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Diesel Engine

unit731

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unit731 Senior Enthusiast

unit731

Posted
Posted

OK, if you are towing a work trailer or towing a travel trailor, the diesel is probably the best.

 

But no way can I see a working stiff paying all the extra for a diesel engine, then driving 20 - 30 miles to work and back. Never towing anything. In this case, how much extra does the diesel engine cost and how much better - realistically - gas mileage?

 

How much extra does a diesel engine cost? And what is the payback cost over time/miles driven?

svensk Senior Enthusiast

svensk

Posted
Posted

It doesn't pay off. especially now with the government's new diesel engine regulations the costs are even higher. Not to mention because more people are driving diesels than before it drove up the price of diesel fuel to considerably more than gas around the country. You would have to drive that truck more than 5 years to offset the cost of buying and operating it compared to a gasser.

SinisterSS Enthusiast

SinisterSS

Posted
Posted

Last time I ran the numbers, the pay off was somewhere around 300,000 miles. Since I trade trucks about every 1.5 to 2 years, it's not feasible for me.

 

If I towed a trailer every single day or at least a majority of the time, then yes, I'd get a diesel.

 

Since my truck is just the occasional toy hauler on weekends, I went with the best gasser/tranny combo. :devil:

Erik F Enthusiast

Erik F

Posted
Posted

What is the payback time on a Corvette? Some people want Diesel because they want it. Where turbo diesel kicks gassers ass is when you want to put a tune on it. Try getting 600 ft/lbs of tq out of any production GM gasser.

iminaquagmire Enthusiast

iminaquagmire

Posted
Posted

Performance. Its not all about towing. Without a whole lot of difficulty, you add 150+ HP and a lot of extra torque to a diesel. IMO its also a better answer to environmental issues than E85. If I had the money, a Duramax would be in the driveway.

mini1 Enthusiast

mini1

Posted
Posted
Last time I ran the numbers, the pay off was somewhere around 300,000 miles. Since I trade trucks about every 1.5 to 2 years, it's not feasible for me.

 

If I towed a trailer every single day or at least a majority of the time, then yes, I'd get a diesel.

 

Since my truck is just the occasional toy hauler on weekends, I went with the best gasser/tranny combo. :devil:

 

 

A DMAX is also worth considerably more then a gasser when you trade/sell your truck and it holds more of it's residual value over a gasser. You don't need to drive anywhere near 300,000 miles to your money's worth out of a DMAX. Let someone else do that for you. Those engines could easily achieve 300k+ miles, so that's not a worry.

NathanL Enthusiast

NathanL

Posted
Posted

I bought a diesel in 2000. At that time it added an extra $4500 to the price. Even tho I do tow with it I still wanted to see what that difference was.

 

At that time full size trucks were getting 16mpg highway. My diesel has gotten 20mpg since almost new and continues to still get 20mpg with 108k miles on it. That's with no load on the highway, with a boat on the highway, or even our travel trailer on the highway it's always 20mpg.

 

So that's 6mpg difference in mileage on the long haul. We have no "town" around here so I never figure mileage in town. Even with the new sulfur regulations for diesel - diesel is still cheaper than gasoline for 8 months out of the year - at least it is here. The winter months you pay more for diesel, but I would say it averages out the same and doesn't seem to spike around holidays and summer like gasoline. For the first 4-5 years after I bought it in 2000 diesel was a good .30 a gallon cheaper than gas so that helped as well.

 

Today those numbers would be different because new full size trucks get better mileage. Supposidly the sticker on my new z-71 says 20 highway. I don't think it will do 20mpg highway but it will do better than the 15-16mpg of trucks even 6-7 years ago.

 

I can say where it pays off is in value held if you want to go that route. I paid $26,000 for my 2000 Ford F-250 7.3 Turbo Diesel. Private sale price listed today is right at $14,000 or more than 50% of what I paid for it with over 100k miles on it.

 

Not sure my z-71 in 7 years will be worth >50% what I paid for it with 100k miles and the 5.3 engine.

 

When I bought it I was worried about maintenance but it's been the most maintenence free engine I've ever used. Nothing outside normal filter changes/oil changes etc...not even the cam posistion sensor which is a normal item has failed.

 

I still have it and plan on literally keeping it forever and I now the engine will keep on going for longer than the life of the body.

 

As a side note it's taking getting used to driving my new gas engine Chevy as I have to remember I have to push down on the gas pedal going up hill where on the diesel for the most part it never really had to.

Jameson Enthusiast

Jameson

Posted
Posted

add an intake, 4" turbo back exhaust, and a reputable 6 position chip (TS, Bullydog etc etc) and you add about 175HP and 250 lb/ft to your stock diesel truck. I wish I had a diesel :devil:. You can easily make that crew cab diesel 4x4 run low 13's. More power efficient then gassers I think.

Silverado4x4 Senior Enthusiast

Silverado4x4

Posted
Posted

 

 

What is the payback time on a Corvette? Some people want Diesel because they want it. Where turbo diesel kicks gassers ass is when you want to put a tune on it. Try getting 600 ft/lbs of tq out of any production GM gasser.
You can get that power out of the diesel but you WILL kill the motor and drivetrain over time greatly reducing the life of the powertrain. I just sold my diesel back in febuary cause I didnt tow anymore and couldnt justify keeping it, I dont know about everybody else but I buy trucks to do work and could care a less how fast it is. Big power comes at a big price
Genuinefine409 Enthusiast

Genuinefine409

Posted
Posted
What is the payback time on a Corvette? Some people want Diesel because they want it. Where turbo diesel kicks gassers ass is when you want to put a tune on it. Try getting 600 ft/lbs of tq out of any production GM gasser.
You can get that power out of the diesel but you WILL kill the motor and drivetrain over time greatly reducing the life of the powertrain. I just sold my diesel back in febuary cause I didnt tow anymore and couldnt justify keeping it, I dont know about everybody else but I buy trucks to do work and could care a less how fast it is. Big power comes at a big price

 

 

 

A friend of mine has a really nice King Ranch F-350 with the 6.0 Powerstroke. He is always bragging how much faster his truck is(has all kinds of crap done to it) and how much tougher his diesel is. I have a 2500HD CC with a 6.0 and a little ways back after leaving the race track he was doing his usual idiot stunts like spining the tires and what not. He passed me on the highway and about five minutes later I caught up to him, he was pulled over with hood up and smoke/steam going everywhere, again. Needless to say, I took my trailer home, came back for his trailer, then came back with my empty trailer to take his Powerjoke home. And as for getting 600ft/lbs of tourqe out of a production gasser, its fairly easy if you supercharge or turbo charge the 8.1. I like the 6.0 gasser and I have no use for a Dmax. Everyone of course will have their own opinion and will use what works best for them. BTW, the Powerjoke was replaced like 3 times and had overheating problems and head problems for some time. Ford sucks.

cc1999 Enthusiast

cc1999

Posted
Posted

I am really suprised that only one person mentioned resale value. That is the key to the diesels value and and overall ownership cost. Power is good, fuel mileage is 15-30% better depending on rather you are comparing them to 1/2 ton trucks or other gas 3/4-1ton trucks. Its really pretty simple as to why most of my 3/4 ton trucks I run in my business are all diesels. Yes its true diesel today is 5-10% more expensive than gas, but just a few months ago it was the other way around at the start of this summer gas was 3.25 a gallon and diesel was still 2.65 a gallon. The fuel cost aside unless it exceededs the 25-30% range over gas you still save with the diesel. I did a study prior to purchasing 14 new diesel 3/4 ton trucks back in 2005-2006. The key was the resale value. In most all cases the entire cost of the diesel engine option was recaptured upon resale. Now we do rotate out our fleet trucks at 80-90k, so I was not looking at 200k averages, those might be different. So when you have to look at the engine as pretty much a opion that retains all of its initial cost, then all that really comes into play is the opperating cost. In the end the for me to go with the diesels over the gas 3/4 option, I am saving on average 20% in my total ownership cost.

 

Unless you are that rare buyer that keeps there vehichels 10 years and dives them or tows them to the scrap heap when there done, the diesel option is a viable one, with a savings in the end rather you drive it 2 years and 30k or 5 years and 100k. The total cost is in the diesels favor.

NathanL Enthusiast

NathanL

Posted
Posted

One thing people overlook on mileage when comparing diesel to gas is when towing.

 

My diesel gets 20mpg no matter what I hook to it. My boat, my travel trailer, or a full trailer full of hay that weighs no telling how much. If you had a gas doing that it might get 17mpg on the highway but if your towing at the max of the truck you might get half that at times. I can drive 85mph everywhere I go with no load and still get 20mpg. I floor it at red lights and still get 20mpg...that's the beauty of the diesel.

 

I know this doesn't pertain to the original question.

 

To me the ONLY drawback to a diesel isn't initial cost, fuel cost - but rather weight. The newer smaller diesels might weigh less but my 7.3 is a heavy engine and I'd never use it off road as I've seen too many of them just sink under thier own weight in sandy type stuff just sitting still.

rogerf Enthusiast

rogerf

Posted
Posted

I just got rid of my diesel nightmare (2005 Jeep Liberty). Have owned and worked around diesel engines for better than 20 years. There is nothing good to be said about this new generation of EGR diesels set-up for 2005+ emissions. This completely trashes the combustion efficiency of a diesel leading to an array of mechanical issues.

 

If you are buying a diesel for economy, this '07 Silverado 4X4 is cheaper to run than that 4-banger Jeep diesel after you factor in the premium cost of ULSD and synthetic oils. If you are buying for reliability....well don't even go there, it's not worth the frustration.

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