Can't Win For Losing

DvlDogDmaxZ71 · August 31, 2010

well i patiently waited for the autocal to be released because of all of the great reviews that you guys have given blackbear. so i get my autocal in and after a few more days of having to wait to hook it up and record my engine data i finally got the time this past saturday on a beautiful afternoon to hook it up and head out on my journey. well i pulled out of my driveway and less than a half mile down the road i hear an awful noise coming out of the exhaust and then every warning message that thing could throw at me came across the dic. well i turned around and limped back to the house and parked it for the remainder of the weekend. I have a good friend that drives a wrecker so we towed her into the dealership this morning. the damage you may ask? at 33,703 pampered, never hauled anything more than 2 fourwheelers on a trailer miles, the lifter on cylinder # 6 decided to break into peices..... .

now i'm a little apprehensive to continue on with the tuning process and actually thinking about trading. i know, i know i may be jumping the gun but i can't help but look

also i want to add that in no shape, form, fashion, or ideal do i blame the autocal for any of this. after all i was only recording data. i just wanted to make that clear!

anway i guess thats it for my little rant of the day.

peace, love, and chicken grease!

[email protected] · August 31, 2010

That's weird, usually a GM engine won't just break internal pieces like that. GM quality must be on a downfall.

pm26 · August 31, 2010

It's the great AFM lifters! We have been through this discussion before.

jblakeney · August 31, 2010

That engineer at GM with his cutting cylinders on and off fetish..... Strikes again.... It did not work before. It is not working great now... Must we continue on this long dark trail?

QUIT GM AND GIVE IS SOMETHING that we can depend on working... Good without problems. This would also cut down on warranty work. How many sets of AFM lifters must they replace?????

I am waiting on them to buy back the AFM option, like the windshield washer fluid heater.....

Jbo

Daryl LBZ · August 31, 2010

That engineer at GM with his cutting cylinders on and off fetish..... Strikes again.... It did not work before. It is not working great now... Must we continue on this long dark trail?

QUIT GM AND GIVE IS SOMETHING that we can depend on working... Good without problems. This would also cut down on warranty work. How many sets of AFM lifters must they replace?????

I am waiting on them to buy back the AFM option, like the windshield washer fluid heater.....

Jbo

I wish they would. AFM is trash and when I have to rebuild my trucks engine you can bet I will be putting a better set of non-afm lifters in it.

jblakeney · August 31, 2010

Somebody posted a while back a replacement lifter set for AFM engines.... Fixes the AFM lifter issue...

Jbo

dave_benn · August 31, 2010

My truck with 3500 miles is going to the dealer to have all the lifters replaced on monday. I love that i bought a new truck so i wouldn't have to worry about failures, but instead it needs to have the engine torn apart.

Wingnut · August 31, 2010

That's weird, usually a GM engine won't just break internal pieces like that. GM quality must be on a downfall.

No, it's an anomaly.

If it were as common as some people seem to think it is, we'd be getting 200 new members a day on here bitching about their popped motors.

My truck with 3500 miles is going to the dealer to have all the lifters replaced on monday. I love that i bought a new truck so i wouldn't have to worry about failures, but instead it needs to have the engine torn apart.

It's not the engine, it's the lifters. And unless the engines in the GMT-900's are strange (I've never had one apart)...You don't even have to pull the heads. Nothing that's going to hurt anything short or long term.

mdauwald · August 31, 2010

Somebody posted a while back a replacement lifter set for AFM engines.... Fixes the AFM lifter issue...

Jbo

I found this awhile back. All GM parts so you might be able to package it cheaper on your own if you know what you need. http://www.thunderracing.com/shop-by/vehic....T.-and-D.O.D./

nickvrebel · August 31, 2010

It's not the engine, it's the lifters. And unless the engines in the GMT-900's are strange (I've never had one apart)...You don't even have to pull the heads. Nothing that's going to hurt anything short or long term.

the heads have to come off to access the lifters. This applies to all GEN III and GEN IV small block V8 motors.

Stevens03 · August 31, 2010

Dang, that sucks,... Keep us posted on how this proceeds.

beautiful truck too.

[email protected] · August 31, 2010

That's weird, usually a GM engine won't just break internal pieces like that. GM quality must be on a downfall.

No, it's an anomaly.

If it were as common as some people seem to think it is, we'd be getting 200 new members a day on here bitching about their popped motors.

Very true, we'd have a lot of one or two post people just telling us the engines suck. Just like that couple poster who came on here and said the engines can now run without oil.

Wingnut · August 31, 2010

It's not the engine, it's the lifters. And unless the engines in the GMT-900's are strange (I've never had one apart)...You don't even have to pull the heads. Nothing that's going to hurt anything short or long term.

the heads have to come off to access the lifters. This applies to all GEN III and GEN IV small block V8 motors.

Huh...I thought you could drop them in the lifter valley. WTF was that last one I did. Guess it was that old 400

lol...And I've HAD the intake and lifter valley cover off my car (and a couple of gen III trucks)...Just wasn't messing with the valvetrain/rockers/pushrods/lifters, so I didn't even look.

Either way...Taking the heads off isn't a big deal either. Not going to hurt that motor one bit.

jimlem · August 31, 2010

well i patiently waited for the autocal to be released because of all of the great reviews that you guys have given blackbear. so i get my autocal in and after a few more days of having to wait to hook it up and record my engine data i finally got the time this past saturday on a beautiful afternoon to hook it up and head out on my journey. well i pulled out of my driveway and less than a half mile down the road i hear an awful noise coming out of the exhaust and then every warning message that thing could throw at me came across the dic. well i turned around and limped back to the house and parked it for the remainder of the weekend. I have a good friend that drives a wrecker so we towed her into the dealership this morning. the damage you may ask? at 33,703 pampered, never hauled anything more than 2 fourwheelers on a trailer miles, the lifter on cylinder # 6 decided to break into peices..... .

now i'm a little apprehensive to continue on with the tuning process and actually thinking about trading. i know, i know i may be jumping the gun but i can't help but look

also i want to add that in no shape, form, fashion, or ideal do i blame the autocal for any of this. after all i was only recording data. i just wanted to make that clear!

anway i guess thats it for my little rant of the day.

peace, love, and chicken grease!

Matt,

Absolute bummer man. The sh*ts! I have some reading material for you, that helped my "Valve Train I.Q." in about 20 minutes. You may know more about valve train repairs than the guys who wrote this mag (I DID NOT!) but if you're not an engine pro, this mag will become your new best friend when discussing the job with the dealer. Especially when he says what parts it needs, and worse, when the dealer tells you about all the stuff that you don't need. Like when they tell you what parts just got nicked up a tiny bit can be "re-used!!! Or when the dealer gives you a list of all parts he plans to use over from your old engine because he thinks it'll be OK and does not really matter.

If they don't sell the magazine by you, I will find a way to get you a copy, ASAP! Mag details below- in last paragraph. Learn what's in here, and you will be able to call "BullSh*t on your service writer, EVERY time he tries to cut a corner on your repair. There are SO MANY terrible time and cost cutter shortcuts they could legitimately try and pass off on you as "Repaired to Factory Spec." but we all know they do not leave the factory with metal slurry flowing through-out the lube system, nor with chewed up cam lobes on the camshaft that were "touched-up and re-polished." This can't be fixed by a guy with a belt sander and buffing wheel. They do special hardening to the lobe and various hard, slippery-smooth coatings & heat treatments done into the cam as it's built- some are only a few molecules deep, but important. (you will need a new cam and should demand one if they don't pony up for it). Now is a great time to learn to speak camshafts & valve trains FLUENTLY! I have just what you need.

In the magazine, one of their engines had a problem with a solid roller lifter and an aftermarket cam. They show a pic of all this shiny metal mixed in oil, down by the lifters' pockets etc. The first thing the mention is that the only correct way to fix it is to: Completely tear it down, remove all bearings, caps bushings, the crank and cams, the pull the heads, pistons, mains, all gaskets & sealing o-rings, oil pan, oil pump and all their related parts, etc. etc. Then start at step one, pressure wash it ALL. Have block and at least the head on the side of the failed lifter magna fluxed (maybe the intake manifold too).

If it all checks out, start any repairs that need over-boring to fix and order the new correct parts. 86 all unusable parts and get new. Don't try and re-use anything. ONLY after fluxing and machining, should you begin rebuilding. They say to remember you are rebuilding you entire engine, not just changing a bad lifter. So, I guess, if your service Mgr. does not start out by telling you they are going to strip down the entire engine and do most of the common sense steps outlined above, Better ask him why? He may be content to get you on the road real fast since he does not care if it comes out like new or is a POS engine ready to die in another 33K miles. Hell that's just more work for him.

On the other hand, I know if it's factory warranty, and a BIG TICKET item that they will go out of their way to order EVERY new part possible because the factory is buying. Make sure all those parts ordered actually go on your car. I had some ongoing warranty work with another truck in another time, and they just could NOT fix the pinging so they began ordering everything for it. They were going to R&R the PCM and almost every sensor and wiring harness in between. I thought great finally. I dropped by the dealer the next day, unannounced, and found the shipping cartons with my name on them open and the counter. The service mgr. was handing out weatherstripping kits, plugs & wires, & auto trans parts (I had a 5 spd MT) to his "workers." They ordered stuff I had no problem with for their own personal vehicles & had been turning in a different set of work orders to the company. Not that it will happen to you but don't let them tell you they cannot order a such and such part for your rebuild. Not true. On a big fat embarrassing break down like this, they can order whatever it takes (legit stuff of course) to regain your trust and brand loyalty.

The magazine is Engine Masters one of the twice-a-year engine-building magazines from Hot Rodding! magazine. This issue is marked as follows: Summer 2010, Volume 12, Number 2. Display until 8/31/2010. Title of main article is "LS CHEVY MADNESS- 713 HP on pump gas!" With a big pic of a totally tricked out Chevy LS1 engine (lots of chrome and braided SS lines etc.) The rest of the content is mostly about cams, valve train setups, lifters, what goes into a proper setup and what MUST be followed if a failure occurs. Not many areas can cause as much damage, to some very far and wide areas of your engine, as when a lifter, pushrod/camlobe breaks up. I'm not trying to twist the knife but when I read your post, I immediately thought "he'll need to check this and be sure they remove that and no shortcuts concerning cleaning and R&R of the pan, oil sump pick/up, oil pump... and so on.. and so on.. If you cannot get a copy of the Mag, quickly (Borders, Barns & Noble or sometimes just a large drugstore) then PM me your mailing address, and I'll copy the articles or just send you the mag. The entire issue is centered on Chevy cams & valve trains. They even have a great shootout between Comp Cams 7 different models for late model Chevy V-8s (From mild to wild). If you can talk the dealer into replacing it all with a GMPP Hi-PO crate engine with a mild (read low end torque) cam, you could turn a bad day into a nice new engine. Whatever you do, I hope they don't cut any corners. Also, I hope you get something back even nicer than what you towed in. Good luck with all of it. Let me know if you'd like mag. I'm done with it.

Jim

DvlDogDmaxZ71 · September 12, 2010

sorry i dropped the ball on getting back on here with a response. school, work, etc etc..couldn't find my own head sometimes if it wasn't attached! i ended up taking my truck to a local chevy dealer first thing monday morning after the lifter failed on the previous saturday(nothing like being stranded for the weekend..haha) a buddy of my towed it in on his wrecker( at least it was a chevy) and we dropped it off at around 8 am. they had it done by 11. they replaced two lifters, changed the coolant and engine oil and the filters and gaskets all under warranty. it is now running as good as it ever was and i have now been able to log my data and send it off to justin for a tune. i know stuff happens sometimes and nothing is perfect but i was a little agitated especially since it was the weekend and all of the service depts are closed on the weekends. I am very happy with the service that i received and i didnt even buy my truck from them. Kudos to Champion Chevrolet in Athens, AL!