4lo Torque Management

[Snow White]

I put it in 4lo last friday on a job site to climb a nasty muddy hill, 4hi might have worked, heck 2wd would've been more fun but i wasn't there to screw around... anyways, i put it in 4lo and when i tried moving it acted like you were starting in 2nd gear with a huge amount of torque management.

 

pretty amazing what it will do in 4lo, seemed like a tank.

[oldmann]

So.... was it good or bad?

[Mckenzie]

or a tractor!!!! But yea seriously 4LO is badass gear, when i put my 01 in 4LO and take it out of neutral it jumps too. That being said, i very rarely use 4LO b/c 4HI can do a much better job 9 times out of 10

[stefman722]

I can't tell if your saying 4 low is good or if it is bad....haha! You need to clarify

[uchi]

a common missconception with gearing is that low range is needed to get through mud. it really isnt. ideally you want wheel speed to clear the mud out of your tires so that they can grab traction again and keep you moving. lo range you reduce your wheel speed drastically and you wont get through mud as easily as you will in 4 hi. with our v8 trucks lo range really isnt needed unless we need to say pull something thats stuck out of a hole and we have traction, then lo range is perfect. backing a boat down a steep loading ramp into the water, lo range is great as you can let the engine do alot of the worlk and dont have to work the tranny as hard. but other than that i bet you truck would have climbed that hill better in hi if it was really slippery and you had alot of wheel spin happening. that being said, if that hill wasnt as slippery and was dry 4 lo would have been perfect as you could have idleing your way up it without a problem.

 

i used to do alot of offroading and have had my fair share of trucks. any of my trucks that had v8s in them id leave in 4 hi and go. the increase in wheel speed would get me through most mud holes because the tires woulc clean themselves out with speed. the only time id ever use lo range was in any of my smaller motor trucks but even then id hit a hole in second or third gear vs first, hell there were many times in my old 87 toyota that id be in a hole that was really thick and id power shift that poor t case into lo range with the tires spinning still. sure it grinded a bit but that little truck was tough as hell

 

so remember, lo range is best for times where you have traction and need to either move something heavy or go up a steep incline or decline as the engine braking will slow you down and you wont have to use your brakes as much, and 4 hi is used anytime you are in something slippery and need to get through it

[kdixer]

a common missconception with gearing is that low range is needed to get through mud. it really isnt. ideally you want wheel speed to clear the mud out of your tires so that they can grab traction again and keep you moving. lo range you reduce your wheel speed drastically and you wont get through mud as easily as you will in 4 hi. with our v8 trucks lo range really isnt needed unless we need to say pull something thats stuck out of a hole and we have traction, then lo range is perfect. backing a boat down a steep loading ramp into the water, lo range is great as you can let the engine do alot of the worlk and dont have to work the tranny as hard. but other than that i bet you truck would have climbed that hill better in hi if it was really slippery and you had alot of wheel spin happening. that being said, if that hill wasnt as slippery and was dry 4 lo would have been perfect as you could have idleing your way up it without a problem.

 

i used to do alot of offroading and have had my fair share of trucks. any of my trucks that had v8s in them id leave in 4 hi and go. the increase in wheel speed would get me through most mud holes because the tires woulc clean themselves out with speed. the only time id ever use lo range was in any of my smaller motor trucks but even then id hit a hole in second or third gear vs first, hell there were many times in my old 87 toyota that id be in a hole that was really thick and id power shift that poor t case into lo range with the tires spinning still. sure it grinded a bit but that little truck was tough as hell

 

so remember, lo range is best for times where you have traction and need to either move something heavy or go up a steep incline or decline as the engine braking will slow you down and you wont have to use your brakes as much, and 4 hi is used anytime you are in something slippery and need to get through it

 

 

I disagree with your theory about low range and mud (for my area anyways). Around here we have alot of clay mud which is really sticky. Low range is a benefit because once you start spinning that stuff just slicks over like hard packed snow. Plus maneuvering a vehicle around a rutted up gas well road is way easier in low range rather than hitting it hard and possibly sliding into a nearby tree or beating your suspension to death. 4 Low definately has it's place around here. 4 Wheeling around here does not involve many open field mud pits. It is usually a fire or gas well road through the mountains with a steep bank on one side and a steep drop off on the other. Not much room for slipping and sliding.

 

4 wheel drive engagement is purely situational and is totally up to the driver to know when and how to use it. There are times when it helps and times when it can get you into trouble. There are no situations where I would feel comfortable telling someone "you should always do..." because every situation is slightly different.

[uchi]

i agree with you 100% on that. its purely situational as to where and how you use it. clay is the worst to get into, i had my quad buried in clay and third gear off the rev limiter wouldnt clear my tires out and they have some big lugs on them. but at the same time going through it in first got my stuck while trying to be finessful. the point i was getting at is that you need wheel speed to clean the mud out of your tires. once they gum up you might aswell have gone in on a set of slicks as there wont be a difference to traction. lo range wont provide you with as much wheel speed as hi will, so for climbing a hill thats got lots of mud where you cant be smooth up it and need to spin your tires, 4 hi is your best option. but for situations like yours id use lo range aswell. hell lo range will get you through most stuff you encounter but there will be times where youll want more wheel speed to get you through something and thats where 4 hi works best

 

a common missconception with gearing is that low range is needed to get through mud. it really isnt. ideally you want wheel speed to clear the mud out of your tires so that they can grab traction again and keep you moving. lo range you reduce your wheel speed drastically and you wont get through mud as easily as you will in 4 hi. with our v8 trucks lo range really isnt needed unless we need to say pull something thats stuck out of a hole and we have traction, then lo range is perfect. backing a boat down a steep loading ramp into the water, lo range is great as you can let the engine do alot of the worlk and dont have to work the tranny as hard. but other than that i bet you truck would have climbed that hill better in hi if it was really slippery and you had alot of wheel spin happening. that being said, if that hill wasnt as slippery and was dry 4 lo would have been perfect as you could have idleing your way up it without a problem.

 

i used to do alot of offroading and have had my fair share of trucks. any of my trucks that had v8s in them id leave in 4 hi and go. the increase in wheel speed would get me through most mud holes because the tires woulc clean themselves out with speed. the only time id ever use lo range was in any of my smaller motor trucks but even then id hit a hole in second or third gear vs first, hell there were many times in my old 87 toyota that id be in a hole that was really thick and id power shift that poor t case into lo range with the tires spinning still. sure it grinded a bit but that little truck was tough as hell

 

so remember, lo range is best for times where you have traction and need to either move something heavy or go up a steep incline or decline as the engine braking will slow you down and you wont have to use your brakes as much, and 4 hi is used anytime you are in something slippery and need to get through it

 

 

I disagree with your theory about low range and mud (for my area anyways). Around here we have alot of clay mud which is really sticky. Low range is a benefit because once you start spinning that stuff just slicks over like hard packed snow. Plus maneuvering a vehicle around a rutted up gas well road is way easier in low range rather than hitting it hard and possibly sliding into a nearby tree or beating your suspension to death. 4 Low definately has it's place around here. 4 Wheeling around here does not involve many open field mud pits. It is usually a fire or gas well road through the mountains with a steep bank on one side and a steep drop off on the other. Not much room for slipping and sliding.

 

4 wheel drive engagement is purely situational and is totally up to the driver to know when and how to use it. There are times when it helps and times when it can get you into trouble. There are no situations where I would feel comfortable telling someone "you should always do..." because every situation is slightly different.

 

 

[uchi]

also just to be clear, i wasnt telling anyone to hit mud roads at 60 mph and hope for the best. for the fire roads like you mentioned lo range is fine especially since the truck will usually walk itself out of the ruts and you wont have to use too much throttle for them. just when you get into a slippery mud situation where you need to clear those tires. oh and back to clay, the stuff is nasty, i watched a guy in my offroad club with an older sierra turbo diesel get buried pretty bad. this guy had a good 15 inches of lift and 44+ inch boggers and got stuck in this clay, the tires gummed up and that was the end of that. its some real tricky stuff to get through

i agree with you 100% on that. its purely situational as to where and how you use it. clay is the worst to get into, i had my quad buried in clay and third gear off the rev limiter wouldnt clear my tires out and they have some big lugs on them. but at the same time going through it in first got my stuck while trying to be finessful. the point i was getting at is that you need wheel speed to clean the mud out of your tires. once they gum up you might aswell have gone in on a set of slicks as there wont be a difference to traction. lo range wont provide you with as much wheel speed as hi will, so for climbing a hill thats got lots of mud where you cant be smooth up it and need to spin your tires, 4 hi is your best option. but for situations like yours id use lo range aswell. hell lo range will get you through most stuff you encounter but there will be times where youll want more wheel speed to get you through something and thats where 4 hi works best

 

a common missconception with gearing is that low range is needed to get through mud. it really isnt. ideally you want wheel speed to clear the mud out of your tires so that they can grab traction again and keep you moving. lo range you reduce your wheel speed drastically and you wont get through mud as easily as you will in 4 hi. with our v8 trucks lo range really isnt needed unless we need to say pull something thats stuck out of a hole and we have traction, then lo range is perfect. backing a boat down a steep loading ramp into the water, lo range is great as you can let the engine do alot of the worlk and dont have to work the tranny as hard. but other than that i bet you truck would have climbed that hill better in hi if it was really slippery and you had alot of wheel spin happening. that being said, if that hill wasnt as slippery and was dry 4 lo would have been perfect as you could have idleing your way up it without a problem.

 

i used to do alot of offroading and have had my fair share of trucks. any of my trucks that had v8s in them id leave in 4 hi and go. the increase in wheel speed would get me through most mud holes because the tires woulc clean themselves out with speed. the only time id ever use lo range was in any of my smaller motor trucks but even then id hit a hole in second or third gear vs first, hell there were many times in my old 87 toyota that id be in a hole that was really thick and id power shift that poor t case into lo range with the tires spinning still. sure it grinded a bit but that little truck was tough as hell

 

so remember, lo range is best for times where you have traction and need to either move something heavy or go up a steep incline or decline as the engine braking will slow you down and you wont have to use your brakes as much, and 4 hi is used anytime you are in something slippery and need to get through it

 

 

I disagree with your theory about low range and mud (for my area anyways). Around here we have alot of clay mud which is really sticky. Low range is a benefit because once you start spinning that stuff just slicks over like hard packed snow. Plus maneuvering a vehicle around a rutted up gas well road is way easier in low range rather than hitting it hard and possibly sliding into a nearby tree or beating your suspension to death. 4 Low definately has it's place around here. 4 Wheeling around here does not involve many open field mud pits. It is usually a fire or gas well road through the mountains with a steep bank on one side and a steep drop off on the other. Not much room for slipping and sliding.

 

4 wheel drive engagement is purely situational and is totally up to the driver to know when and how to use it. There are times when it helps and times when it can get you into trouble. There are no situations where I would feel comfortable telling someone "you should always do..." because every situation is slightly different.

 

 

 

[music]

I disagree with your theory about low range and mud (for my area anyways).

 

You beat me to it. You do NOT want to spin in clay/mud. I've buried a Bobcat up to where you couldn't use the arms to push out. We live on a fairly steep hill, and you can't walk on it at it's worst. We had an emergency last year, and I had to give it a shot. I would not have attempted it otherwise, as the packed/slick snow had frozen to ice (well past dark). Didn't slip a tire going down or coming back up, and used 4-hi all the way to the hospital (very few other cars on the road). Excellent performance overall.

[uchi]

In the clay no. But your tires will eventually fill up with mud and either you're gonna have to get a stick and clean them off or spin your tires to get the mud off. Snow is very different. You spin in the snow and you create ice under the tires with snow you don't want the tires spinning. But anytime you're in mud and start to loose traction what's the first thing you do? Give it more gas and that spins the tires clears the mud and propels you forward. Well either that or you back up and try a little faster lol. Try it next time you're in the mud. Try together through something sloppy with out spinning the tires

I disagree with your theory about low range and mud (for my area anyways).

 

You beat me to it. You do NOT want to spin in clay/mud. I've buried a Bobcat up to where you couldn't use the arms to push out. We live on a fairly steep hill, and you can't walk on it at it's worst. We had an emergency last year, and I had to give it a shot. I would not have attempted it otherwise, as the packed/slick snow had frozen to ice (well past dark). Didn't slip a tire going down or coming back up, and used 4-hi all the way to the hospital (very few other cars on the road). Excellent performance overall.

 

[uchi]

Better yet. Go on YouTube and watch some videos of guys running through mud lots of tire spinning going on. The opposite goes for sand. You spin you sink. I'm not as crazy as you think. Lol

[Crazy Canuck]

What about the old saying: '4 hi gets you into trouble, 4 low gets you out of it'?

 

I think the most important aspect of 'when to use 4 ho or 4 low' is to know your truck's capabilities and the terrain/conditions that you are operating in. Every situation and every truck (tires/condition/etc.) are different. Personally, I put my truck in 4 low when hauling a fair sized boat up a slippery ramp, or going through very deep snow on an unplowed backroad, which we see here often enough. Most other adverse conditions, I am a 4 hi kind of guy, except mud, never really had the truck in it - bought myself a quad for that.

[uchi]

They each have their place. With the torque our motors make we should have no issues spinning the tires in the mud in hi. Mind you lo will work in the mud and I'm not saying its useless. I'm just saying it isn't always needed. Hell I used to off-road my explorer and used to use hi everywhere. The only times I used lo was for hill climbs that were steep buthad traction and for decending hills. Other than that I kept her in hi. Intact there was one slippery hill I used hi for and that's because I needed to keep the tires spinning to get up it. After a few lo range attempts I just didn't have thewheel speed to get up. But its really up to the driver and conditions and each situation is different. Ill use lo to move my trailer around my property because that way I just control the brakes and the engine and gearing move it with no throttle input.

What about the old saying: '4 hi gets you into trouble, 4 low gets you out of it'?

 

I think the most important aspect of 'when to use 4 ho or 4 low' is to know your truck's capabilities and the terrain/conditions that you are operating in. Every situation and every truck (tires/condition/etc.) are different. Personally, I put my truck in 4 low when hauling a fair sized boat up a slippery ramp, or going through very deep snow on an unplowed backroad, which we see here often enough. Most other adverse conditions, I am a 4 hi kind of guy, except mud, never really had the truck in it - bought myself a quad for that.

[leverlution]

You are both right. No sense in arguing. As was said, usage of 4 wheel drive is strictly SITUATIONAL.

 

Most the time, in most circumstances, for mud 4 hi is better. As was said, you HAVE to have wheel speed.

 

On the other hand, WV is VERY different than people think it is. The saying "almost heaven" is true because EVERYWHERE in WV is up high on a mountain, and everywhere ou go you are climbing STEEP hills to get closer to God :-D. Seriously though, unless you have land out in the sticks of middle WV, you cannot possibly picture of imagine what its like to do" everyday" tasks on your property there. Anytime I buy a new vehicle I get on google and call a random dealer in WV and ask about it, to get their opinion on how it prforms THERE..hence my 5.3 instead of the 4.8 I wanted and lack of 8ft bed. Most people in WV where our property is have oil and natural gas wells all through their mountains (nothing in wv is flat really), or the previous owners did. At least properties with decent amount of land attached. To get to these pumps, storage containers etc are access roads. Kinda like logging roads. They typically run all through your property as most things are spread out everywhere. These roads only really get maintained when they redo a contract or have to do work there (pipelines etc). Usually only once every 15+ years. Because of the rain and heavy snows, and everything being steep ridges/mountains, water runs heavily through these roads. That, along with atvs and hunters, rut the hell out of them. Add in WV red clay mud everywhere, the fact that every one of these roads are steeper than most people would believe (can't see the road while going up usually), and the fact that almost all have a clif on one side and mountain side on the other makes them sketchy. Most are only wide enough to be called atv trails, but a pickup is necessary when you are checking your property or doing work on it etc. Control is a BIG factor in these situations. Does the lack of wheel speed hurt? Yup, but most wv boys compensate with tires and skill. There is a big pipeline going in right now. The owner of the company is from Texas. He was showing some wv boys from another buisness the progress, and rolled a brand new polaris side by side down a ridge because he was following texas mud skills. The wv boys had him airlifted out, then rode 15 miles of pipeline right away by themselves and came back fine.

 

you both are right, and it REALLY depends on the situation and how the truck is set up. I typically use 4hi up, and 4 low down myself, but our roads were just re done by pipeline guys. Before in my jeep it really depended on the ground condition (wet, dry, slick clay, layers of dirt on top etc).

[kdixer]

I had a 00' Dodge Ram 5spd a few years back. We had about 12" of fresh snow and I went to visit my girlfriend (now wife). Her parking spot was bordered with railroad ties. I backed in all the way to what I thought was the railroad tie so my truck could not slide downhill. When I went to leave I tried to pull out in 2wd. The truck spun and I feathered the clutch to "rock" the truck. But instead of stopping at the railroad tie the truck rolled over it and the rear tires dropped off the down hill side of the tie. The snow had made a nice little ramp and I could not tell I was rolling over the tie until it was too late. I put the truck in 4 hi and attempted to get out. All I did was spin. I decided to try 4 Low before calling for a pull. I let the truck roll back a couple of feet and just let out on the clutch without touching the throttle. The truck never slipped a wheel climbing up over the railroad tie and out of that parking spot. I could not pull out on the hill without rolling back and over powering the grip the tires had on the snow. But in 4 Low I did not even have to use the throttle, all I had to do was release the clutch slowly and it tranferred power to the wheels very smoothly.

 

Sometimes a smooth controlled takeoff is what you really need to get unstuck. GM uses this logic when you put your transmission in 2nd gear. It will pull out in 2nd to try to control wheel spin.