Some Assembly is Required

[Grumpy Bear]

11 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Speed postulates that higher viscosity oils have more thickeners to artificially inflate their viscosity numbers. These thickeners lose viscosity under shear, and the result is that not all oils of the same viscosity have the same shear stability.

 

He is not saying that an SAE *W20 will have more viscosity than a *W40 due to MORE VII polymers. He is saying that although multiple *W40 may post in the PDS the same or similar 100 C and 150 C viscosities that the blenders choice of modifier TYPE and AMOUNT to get his chosen base to grade will not give identical real world viscosities in shear and at temperature. All will pass the SII test but not all will pass the 100 C HTHS (unpublished value) testing the blender does and relies on to get the required by law "percentage improvement' referenced to his last great work. 

 

Tis the problem with the lie. Once told others are required to support it. 

[Chuck FB]

12 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

www.enginelabs.com/news/what-i-learned-today-bearing-clearances-vs-oil-viscosities/

 

 

www.enginelabs.com/news/oil-viscosity-can-the-numbers-be-misleading/

The Big Lie…

Coming full circle to the reason Lake discusses the Porsche engines in particular. Based on the 2000 samples in the SPEEDiagnostix database, increasing the oil viscosity in these engines, even those run on the track, showed no significant difference in results.

 

The smoking gun was in the oil chemistry. That is where the data shows higher instances of more wear. Molybdenum was the key; the higher the amount, the less the wear. Speed postulates that higher viscosity oils have more thickeners to artificially inflate their viscosity numbers. These thickeners lose viscosity under shear, and the result is that not all oils of the same viscosity have the same shear stability.

 

Having enough viscosity is the most important characteristic, but according to Speed, once that required viscosity level is reached, additive chemistry matters more than additional viscosity. Speed also states, oil pressure problems on the racetrack aren’t a viscosity problem; it’s an oiling system problem. Running a thicker oil is just a band-aid for an underlying oiling system problem.

 

Which has made me wonder with the various engine failures of a few brands in the last few years, is it sub par materials such as lifters etc causing failures, or bearing clearances on the crank etc or perhaps bad designing of an engine physically or causing too much load on the components due to the hp/torque they can push out of them. Or is the oil viscosity and additive package of current oils or a lack of oil flow by an oil pump not able to supply sufficient oil at idle or under high load at low rpm. Or is it every item I listed that combined together has pushed the limits so far to the left that there is hardly a margin of safety left and add in some fuel dilution and too long of an OCI and premature engine failure is the result ?. 

[Grumpy Bear]

9 hours ago, Chuck FB said:

Or is it every item I listed that combined together has pushed the limits so far to the left that there is hardly a margin of safety left and add in some fuel dilution and too long of an OCI and premature engine failure is the result ?. 

 

Yes  

[Grumpy Bear]

Missing pieces of the Assembly

 

Detergency vs Solvency

 

Not the same thing. Detergency is the mechanism that surrounds solid particulates preventing amalgamation. Usually accompanied by a Dispersant whose job it is to keep those encapsulated particles in Suspension. Solvency keeps things that can be dissolved in solution. 

 

Salt is a solid that can be dissolved. Pepper is a solid that cannot be dissolved. A detergent/dispersant is effective on pepper but a solvent is more effective on salt. As long as the solids remain in either state, dissolved or dispersed then they can be be removed with the oil upon change. 

 

How many wranglers does it take to herd cats? Depends on how many cats your herding. How much sponge does it take to soak up water? How much water is there to soak up? Point is most oil blends start with some herding ability and next to zero sponge and recently even fewer wranglers are being sent to do the same job. 

 

So you start with a dozen cowboys and zero cows but at the drive progresses you pick up cows along the way, but not cowboys. At some point you have more cows that the wranglers can handle and some leave the herd. Deposits. And the API has an acceptable number of cows they are willing to let loose. In the ideal world zero is the right number for he rancher but to the butcher....a few lost is fine. This cow is beat to death. Let's move on....

 

Solvency isn't something oils on the Walmart shelf care about AT ALL. Problem is, you motor does. Fuels driven varnish sticks rings and only a solvent can keep them in check. The bet is that the solids driven portion that plug the expander rings and the oil drain backs and VVT screens and AFM screens will be an issue long before varnish is. Not that it wont be but if they market well enough the consumer can be kept ignorant enough to either believe it is "normal" (A quart in 1 or 2K is normal) OR is kept at bay longer than the first owner is likely to hang on to the unit. Solvency cost money. 

 

Now the OEM's have John Q. Public buffaloed into the belief that the number cows accumulated along the trail is a known and predictable CONSTANT. It isn't. Nor is the rate at which they crossed paths with them. Only the number of wrangles is constant. Or was. Each new generation of oil sees fewer and fewer of them. 

 

So what happens when the number of cowboys is lower (lower TBN) with each seasons trail but the trial is longer (OCI) and the number of cows along that trail continues increase? (Conditions that promote deposits). 

 

For awhile the blenders were on to something. Better bases are harder to degrade (fewer cows) but that was overtaken by a longer trail (OCI) and improved breeding (More cows) while continuing to reduce the cowboy staffing levels (TBN/Aniline #). 

 

Marketing has been successful. We've fired most of the staff, cows breed line bunnies, the trail is ten times longer and we've convinced the boss his ranch is in better shape that it ever was. 

 

That kids is just the cleaning side. The side few pay attention to.