedging on abuse. Some people call the 8.1 a slow engine, it not designed to be a drag race engine!!! It is designed to develope a ton of torgue at low RPM's (90% at 1900 rpm) to move heavy objects. Plus the Allison eats up alot of HP because it is a medium duty tranny in a light duty truck. It doesn't always shift smooth, its noisy and it not fuel efficient, it a heavy duty tranny. Thats why you won't see one in a Cadillac. People need to quit comparing the 8.1/allison to the 6.0/chevy tranny, they are like comparing apple and oranges. If you are not pulling heavy trailers or loads you have no business owning one, buy a 6.0 and enjoy. And yes the Westers chip does wake up the 8.1. Both trucks are good trucks, just quit trying to compare them to each other, they are built for two different applications.

I have pulled 20,000 lbs trailers daily with all 3 of GM's current hd engines and feel I'm more than qualified to compare these vehicles.I would bet money that I work my stuff harder than anyone on this site.The Duramax is the hands down champ as far as pulling power.I felt virtually no difference in towing power between my old 8.1/Ally 3.73 truck and my current 6.0/4L85 4.10 3500 Express cargo van.This is in-town towing in Ohio,it's flat around here.If I lived in the mountains maybe I would think differently.We all know the Ally is the best auto around.I'm just not in awe over the big bad 496

C/K Man · October 16, 2003

About the only difference between a 2003 8100 and the 2004 is that the 2004 will no longer have an EGR valve. There may have been a slight change in PCM calibration too, but in any event if there is a difference in h.p. and torque I doubt that it would be noticeable.

HendyPhoto · October 16, 2003

I am still in AWE over my 496, pulling or not!! But I do tow in the mountains, thats where it's the best! Too bad you didnt get the same performance from your 8.1 as I do!!

MCourson · October 16, 2003

I will lay money mine doesn't make 340 HP on a dyno.

Well of course it wont on a chassis dyno. Driveline HP loss. It probabaly would though if you spent the time to pull the engine and stick it on an engine dyno.

I dont mean to bad mouth and GM engines but I dont think the older BBCs can hold a candle to the 8.1 given the power AND efficiency.