Am I missing something?

pacodiablo · April 18, 2003

I was looking at the Isuzu dealership’s inventory a noticed something. They haven’t even ordered any 2003 Rodeo Sports yet. The lot is still filled with Troopers which are no longer imported here and most of the attention seems to be directed at the Ford dealer next door. Though I am a Ford fan, this upsets me because the attention of the public has been diverted to a menacing disgrace to the road – the Expedition. Its smaller sibling, the Explorer, isn’t too great either. In fact they are filled with flaws. Number one, both have fully independent suspensions all around. Maybe I was getting this whole SUV thing wrong, but aren’t SUVs meant to be capable off-road machines and not obese yuppie haulers? I swear the Expedition sits no more than 6 inches off the ground and the Explorer is just barely higher. Not only that, but both are selling for what, $40K? I am sorry, but for something that I will be getting dirty and actually using, that is way too much of my money to lose to depreciation. So, are people buying them to represent their status? Well, if their status is an #######, they are working. I am not trying to single out the Expedition, only use it as an example. There are certainly others out there. Another stomach turning example is the Honda Pilot. I am sorry, but anything based off of a mini-van is not a truck! Honda was actually daring or stupid enough to call it a truck in their brochure. A truck has a body on frame design. A truck has a solid rear axle. A truck can be put to work.

Now, we still haven’t figured out why the Isuzu trucks are sitting still in the dealer lot. Just what is wrong with them? Did they contract SARS on their way to America? Is their price too low? Are they not a good enough status symbol? Really, pound for pound and dollar for dollar the Isuzu is the better vehicle when compared to the Pilot or any other poseur. It has plenty of power…the V6 models sport 205 HP and many are available with this nifty little thing called a manual transmission. Guess what, you have to shift it all by yourself, but you will save about $1K. As if the nice power numbers aren’t enough, it gets about 22 MPG. Not bad if you ask me. It also has this strange thing called a “solid axle” in the rear. It is a #### of a lot better than IRS when doing what SUVs were meant to do. Not only that, there is this feature called “low-range” on 4WD models, guess what, it will get you over more than ant hills. Looks are an opinion, but I think the Rodeo and Rodeo Sport look pretty #### good. Finally, one thing that really sets this SUV apart from the poseurs is the price. 2 doors start at $13,600. Sure, there is no radio, no leather, even no A/C, but it can take a lickin’ and keep on tickin’. If you need the above features, you can get them. And guess what, it will still cost less than a fake. So, why exactly are the real SUVs being ignored? Sorry, “because they don’t ride like cars” is not a good excuse, not when they were never meant to ride like cars. If your ass is that delicate, buy a car.

bassdog · April 18, 2003

First of all paco, you have too much time on your hands

Do you remember the station wagon? This vehicle was everywhere in it's time. It was a family hauler, power to pull a camper / trailer, and plenty of room to haul groceries. It was the "original" soccer mom car.

Basically an SUV is the same thing in todays standards. Not too many station wagons around any more... Subaru and Saturn make one.

Most SUV's are what the station wagon use to be, a family hauler, grocery getter, soccer mom vehicle with 4WD and that's it. People feel safer in a 4WD or AWD vehicle nowadays. They may not BE safer, but that is what companies are trying to sell.

I agree, they show most of them going offroad, but it's just an image. How many "family" vehicles does anyone see offroad? Not many, but the option is there for some light trails or dirt roads if they choose.

Isuzu's are good vehicles...how often to you see one advertised on TV? Rarely. Why, I don't know. If Isuzu isn't selling that "image" on TV, they aren't going to sell like the big three.

Just my .02

Z71GUY · April 18, 2003

The market dictates what the car company's produce. If those trucks are not selling, obviously no one wants them. If the Ford SUV's are selling with their IRS, its because people want that now. Most of the SUV's are family haulers...NOT off-road machines. You need to change your definition of SUV.

pacodiablo · April 18, 2003

People can get mini-vans though. 3 different mini-vans have available AWD or 4WD. And SUVs are no longer a status symbol, not a good one anyway. Nobody wants to be the ####### on his or her cell phone with 5 screaming kids in their Expedition.

Z71GUY · April 18, 2003

People can get mini-vans though. 3 different mini-vans have available AWD or 4WD. And SUVs are no longer a status symbol, not a good one anyway. Nobody wants to be the ####### on his or her cell phone with 5 screaming kids in their Expedition.

Nope. Like I said, the market will dictate what they produce. Sure there will be some lag time between the "trendy" item and the automaker.

Why does this bug you? There are plenty of vehicles to pick from today. If you want a work truck with a SFA & SRA they are out there...if you want a truck to do light duty and have a nice ride, they are out there. If you want a SUV that is great off-road, they are out there...if you want a SUV that rides like a car, but has 4wheel drive and is larger than a car...they are out there. Todays auto market is larger than it ever has been...personally I think its great. Gives me more choices to pick from...

I dont think anyone should say "you shouldnt be driving that car/truck/suv" because they feel you are not using it for the correct purpose. If someone doesnt want a minivan for their own personal reasons, thats fine by me. Its their hard earned $$$$, not anyone elses.

CMNTMXR81 · April 18, 2003

There is also a "Mini-Van" stigma.

American's like Big, Powerful (well not the ford's anyway ), Brawny, Muscular looking vehicles. IF this were not the case, Ford and Chevy wouldn't sell nearly every one of their large SUV's and Subaru would be the manufacturer with the largest market share with their rinky, dinky AWD sedans, coupes and hatchbacks.

You're right, back in the day, an SUV was a pickemup truck with a full body instead of a bed. It rode on a full length set of frame rails from bumper to bumper, had two solid axles, the 4WD system was a stick shifted manual hubbed utilitarian vehicles. They lacked little comfort. Just a couple of seats, a steering wheel and a few pedals. It was more directed at Men and men who wanted an alternative to a pickup

The rise of the SUV conincided with the fall of the full size station wagon. IT at the time, was the family hauler. It too utilized a full length frame from bumper to bumper but was generally more civilized than it's bigger, taller SUV counterpart.

However, the gas crunch of the 70's came. Both vehicles faced tough times, but this is where they took two different paths. Station Wagons died because they were supplanted with alternative type vehicles from both sides of the ocean. Could they tow the family boat. Most could not, but in those times, things were a bit different than 10 years prior in terms of mentality. Meanwhile, the SUV which WASN'T under attack from the imports and still did serve some mechanical purpose soldiered it's way on. Bronco's, Blazer's and Suburban's were still wildly popular among the same demographic I mentioned above.

Two alternatives cropped up on the scene, both from American manufacturers. One was the Mini-Van from Chrysler. The Dodge Caravan and it's siblings changed the way American families drove. At the same time, both Jeep and GM introduced a new SUV. One that maintained many of the features of it's big SUV's, in a smaller, more efficient, more user friendly version.....the compact SUV. 1982, GM brought out the S-10 pickup, which then spawned the 1983 S-10 Blazer. I think Jeep also hit the market in '83 with it's Cherokee. A year later, ford answered with the BroncoII. What is important about these little SUV's is that they are responsible for the market today. They didn't INVENT the SUV, they REFINED the SUV.

The S-10 Blazer, until the 1990 Explorer hit the market was the best selling SUV ever (sans military Jeeps of the war era). It was popular because it combined cargo capacity, respectable (for the time) towing capacity, and a full length bumper to bumper frame. It introduced the IFS 4WD suspension along with Toyota's mini trucks. It delivered all those mechanicals in a package that was cozier, therefore more user friendly. The occupants didn't need to yell for them to hear each other and they didn't need to see a dentist afterwords.

Then came the ford Explorer. It literally overnight changed the way the world viewed SUV's. Yes, the Chevy's were mecahnically superior to their ford counterpart (yes, Paco, they were!) but they were leapfrogged in terms of occupant comfort features. Shortly thereafter, this became the hottest and most highly competitive market segment on the planet. Every manufacturer entered the ring with their version. Each of their versions introduced more occupant comforts while still being able to do what SUV's did best.

1995 came about, the market was in a fever pitch, and GM unleashed the new Blazer. No more "S-10", just "Blazer". I remember full size K5 guys having a coronary that the little Blazer got the name and their new 4 door version of the K5 got named "Tahoe". GM in one year, left the market on the floor. Ford also answered that year with a re-vamped explorer, and set the stage for the sales wars we have today.

That introduction in 95 of the Tahoe ushered in a new era for the large SUV. Ford realized this and realizing they had been left in the dust for years, unloaded the Expedition in 97 and later the Excursion. Both camps (GM and ford) sold EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE BIG SUV's THEY COULD!

Why? Because not only did they possess the true truck heritage's of their P/U bretheren, they did it with all the comfort and convience of the smaller SUV's and other cars on the road.

Ever since then it has been a race to make them the most comfortable and accomodating vehicles that GM, ford, and the other manufacturer's can. One particular demographic that had been slowly on the rise over the years was now a MAJOR influence in automotive purchases both with their significant others, but on their own......WOMEN!!!

Women, don't want to climb into a 10ft tall doorway when they're wearing a skirt! As much as a I'd like to be the ground underneath! I can't tell you of the swearing I'd hear from my G/F, Mother, Sister, and Grandmother when one of them would try to get into my HD. That was until I put the Nerf Bars on. Just think, that's a lower truck as is than a ford and Dodge. Imagine the profanity they'd spew getting into one of those! They aren't into all the MACHO, MANLINESS that we are. They don't want their fillings in their teeth rattled loose from one drive to Home Depot. However, they too realized the UTILITY abilities of such vehicle. My mother drive my HD all the time!

As such, manufacturer's had to adapt. They now have to balance both the needs of men as well as the surging market of females. Sorry to tell you MANLY MEN that little fact. The manufacturer's have realized the goldmine in the female population and you can expect to continue the comfort and convenience features to continue to improve and expand as time goes on.

I too am not a big fan of IRS on the Expo and Explorer. I feel it too soft when you have a trailer on the hitch. I also wonder about the travel it'll have in relation to the little holes it goes through in the frame. But my guess is that it is here to stay and will become even more popular and you'll see other trick packaging methods in the future.

Isuzu doesn't sell a lot of SUV's because it isn't perceived well as such. A few years back (late 90's) for now was probably the best Isuzu has ever saw. They had a variety of unique and sometimes wierd (VehiCross) SUV's. The Trooper's and Rodeo's had their following, but the Amigo's and VehiCross'es soon fell out of popularity due to their shortcomings. For instance, if you were an Amigo owner, don't plan on investing much in a stereo system. Otherwise, the minute you leave the vehicle...it's gone. And the VehiCross was just dorky! I think I can count the number of them I've seen on the road on both my hands. The Axiom just flat out never caught on. As it is now, the relationship between GM and Isuzu, now you'll just see re-badged TrailBlazer's on Isuzu's lot. Nothing to big and exciting going on.

Conversely across the street, you have a ford dealer. ford has a high ranking (in terms of sales) P/U, multiple SUV's, and many other vehicles that are "hot" and popular. That is why you see a ton of traffic to them and nothing at the Isuzu dealer.

It's called evolution. If GM and ford continued to make their Tahoe's and Suburban's, Expedition's and for now, the Excursion with the mechanicals like they did in the early 70's.....no one would be buying them!

pacodiablo · April 18, 2003

People can get mini-vans though. 3 different mini-vans have available AWD or 4WD. And SUVs are no longer a status symbol, not a good one anyway. Nobody wants to be the ####### on his or her cell phone with 5 screaming kids in their Expedition.

Nope. Like I said, the market will dictate what they produce. Sure there will be some lag time between the "trendy" item and the automaker.

Why does this bug you? There are plenty of vehicles to pick from today. If you want a work truck with a SFA & SRA they are out there...if you want a truck to do light duty and have a nice ride, they are out there. If you want a SUV that is great off-road, they are out there...if you want a SUV that rides like a car, but has 4wheel drive and is larger than a car...they are out there. Todays auto market is larger than it ever has been...personally I think its great. Gives me more choices to pick from...

I dont think anyone should say "you shouldnt be driving that car/truck/suv" because they feel you are not using it for the correct purpose. If someone doesnt want a minivan for their own personal reasons, thats fine by me. Its their hard earned $$$$, not anyone elses.

My choices are very limited though.

In the SUV category the Isuzu Rodeo, Mitsubishi Montero Sport and Suzuki Vitara are the only trucks that fit in my price range and needs. The Expedition is useless. Besides, they have lost their muscular look, they look more like pregnant whales to me.

The problem with the Axiom is that Isuzu did the reverse of the trend. They wanted to draw in would be crossover buyers, but the fact that the Axiom was based on a real truck made it a hard sell, which is unfourtunate. Isuzu is moving in the right direction with the Rodeo. They are keeping the price low, the content high and the roots intact. If this saves the company, we will find out soon. The Acesender is an attractive truck, but the fact that there are three other clones on the market as well doesn't help Isuzu the least bit. Hopefully the D-Max, the platform for the Colorado and Canyon (yes, Isuzu made it first and GM had to use the blue prints because they ####ed up their first S-10 replacement), will make it to our shores. It is already a hot seller in the South Pacific and will likely continue to be one. At least one test model has been spotted in the Western US undergoing testing.

What bothers me so much about the current SUVs is how they have littered the SUV market. They have come, uninvited, to a guest's house, complained about everything, and changed it so that it is now just a glorified version of the really ugly house down the street. The large boats serve no purpose. They too have a stigma attached to them as being the menaces of the road. Right now owning a mini-van might actually be better because at least half of the country won't hate you. At least the end is near for such beasts, I just hope the end is close enough that the trucks I love can be saved so that one day I can walk into an Isuzu dealership and buy a brand new Rodeo...sans IRS, sans leather, sans sluggish performance and best of all sans lazyness and incapability.