smoother ride

[Snowcamo]

The worst kind of advice possible. It sounds like you know what you’re talking about but you don’t.
 
The carbon buildup is in the intake path, particularly around the intake valves, because DI no longer has fuel being sprayed into the intake path which caused the valves and intake ports to clean themselves.
 
So what do you recommended to this guy
-a fuel based cleaner to solve the carbon buildup that is only there because the fuel never touches the effected areas.
-top tier fuel? Again
-and you recommended an oil additive cleaner as well?
 
Hopefully the guy sees this and does not waste his time and money on that crap
 
 
 

It will help clean the piston tops and rings maybe, but not the valves or intake themselves.

It will take a cleaner through the tb to even touch Whats pre combustion chamber. That being said if it is successful at cleaning its going to send that gunk/ junk out and to the cats... I hear they fail often enough due to said method. Iirc there's a live thread on it now. Gm covered that dude.

Sent from my LG-G710 using Tapatalk

[Colossus]

13 hours ago, truckguy82 said:

The worst kind of advice possible. It sounds like you know what you’re talking about but you don’t.

 

The carbon buildup is in the intake path, particularly around the intake valves, because DI no longer has fuel being sprayed into the intake path which caused the valves and intake ports to clean themselves.

 

So what do you recommended to this guy

-a fuel based cleaner to solve the carbon buildup that is only there because the fuel never touches the effected areas.

-top tier fuel? Again

-and you recommended an oil additive cleaner as well?

 

Hopefully the guy sees this and does not waste his time and money on that crap
 

 

 

Yes, a fuel based cleaner AND a top tier fuel AND an oil additive.  It works, my uneducated friend.  But, there is more!  
https://www.bgprod.com/catalog/gasoline-fuel-system/bg-fuel-injection-combustion-chamber-cleaner/

This has to be done at a repair facility, not something you can do yourself. 
If you want to really get down to the nitty gritty, I'll take you on.  But I can guarantee that what I have already outlined does work and does help solve the carbon build up issues. 
 

[David Roark]

I did not mean to get you guys in a fight about this.  I believe both of you reference top tier gas.  Are you referring to the higher octane gas?  I refer to it as Supreme.  I have never run anything in my vehicles but regular unleaded.  Using a gas that costs 50cents more a gallon, would nullify any increase in MPG I might gain to save money on purchasing gas.  And the problem with less MPG has progressively gotten worse over the last 2 years. In summer and winter.    

 

So what I am getting from both of you is that I have a lot of carbon buildup around the intake and intake valves as well as piston rings and tops.  Is that correct?  But you guys disagree on the method to clean all this junk out.

And I certainly don't know the best way.  Seems to me if I take it to dealership or mechanic to perform this service, they would need to drop the cat. so all the junk blows out and doesn't clog the cat.  

Am I on the right page here.  Or is this step not needed.  

 

And if so, what exactly do I tell them I want done, so they can accomplish a total cleanup so my MPG increases and I also will have more power. And can both of you recommend the  product(s) I should use to get this done.

 

Then, if the above is successful, I am to start using premium gasoline like I did back in the 60' & 70's.

 

 

 

 

 

[David Roark]

There is one shop that does the service using  BG Platinum for $175.00 and chevy dealership uses MOC and charges $180.00.  

[Colossus]

it's ok, David.  there are still a lot of folks out there who are not quite up to snuff on how to service and maintain these newer direct injection engines and all the fuss that comes with it, carbon build up being one of it, but the products out there I have mentioned DO work when applied right.  I'll post more about that later though.  Regarding top tier gas, that does not mean you have to run premium octane.  Run what is recommended in the owners manual.  Turbocharged and supercharged engines benefit from high octane, but if your owners manual says you should run 87, go for it.  You can even try 91/93 to see if you notice any differences.  Some do, some don't.  The engine controls in the computers on the more modern vehicles like yours do adjust various things to make the engine work best with the octane. 

 

Top tier fuels are going to be major brands like Shell, Phillips 66, Conoco, Mobil, Chevron, Sinclair, and such.  Even Costco sells top tier fuel now.  You can find a list of them here:
https://toptiergas.com/licensed-brands/

 

GM and many other auto manufacturers recommend running Top Tier fuels and you can read about that here:
https://toptiergas.com/toptier_detergent_gasoline/

 

Essentially, top tier fuels contain very good detergents/ad packs that get added to the tanker trucks at the fuel terminal based upon where that tanker truck is delivering to.  So Chevron has their own additives that meet top tier standards, and the tanker truck driver will select the chevron additive that is bulked in usually by train and then transferred to storage tanks, that are then added to the tanker truck that filled up the tanks with the base stock from the refinery.  They then drive to the gas station and all that stuff is dumped into the various underground (or sometimes above ground) holding tanks for the gas station.   With running brands like Chevron, in addition to their adpacks, they also include Techron, which is one of the best fuel system cleaners out there.  But to get full advantage of that, you have to continuisly run Chevron, not just fill up there one day and then go to another brand the other day. 

Now with that being said- On these direct injection engines, even with the great stuff from top tier fuels and their additives, manufacturers and repair facilities have realized that carbon build up is a huge issue with DI engines that are not being fully addressed with the good fuels, which is why adding supplemental additives every now and then (a few times a year) is being recommended.  These are formulated to knock down the carbon deposits that the gasoline additives are not able to. 

 

This why I have been told by trusted mechanics and why I run several cans of this a year in my vehicles:

https://www.bgprod.com/catalog/gasoline-fuel-system/bg-44k-fuel-system-cleaner/
 

The BG products have been around a LONG time and are considered the best in the industry for most of their products.  I was skeptical at first, after having lived thru the "Slick 50" and "Marvel Mystery Oil" years where they were claimed to do great things to vehicles, but in most cases, ended up being nothing more than Snake Oil.  However- Marvel Mystery Oil has since reformulated much of their primary product and there have been some respectable things happen as a result.  BG 44K was introduced to me by a repair facility that had me run it a few times to clear up some performance issues, and they also did a few other things.  They have their own version of top engine cleaner which is very very good stuff (as is GM's top engine cleaning procedure) It made a huge difference.  There are many GDI (Gas Direct Injection) engines out there that are more prone to carbon and deposit build up than others.  Sadly, the GM Engines are some of those.  The 3.6L V-6 is used in many applications in GM's lineup.  I had it in a 2013 Impala.  Great engine, but after 10,000 miles, I noticed it didn't have the get up and go like it had previously.  I ran 2 tanks of BG44k and also did a EPR service, and started using BG MOA products and the car drove like it was brand new again. 
The Ford Ecoboost engines are also very prone to carbon build up and the BG products are pushed hard for those as well and the results are usually quite satisfactory. 

https://www.bgprod.com/catalog/engine/bg-epr-engine-performance-restoration/#bg-product-3

https://www.bgprod.com/catalog/engine/bg-moa-extended-life/#bg-product-1

 

Everyone has their own opinion on what they need to do, but without a doubt if you are running a direct injection engine, you are going to be needing to run additives now and then to supplement the top tier fuels, to keep things clean and running well. 

So I am a firm believer in the BG products, like the 44K gasoline treatment, MOA oil treatment, and EPR performance restoration.  (follow directions CAREFULLY)  I also like the Chevron Techron concentrate and for long term storage (if your gas is going to be sitting around for awhile, longer than 2 months, I suggest stuff like Stabil-360 and Seafoam. 

Hope this is helpful. 

 

 

 

[David Roark]

Thank you so much for taking your time to inform me about this.  I really appreciate it.  I have quite a bit of reading to do also with the stuff you have given me.  With what I have read already, it looks like I need the BG Engine & Fuel Service performed.  Then after that, I could add the BG to fuel and engine as you have explained above during the year.  

 

I have not found where I can buy the cans of the product to use myself as needed.  Can I purchased directly from their web site?  Where do you buy the product at?

 

Again, thanks so much for the information.

 

Oh yeah, what is EPR service.  What does EPR" stand for?

 

David Roark

[Colossus]

I get it from my local NAPA store, but not all of them carry it.  I've seen them carried at some Advance Auto Parts, as well.  But they are also carried online at amazon. 

 

Yes, please research for yourself, watch the videos, google, watch the youtube videos, I do the same.  Decide for yourself.  Google carbon issues in DI engines.  Good luck! 

[TRKLGND]

David,

In a non DI engine fuel cleans the intake valve stems and tops because it washes over the valve.  In a DI engine, the fuel never touches the intake valve stem or top.  It is sprayed directly into the combustion chamber.  As a result, no in tank fuel treatment will do a damn thing to clean the carbon from your intake valve stems or tops.  The fuel never makes contact with the valve stems or tops so the cleaner never makes contact.  Fuel based cleaners are great for keeping pistons and valve heads clean.  Manual cleaning is the only way to clean the valve stems and tops. 

This is a quick and easy read explaining what is going on.

https://www.aa1car.com/library/intake_valve_deposits_gdi_engines.htm

[David Roark]

So what do you recommend me to do to get my MPG increased and more power (performance)?  I am sick of this low 13.5 to 14.5 MPG.  Running my money down the drain.  I have to take a trip to Michigan from Texas in May for mother in law's 95th birthday.  Have to drive because of the dogs.  Took this trip when pickup was almost new and I averaged over 24 on that trip.  I never get better than 16.5 on highway now.  That is a drastic drop.  Are you saying I need to take to mechanic and tear apart to clean?

 

Thanks for your response.

 

David Roark

 

[David Roark]

Paracutin,

 

I have read all of it.  Thank you.  It explains a lot.  It also explains how a mechanic can clean to tops and valve stems using fuel cleaner, if not too bad.  Otherwise, I would have to open up the engine.

 

Now why on earth did they make these direct injection engines that would cause this problem over a period of time.  They Claim great MPG when new, but turns out to be worse than my ole '56 Mercury five years later.  

 

Are any of the pickups today, not direct injection?  Or maybe a small SUV.  I need good gas milage to continue running down the road a little further.