Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

New Transmission Thermostat Data Update

 

Turns out not so much a floor as support. 🤔 

 

Gray bubbles are the new valve which I labeled by the cracking temperature. 

 

I expect most drive faster than I do and that will raise the slope below 138 F.  I also run a finned 8 quart sump. Factor that as well. Although I don't have any data yet above 55 F I already know from previous work that my much colder water thermostat and the fact I have only the radiator cooler that hotter water stats will give higher ATF readings as well. So treat this as directionally useful and not some absolute gospel.  

 

image.thumb.png.7fe8a5bebb451aff06b68efb33664543.png

 

Edited by Grumpy Bear
  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)
On 1/17/2022 at 8:16 AM, 16LT4 said:

 

A word of caution for anyone installing the new thermostat: mine, from GMpartsdirect, did NOT come with the o-rings for the ATF cooler lines, so I needed to transfer them from the old thermostat.  Carefully inspect your new one to verify o-ring existence. 

 

On 1/17/2022 at 11:30 AM, mikeyk101 said:

 

No, o-rings definitely do not come with the new one.

 

...

 

So I agree and can't stress this "little" detail enough, make sure the o-rings are still on the 2 cooling lines before fitting into the new thermostat.

 

 

Can you just buy new o-rings, when placing your order for the new TBV?  Is 23135703 the part number for the o-rings?

 

My lines (23370657) are leaking up front where they go from rubber to metal.  So I'll be ordering new lines as well as the new TBV.  Appears the new lines does come with the o-rings on the (old) TBV, so I'll be able to swap them out before installing.

 

Do you think eventually the lines will just come with the 70c thermostat already installed?

Edited by cs15dah
Posted
16 hours ago, cs15dah said:

Do you think eventually the lines will just come with the 70c thermostat already installed?

 

Looks like I just answered my own question. My transmission cooler lines (23370657) came in today.  The attached TBV does indeed have 70 marked on the bottom.

  • Like 2
Posted

Installed tonight. Since I was in there already, replaced 4.5 qts of Dexron VI. Got to use my new Mityvac MV7400. Holy smokes, why didn’t I buy one of these decades ago?! Sure made the fluid swap a whole heck of a lot easier. And cleaner!

1AC49F89-0694-47A9-9D24-487D97E8E7DC.jpeg

  • Like 3
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, cs15dah said:

Installed tonight. Since I was in there already, replaced 4.5 qts of Dexron VI. Got to use my new Mityvac MV7400. Holy smokes, why didn’t I buy one of these decades ago?! Sure made the fluid swap a whole heck of a lot easier. And cleaner!

1AC49F89-0694-47A9-9D24-487D97E8E7DC.jpeg

Where'd you purchase your Mityvac MV7400 from? Amazon?

 

Did you need any any additional hosing to get it all the way down into the pan?

 

I'm going to do a flush soon at 25k on my 2018 are you all using the standard GM fluid or something else?

 

I've had the updated thermostat for about 2 months now.

 

It usually settles at 142-144F for local and around town/short highway trips. It was 80 degree's and sunny a few weekends ago and I was doing 80-85mph on the interstate through some pretty good sized WV/OH hills with a dirtbike in the bed and the highest it hit was 167F. Normally, with the stock thermostat, it would get to then stay at 190F no matter what the outside ambient temperature was.

Edited by scralatchtica824
Posted
37 minutes ago, scralatchtica824 said:

Where'd you purchase your Mityvac MV7400 from? Amazon?

 

Did you need any any additional hosing to get it all the way down into the pan?

 

I'm going to do a flush soon at 25k on my 2018 are you all using the standard GM fluid or something else?

 

I've had the updated thermostat for about 2 months now.

 

It usually settles at 142-144F for local and around town/short highway trips. It was 80 degree's and sunny a few weekends ago and I was doing 80-85mph on the interstate through some pretty good sized WV/OH hills with a dirtbike in the bed and the highest it hit was 167F. Normally, with the stock thermostat, it would get to then stay at 190F no matter what the outside ambient temperature was.

 

Yes, I bought mine from Amazon.  No additional tubes needed.  There are two dipstick tubes different diameters, then a main suction tube.  I connected the larger of the two dipstick tubes together with the main suction tube, which should be about 10 ft in total.  Plenty of length to stick down into the trans pan with the main reservoir sitting on the ground next to the front tire.  Prior to sliding the tube in, I compared the length of tube side-by-side with the dipstick, so I'd know what depth I was trying to hit.  Then slid it in up to that mark, and then an inch or two more until I felt a bit of resistance, which I think is just the tube bottoming out at the bottom of the trans pan.  Pumped it up, and it worked beautifully.  I can't believe I haven't bought one of these before!  Especially since I like to do the drain & fill three times to get the most fresh fluid into the transmission.

 

I used GM Dexron VI this time.  Last time, 53,130 miles ago I used Valvoline MaxLife.  I don't have specific brands I stick to.  Usually just the best price on a quality lubricant.  166K miles so far on my 2015 Suburban and no issues whatsoever.  I use Mopar fluids on my Ram 2500, nothing fancy, and I got 386K on the transmission before it needed a rebuild.  443K on it now and still going strong.

 

Yesterday on a cool 68F night, I took a 40 mile drive at 60 MPH and the average trans fluid temp was 176F.  Got into town where it was 25-30 MPH with stop and gos and I saw it reach a max of 186F.  Prior to this new TBV, I'd usually see around 196F, with stop and gos getting into 200-209F.

Posted
26 minutes ago, 14burrito said:

Mityvac FTW, bought mine off ebay.

 

Comes with hoses that work for the ATF.

 

Screenshot_20220323-092833_Gallery.jpg

 

With the Mityvac, how'd you get that spill??  😉

  • Haha 1
Posted
1 hour ago, cs15dah said:

 

With the Mityvac, how'd you get that spill??  😉

 

Wasn't an oil spill, I got sloppy cleaning the mityvac. Cleaned the container prior to pulling the fluid so I could get a clean sample to send out.

  • Like 1
Posted
On 2/24/2022 at 1:45 AM, palmer_df0130 said:

Does anybody know if the new tbv internals will swap out with the old tbv with the quick disconnect cooler lines? I have a 2014 Silverado and do not want to have to buy new cooler lines along with the new valve to make it work. Thanks.

 

On 2/24/2022 at 8:04 AM, Grumpy Bear said:

 

Yes they will!  :) And will swap into the 8L and 10L TVB's as well. 😉 

So this begs the question, why can't we just buy the internals as a kit and not the whole thing?

I just learned of this pill flip thing and am going to try it.  Maybe later I will spring for the newer part and just swap the internals.

Posted
On 3/23/2022 at 1:54 PM, 14burrito said:

 

…so I could get a clean sample to send out.


I'm sending in a sample too. This’ll be the first time for trans fluid in my Suburban. I usually only do the oil. 

  • Like 1
Posted
1 hour ago, F4Gary said:

 

So this begs the question, why can't we just buy the internals as a kit and not the whole thing?

I just learned of this pill flip thing and am going to try it.  Maybe later I will spring for the newer part and just swap the internals.


Isn’t that one of the main reasons why this thread started? The OP buying just the internals, in the form of the Katech 17, and installing into his existing TBV? But I get it. You’re specifically asking about OEM GM internals. 

 

The pill flip is free. So yeah, I see why folks tend to want to do that. But for less than the cost of a tank of fuel, one could buy the new 70c TBV. I see they’re available on eBay for $50-80, shipped. GM Parts Giant about the same price; maybe just a bit more. My opinion, I’d only want to do the job once. Not that it’s hard. I’m just lazy. So I’d rather spend the $50+ up front and do the job just once. Just my recommendation, if you plan on doing the new TBV down the road anyways. 
 

Has anyone done the pill flip, or the Katech 17, with the TBV still on the truck? I can’t imagine it being done without a lot of difficulty. So if you’re having to take the TBV off the truck anyways, may be less work to just swap in the new TBV. 
 

Sheesh. Reading the above it looks like I make commission off of TBV sales! Not really trying to sway your decision. Really just saying it may not be worth doing the free mod now, if you’re just going to do the $50+ mod later anyways. 😂

Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, cs15dah said:


I'm sending in a sample too. This’ll be the first time for trans fluid in my Suburban. I usually only do the oil. 

 

My sample came back good, so much so Blackstone questioned the mileage on it. Makes me wonder if the previous owner did a trans service or not.

 

I dont think the pill flip can be done on the vehicle due to location. Been a while since I was under the Tahoe, but from the picture posted above, top of it's kind of close to the body. The internals are removed via the top, not the bottom. Trying to get the circlip off would be tedious I believe.

 

You mentioned Katech 17 above, what are you referencing? The Katech 174 is an engine thermostat, not ATF circuit related. I only brought that up in the OP because of, what I perceive, these Tahoe's run warm. I live in AZ and I had some high ECTs just driving around town, not a fan of their cooling strategy. I brought up my concerns directly with the dealer(s) and GM corporate and we were told by the Engineering Department, my concerns were not valid and the Powertrain was operating within the designed temps....and then a year later GM released their TB for a lower temp trans tstat...

Edited by 14burrito
Posted
19 hours ago, cs15dah said:


Isn’t that one of the main reasons why this thread started? The OP buying just the internals, in the form of the Katech 17, and installing into his existing TBV? But I get it. You’re specifically asking about OEM GM internals. 

 

The pill flip is free. So yeah, I see why folks tend to want to do that. But for less than the cost of a tank of fuel, one could buy the new 70c TBV. I see they’re available on eBay for $50-80, shipped. GM Parts Giant about the same price; maybe just a bit more. My opinion, I’d only want to do the job once. Not that it’s hard. I’m just lazy. So I’d rather spend the $50+ up front and do the job just once. Just my recommendation, if you plan on doing the new TBV down the road anyways. 
 

Has anyone done the pill flip, or the Katech 17, with the TBV still on the truck? I can’t imagine it being done without a lot of difficulty. So if you’re having to take the TBV off the truck anyways, may be less work to just swap in the new TBV. 
 

Sheesh. Reading the above it looks like I make commission off of TBV sales! Not really trying to sway your decision. Really just saying it may not be worth doing the free mod now, if you’re just going to do the $50+ mod later anyways. 😂

The replacement TBV won't work on my '14.  Not the right tube connections.  So I'd have to swap out the guts and throw the aluminum housing away.  Makes no sense when for 1/2 the price of a tank of gas I could just buy the guts in a kit and convert my existing TBV.  It is a waste of money and materials...

  • Like 1

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Latest Articles

  • Posts

    • Can it still be Assembled I?    Stribeck says that we need a certain amount of viscosity under conditions of load and velocity to prevent two surfaces of a know roughness from tearing each other asunder. And we have marketing trying to tell the masses that those two surfaced require less of that commodity due to more exact limits being placed on the same old clearances. We also know that there are limits to how hard something can before it becomes to brittle to be viable and to smooth to 'wet' the surface and that both of those conditions have been known and met since about the Second World War.    That viscosity value shook out at 10 centistokes at 212 F just under a hundred years ago.  Give this a look: [Anton Parr]     What is advertised is the Kinematic viscosity (mm2/s) or that which has been density adjusted but the value we are after is the dynamic viscosity (mPa.s) or true viscosity. You can see that this number is dependent on density thus base stock and temperature. You can also see that an SAE 30 doesn't reach that value in this example. However an SAE 30 that is at the upper end of the SAE 30 range; 12.5 cSt (mm2/s), might. 12.5 * .83 = 10.375 (mm2/s). If you could find an SAE 30 at the upper end these days.   Then there is the complication of viscosity modifiers or VII or VM, whatever you wish to call them. Polymers added to very thin base oils, perhaps 3 to 6 cP oils, that will meet the SAE *W30 spec at 'tested' shear rates and 100 C/212F  target temperature. So a polymer fortified base that is a fraction of the 10 cP requirement Stribeck insist upon.   This could be all well and good if those polymers didn't have two very problematic 'features'. They shear or loose viscosity both 1.) permanently and 2.) temporality. And they do both omitted in the advertised data with the distinct  purpose of deceiving the consumer of the actual operating state of the fluid. I've shown the example of Warren Oils COSTCO 10.91 cSt 5W30 formuation several times where the 100 C HTHS value is 6.9 cP!! That's the temporary shear down and with and SSI or shear stability index of 9.4 cSt. Note the intentional deception in using mixed units?    After a short while that 9.4 cSt oil has a viscosity corrected dynamic value of 7.8 cP. But as the SSI is still within the range of an SAE *W30 whose lower value is 9.3 cSt.    This allows them to continue to call this SAE 16 weight oil a 30 weight, the cake, and still meet the API requirements for fuel efficiency IMPROVEMENT mandated by the EPA. The eating of the cake. By the time you've worn out your motor doing the responsible thing by adhering to the warranty requirements, (the stick), you get deprived of the carrot, wear control. So sad, to bad.   So what can be done? Do I need actually say? [Anton Parr]       Even this must be monitored if the oil is on the low side and the VII an organic or you opt for a 0W40 with an even lighter base oil and more / higher MW VII. (Note the lower density of the 40 weight versus the SAE 30 mono-weight?)    There is another workaround. Temperature. An SAE *W30 run at a bulk temperature of between 180 and 195 F.    Being the belt and suspenders sort I am I do both. Run it cook and run it heavy.    In Part II I'll work the AW package. 
    • So, do I go elbow-deep on this thing or list it for sale and play dumb? Seems to "runs good."   I'm about $1200 away from having: -a rebuilt injector ($300) -a new cat ($250) -a new cat back exhaust (OE style) ($300) -a new AC compressor ($200) -AC refrigerant charge ($150)   In theory, this should rectify the obvious detracting issues from its value and operability. Cold AC with a non-squeaking AC pulley both sounds and feels good. An exhaust that isn't cut/hacked in 17 different places and doesn't vibrate on a crossmember would make it sound and feel less janky. A working cat would help the stink, and will save the earth, but *if and only if* the fuel system is working properly, which would also address the intermittent "rich" CEL.   Heard a good one... CEL for "Rich condition" means you haven't spent enough money on the truck lately, and it's letting you know.   Rebuilding the injector would seem to be the most important part. Replacing the cat would be secondary. I don't think mine is plugged or overly restricted, but it might be a little restricted? I have no good way to tell other than seat of the pants feel. I hate the smell.   The current theory is I have a rich idle problem: A bad fuel pressure regulator, or a leaking injector(s) being the highest probabilities. I already replaced the FPR but that doesn't mean its replacement isn't also bad. It was a new part from Dorman, but the packaging looked like it had been sitting on a shelf for 20 years.   This is the (single) upstream O2 sensor shown at idle. I'm getting a lot of "rich" it seems. Sometimes it stays high like that and doesn't drop down. That makes me think it's processing injector leaks or a partially stuck open injector.     Other times it looks like this. Nice oscillations between rich and lean, which is what I think it should be. Under load and at speed, the oscillations are nice and tight and uniform looking, high and low.     Fuel trims suggest the PCM is compensating pretty hard at idle to pull fuel out. But it's not enough to trip a CEL. Something about slowing to a stop: brake vaccum booster, EGR, or the EVAP purge is delayed, or there's pooled fuel in the intake again that's draining into a cylinder is enough to set the CEL. Of course, in two days of driving, it hasn't set. I was hoping to actually look at the freeze-frame data when it sets. IAT is high because it's idling on an 83 degree day here.  
    • Have considered installing a DC to DC charger in your camper to replace your isolator?  
    • Common failure.  You need to replace the fuel door housing.   The painted cover transfers over to the new housing.  To remove the old one there is 4 spots where you poke the plastic to release it.  
    • No such thing as regenerative braking on a pure ICE vehicle.     Regenerative braking is the re-capture of energy from electric motors and stores it in the battery pack.  So hybrids, PHEV and EVs have regenerative braking.     What you are seeing is the charging system changing modes is all.  Its likely entering charge mode for some sort of reason is all.  All of the charging modes will be listed below.   As for L10 vs D.  L10 turns off automatic grade braking.  L10 puts you in control of grade downshifts where in D it will automatically do it based on brake pedal position and other factors.  Otherwise L10 and D drive exactly the same aside from that one aspect.    Battery Sulfation Mode The BCM will enter this mode when the interpreted Generator output voltage is less than 13.2 V for 45 minutes. When this condition exists the BCM will enter Charge Mode for 2–3 minutes. The BCM will then determine which mode to enter depending on voltage requirements.   Charge Mode The BCM will enter Charge Mode when ever one of the following conditions are met:   Windshield wipers are ON for more than 3 s. Climate Control Voltage Boost Mode Request is true, as sensed by the HVAC control module via serial data. High speed cooling fan, rear defogger, and HVAC high speed blower operation can cause the BCM to enter the Charge Mode. The estimated battery temperature is less than 0°C (32°F). Battery State of Charge is less than 80%. Vehicle speed is greater than 145 km/h (90 mph) A current sensor malfunction exists. System voltage is determined to be below 12.56 V When any one of these conditions is met, the system will set targeted generator output voltage to a charging voltage between 13.9–15.5 V, depending on the battery state of charge and estimated battery temperature.   Fuel Economy Mode The BCM will enter Fuel Economy Mode when the estimated battery temperature is at least 0°C (32°F) but less than or equal to 80°C (176°F), the calculated battery current is less than 15 A and greater than −8 A, and the battery state-of-charge is greater than or equal to 80%. Its targeted generator output voltage is the open circuit voltage of the battery and can be between 12.5–13.1 V. When fuel economy mode is active, the generator is not charging, only maintaining open circuit battery voltage. The BCM will exit this mode and enter Charge Mode when any of the conditions described above are present.   Headlamp Mode The BCM will enter Headlamp Mode when ever the head lamps are ON (high or low beams). Voltage will be regulated between 13.9–14.5 V.   Start Up Mode When the engine is started the BCM sets a targeted generator output voltage of 14.5 V for 30 s.   Tow/Haul Mode (if applicable) Pressing the Tow/Haul Mode button located on the center stack, the vehicle system voltage is raised and the remote (non-vehicle) battery will be charged. Having the headlamps on will raise the system voltage and if the Tow/Haul button is applied it will not serve any purpose. The voltage is regulated between 13.9-14.5 V.      
  • GM-Trucks.com Clubs

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...