Jump to content

Charging system upgrades with smart alternator equipped trucks

voyager1500

By voyager1500
in Modifications & Accessories

 Share

Recommended Posts

voyager1500 Enthusiast

voyager1500

Posted
Posted (edited)

Hi,   I have a 2017 silverado 1500.  I would like to set up a dual battery system, but i'm getting bogged down with all the info and technology on these new electronic systems.  Apparently you cannot use a traditional dual battery isolator on the new trucks with the smart alternators.  So I found numerous versions, but they all have widely varying descriptions so i'm finding myself spinning around and unsure of what I actually need.  there are smart isolators, but there are also dc to dc battery chargers for use in dual battery set ups.  what do I need ?  do i need both the smart isolator and a battery charger ?  or just one or the other ?  ugh...   I just installed a yellow top optima as my primary, and will add a smaller yellow top for the auxillary.  the brands I have found include: Redarc, Victron, smart gate, keyline, etc.  THe prices are all over the place.  I m certainly in no position to spend a thousand dollars to do this, so hoping i'm just confused with what I need and there is a simple resolution.   End result i'm looking for.......  dual batteries, isolating main from aux so that I can protect starting battery , while using aux to power accessories, then my alternator charges both while driving.  sounds simple right ?  

 

TIA

 

I also found a blue sea systems ACR unit that sounds like it fits the bill, but again, confused as if that is all i need, or ?????  

 

 

Edited by voyager1500
bdbake01 Senior Enthusiast

bdbake01

Posted
Posted

Not sure why this seems to confuse everyone?  Granted, electricity is my "day job", but still.  There's a LOT of bad info out there.  Where did you hear that a standard battery isolator won't work?  

voyager1500 Enthusiast

voyager1500

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Saw it in several spots.  something to do with the way the smart alternator varies voltage would not excite the charging ckt and the second battery would not get charged .  Thus requiring a special smart relay that could sense the voltage variations and also have an exciter ckt to make the smart alternator s charging ckt activate to provide enough voltage to charge both batteries.  Then somewhere else I read that you needed a dc to dc battery charger in addition to ensure that the second battery received 100% charge.  all while isolating the two so that the main battery would always be charged and protected from draining.  

bdbake01 Senior Enthusiast

bdbake01

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, voyager1500 said:

Saw it in several spots.  something to do with the way the smart alternator varies voltage would not excite the charging ckt and the second battery would not get charged .  Thus requiring a special smart relay that could sense the voltage variations and also have an exciter ckt to make the smart alternator s charging ckt activate to provide enough voltage to charge both batteries.  Then somewhere else I read that you needed a dc to dc battery charger in addition to ensure that the second battery received 100% charge.  all while isolating the two so that the main battery would always be charged and protected from draining.  

No offense, but that's all poor advice.  These boards are full of people making random statements based on limited to no understanding of how the system(s) that they are making definitive statements about even work in the first place.  The only thing you need to do is make sure that the grounds from both batteries go through the factory current sensor.  That way the alternator's control algorithm will be able to detect when you're using current from either battery, which will prompt the voltage to increase - ie go into "charge mode" vs reduced voltage / float / etc.  This isn't perfect mind you, but having two isolated power systems that share a single charging source (alternator) will always have compromises.  But it will also work just fine, and you won't have some stupid complicated system that never works quite right.  

 

For these vehicles, I'm a fan of the WirthCo Battery Doctor.  Because of the method it uses to charge the secondary battery (technically a battery equalization), it will work extremely well with our charging system.  It also had a very handy manual paralleling function, and lots of built in protection.  It's also affordable.  You'll still want to make sure your battery grounds both run through the current sensor, but this isolator will help the OEM charging algorithm do it's job a bit better.  And since it charges via equalization, you don't run the risk of overcharging the non-depleted battery.  

 

https://www.amazon.com/WirthCo-20092-Battery-Doctor-Isolator/dp/B0058SGDFK/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&linkCode=sl1&tag=nerdtechy-20&linkId=826133debec6908fb473f9ed2e973dc7&language=en_US&th=1

 

voyager1500 Enthusiast

voyager1500

Posted
  • Author
Posted

I found a video that explained it a little better.  So the traditional isolators will work, but work better on pre 08 vehicles without the smart alternators.  The DC DC battery charger is used on newer vehicles because it allows the second battery to get 100% charge.  THe charger will also have the isolation feature that will prevent the main batttery from draining when vehicle is not running.  The conventional isolator will not allow 100% charge and you will have less resere power than expected with whatever battery you choose.  Of course the dc dc set up is like 4 xs the cost of the old school isolators.  but guess it's the right way to go when your spending $500 plus on batteries.  Me and my dumb ideas...  

 

CHeck out this video, a bit long, but goes into detail on all these technologies and systems.

 

  • Like 1
  • 6 months later...
gmcdawg Enthusiast

gmcdawg

Posted
Posted

bdbake01, can you provide a little more info on where and how to wire into the factory current sensor?  Where is it located.  Any pics of your install would be great!  Looking to do this too.

  • 9 months later...
aggets Enthusiast

aggets

Posted
Posted

looking at a Victron DC to DC Charger. They have a 18 and 30 amp model. I am wondering if the 30 amp model would draw to much current from my factory alternator. Thank You.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Latest Articles

  • Posts

    • Aimatdeer
      Ac not keeping up

      By Aimatdeer · Posted

      Monday looks like a good day for the dealer to test an ac issue. Hopefully it all turns out good.
    • CamGTP
      Gas Prices

      By CamGTP · Posted

      Paid $2.72 for E85 today.
    • Atlas
      Gas Prices

      By Atlas · Posted

      Welcome back! No, it definitely doesn't pass the sniff test. Even "ceasefire" needs an alternative definition these days.    $5.29 at Kroger today
    • bluev8
      Intermittent no-code issues on 2022.5+ V8 trucks — what did the shop fail to capture?

      By bluev8 · Posted

      That makes sense, and I think you are describing the real product problem. Capturing data is the easy part. If the owner or technician has to manually dig through five minutes of millisecond-level logs, the product has already failed. The device would be at the ECM harness, not at the OBD port, so I agree that data retrieval and event marking need to be thought through carefully. The way I am thinking about the architecture is: The recorder itself should not depend on a phone, app, Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, or cloud connection to capture the event. It should always keep a local rolling buffer and lock the event locally. A button, phone app, or small cabin device would only act as an event marker. If the driver feels a stumble and presses the button 10–30 seconds later, the pre-buffer has to already contain the useful data. For data retrieval, the practical options would be a sealed service USB lead, Wi-Fi download, or a phone/cabin companion device. I would not expect the owner to remove the ECM-side module or work with raw files directly. The cloud or AI side would be for interpretation, not for capturing the event. The truck may have no connection when the issue happens, so the evidence has to be saved locally first. After that, cloud processing could help decode the data, compare it against baselines, and generate a readable report. For the first version, I would keep the automatic triggers conservative and objective: driver event marker bus-off error passive voltage drop / brownout device reset FIFO or queue overflow a normally periodic message disappearing side-to-side communication mismatch, if the topology supports that For “learning normal,” I agree with your point, but I would not want to overclaim it as automatic root-cause diagnosis at first. A realistic first step would be learned baseline comparison for that specific vehicle and operating condition. For example, a value would only be compared against similar conditions: RPM range load / MAP throttle position gear / vehicle speed coolant and oil temperature battery voltage AFM/DFM state, if decoded and validated Then the report could flag things like: this periodic message disappeared compared with its normal timing this value deviated from this vehicle’s normal range under similar conditions the same abnormal pattern repeated after the same type of event the anomaly occurred together with voltage, oil-pressure, misfire, or communication changes But I would still call that “abnormal pattern detected,” not “replace this part,” unless there is enough validated repair data behind it. So the intended product would not be “here is a huge log.” It would need to be an event package: what triggered the capture how much pre/post data was preserved what changed before and after the event whether the device itself reset, overflowed, or saw a bus error selected graphs around the event raw data only as supporting evidence From your perspective, what would make this kind of report useful instead of just another datalog? For example: What are the top 5 parameters or events you would want highlighted first? Would you trust a learned baseline for that specific vehicle, or would you prefer fixed thresholds? How much false-positive flagging would be acceptable before you stopped looking at the reports? What would a one-page report need to show for an independent shop to take it seriously? For misfire, AFM/DFM, oil pressure, or U-code complaints, what would you want the tool to flag automatically?
    • scotthvac.net
      2022-24 halogen - led grille swap

      By scotthvac.net · Posted

      2024 Silverado 2500 HD LTZ grille no camera Parts list   84603331 84913656 84913657 84913654 84913655 84911567 84911568 85646092 85646093 85797921 85797922   11570637  x10-15   grille/bumper bolts 11546500  x10      grille clips 11571006  x10      push/retainer clips 11546454  x6       nut retainers 11611609  x6       M5 bolts 11610700  x6       molding/trim retainers

  • GM-Trucks.com Clubs

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...