Oil Consumption

[riddler]

On 6/1/2026 at 6:11 AM, diyer2 said:

We get rid of one instigator, and another one shows up. 

Have a a seat before you collapse, You'll never get rid of me. 

[riddler]

3 hours ago, Atlas said:

 

Then why even change it?

 

 

 

What got you the boot before this?

Wrong thread. Nevermind 

[Grumpy Bear]

23 hours ago, Atlas said:

Ok well I guess Lake disagrees with me on a few points.

• I call oil consumption pretty basic. Rudimentary. He calls it "really complicated."
• I think 1qt consumed in 3k miles is a lot. He says that's normal.

In 22 minutes, he'll use his natural talent to explain oil consumption to anyone watching this video. He covers everything from obvious engine damage to how normally functioning healthy engines consume oil by design.

• Lake explicitly states how you drive will impact oil consumption.

 

Shut up and watch:

 

 

 

That's a good video @Atlas. On point and informative. Highlights the changes over the decades. Experience needs to be informed of pertinent changes to remain relevant. Nice find. Thanks! 

[Grumpy Bear]

Third time. Some consumption is 'masked' by fuel dilution, soot formation, acid formation of blowby gasses. Oil consumed offset by degradation products produced. 2 to 8% How much is that of your sump volume? for Pepper that is 4 ounces to a pint of oil.

 

Why is everyone aware that we check transmission fluids at operating temperatures due to thermal expansion and ignorant or at least dismissive about this issue for the engine oil? 

 

Ever allow a motor to drain at oil change for a period of 'overnight"? Measure on the dipstick every quarter hour for say 2 hours and educate yourself.  Then let is sit overnight (cooler) and ask the expansion and dilution questions again.  

 

 

 

 

[Atlas]

Talk about throwing people for a loop! The newer Jeep 4-cylinders (2018+, "Hurricane" engine) make people think they're hallucinating when checking the oil. A proper oil check, described in the owner's manual, is exactly 5 minutes after shutdown of a fully warm engine. Not before 5 minutes. Not when the engine is cold. You have to take a reading when the recirculation in the turbo and top engine has drained down, but not completely empty.

 

When those engines are stone-cold, the dipstick reads almost 1.5 quarts overfull. When they're warm right after shutdown, the stick may read almost empty..

 

If you change the oil and dump out 5 quarts of dirty oil including changing the filter, and refill with 5 quarts, this really can mess with your head if you check the oil later on and don't know what you're looking at.

 

[MORSNO]

9 minutes ago, Atlas said:

Talk about throwing people for a loop! The newer Jeep 4-cylinders (2018+, "Hurricane" engine) make people think they're hallucinating when checking the oil. A proper oil check, described in the owner's manual, is exactly 5 minutes after shutdown of a fully warm engine. Not before 5 minutes. Not when the engine is cold. You have to take a reading when the recirculation in the turbo and top engine has drained down, but not completely empty.

 

When those engines are stone-cold, the dipstick reads almost 1.5 quarts overfull. When they're warm right after shutdown, the stick may read almost empty..

 

If you change the oil and dump out 5 quarts of dirty oil including changing the filter, and refill with 5 quarts, this really can mess with your head if you check the oil later on and don't know what you're looking at.

 

 

Wow, what a swing on the dipstick between hot and completely cold!  

[riddler]

18 minutes ago, Atlas said:

Talk about throwing people for a loop! The newer Jeep 4-cylinders (2018+, "Hurricane" engine) make people think they're hallucinating when checking the oil. A proper oil check, described in the owner's manual, is exactly 5 minutes after shutdown of a fully warm engine. Not before 5 minutes. Not when the engine is cold. You have to take a reading when the recirculation in the turbo and top engine has drained down, but not completely empty.

 

When those engines are stone-cold, the dipstick reads almost 1.5 quarts overfull. When they're warm right after shutdown, the stick may read almost empty..

 

If you change the oil and dump out 5 quarts of dirty oil including changing the filter, and refill with 5 quarts, this really can mess with your head if you check the oil later on and don't know what you're looking at.

 

Probably should check it while running. Like an auto transmission. Record it and check it from there.

[Chuck FB]

7 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Third time. Some consumption is 'masked' by fuel dilution, soot formation, acid formation of blowby gasses. Oil consumed offset by degradation products produced. 2 to 8% How much is that of your sump volume? for Pepper that is 4 ounces to a pint of oil.

 

Why is everyone aware that we check transmission fluids at operating temperatures due to thermal expansion and ignorant or at least dismissive about this issue for the engine oil? 

 

Ever allow a motor to drain at oil change for a period of 'overnight"? Measure on the dipstick every quarter hour for say 2 hours and educate yourself.  Then let is sit overnight (cooler) and ask the expansion and dilution questions again.  

 

 

 

 

 

Here's an example of how a do it yourselfer or even a shop could end up over filling the crank case during an oil change. Drop the oil on ether an almost cold engine or they did warm it up as it was a vehicle that sat in a lineup of vehicles that require repairs, they drop the oil and let that drip out as they then proceed onto do other repairs and finally lowered down off the lift and fill the now cold engine with oil, run it the half minute or less, turn off and are in a rush and check the oil level and its low ( cold engine and cold oil haven't had a chance to all drain back to the pan ) so they add oil until its at the full mark on the dipstick and then close the hood and send it out the door. The owner of the vehicle if they don't check it or seldom check it would not have a clue that the oil started out being above full. Same scenario with the do it yourselfer that is too quick to check the oil after running the engine and tops it off and never checks it again for some thousands of miles and finds the oil at or near the full mark and is impressed his vehicle uses no oil when in fact it does use some but the technique of the oil change allowed for an over fill and was not rechecked hours later to confirm the level with a cold engine and oil that had all drained back to the pan. And the thing is, its easily done if not realizing or just in a hurry and in shops time is money so there is no waiting around hours for the oil to finally drain down on a cold engine. 

[asilverblazer]

20 hours ago, KARNUT said:

So you’re saying when you fill with new oil it reads full. But when you drain it, it reads full but comes out a qt low? I have no words.

No, when I fill with new it's within the marked area on the stick, when I drain, it's still within the marked area. I've never measured where within the marked area it is at different times, if I were to estimate the differential between the highest and lowest point I'd guess less than 1/4".

[asilverblazer]

One could interpret this to mean the level should be right in the middle of the marked area, above the top line is indicated to be just as bad as below the bottom... 

[asilverblazer]

20 hours ago, Atlas said:

 

I'm stumped but it sounds like a brain teaser. I'm assuming you're already accounting for any oil saturated in filter media that gets tossed with the old filter, although that would be a fairly large filter to hang on to an entire quart.

 

 

Again, every vehicle I've touched I drain out less than what I put in. (Further evidence is I use the new containers to take in the old oil, they never overflow, and there's plenty room to pour more in when the drain pan is empty. Usually, an empty quart bottle on the two newest trucks with room to spare in another.)

 

Pull drain plug and let drain into catch pan. Pull filter and dump into catch pan, set upside down on the fancy little filter holder to drain 'more'. Take a few minutes to clean up, get new stuff out, etc. Clean drain plug, clean oil filter sealing surface, inspect things, whatever... Put drain plug in and install new filter. Fill engine with new oil set aside the new (empty) containers. Pour the old oil in the new containers, note the markings on the side, put old filter in the new filter box. Wipe out pan. Throw away one empty quart container. Cap the others, one will usually have some room in it still.

 

There may be "some drop" on the dip stick, it's never been a quantity to warrant measuring for sake of comparing to any previous reading. Of course, given this conversation I'll be making much more careful observations of the reading on the dipstick, to see what 1 quart plus minus looks like within the marked area.

 

However, the dipstick, in my opinion, isn't the most accurate gauge to determine "oil consumption, use, etc." not that I have any better alternative. I think it's best suited to determine if engine has a reasonable amount of oil to prevent failure.

 

If an EXACT amount was required, it wouldn't have a range specified, it would have a single mark. GM knows some oil will be lost, note the acceptable consumption per mile. The larger capacity pans that have come about in the last decade I think are a result of that, to allow for some between changes without the result of oil starvation. 

[asilverblazer]

14 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Why is everyone aware that we check transmission fluids at operating temperatures due to thermal expansion and ignorant or at least dismissive about this issue for the engine oil? 

 

Ever allow a motor to drain at oil change for a period of 'overnight"? Measure on the dipstick every quarter hour for say 2 hours and educate yourself.  Then let is sit overnight (cooler) and ask the expansion and dilution questions again.  

I'm aware - but not to how much.

 

Why I'm not alarmed at seeing 'fluctuations', 'drops', etc. on the dipstick... Is it in the range? Yes, good.

[KARNUT]

29 minutes ago, asilverblazer said:

One could interpret this to mean the level should be right in the middle of the marked area, above the top line is indicated to be just as bad as below the bottom... 

My oil is at operating temperature when drained. The oil is cool going in. The amount that’s called for goes in. Then it’s started. Then shut off and if needed filled to the top of the line. Now days no matter where I go they use bulk oil. Valvoline or Honda. Valvoline they show me the stick I’m sitting in the vehicle during. Honda I’m watching through a plate glass window. Around every 1000 miles I check at the same gas pump at Kroger’s while I’m getting gas. The oil is at the top hatch in all my vehicles. It’s usually very hard to see because it’s clean.

Edited Friday at 08:50 PM by KARNUT

[riddler]

8 minutes ago, asilverblazer said:

Again, every vehicle I've touched I drain out less than what I put in. (Further evidence is I use the new containers to take in the old oil, they never overflow, and there's plenty room to pour more in when the drain pan is empty. Usually, an empty quart bottle on the two newest trucks with room to spare in another.)

 

Pull drain plug and let drain into catch pan. Pull filter and dump into catch pan, set upside down on the fancy little filter holder to drain 'more'. Take a few minutes to clean up, get new stuff out, etc. Clean drain plug, clean oil filter sealing surface, inspect things, whatever... Put drain plug in and install new filter. Fill engine with new oil set aside the new (empty) containers. Pour the old oil in the new containers, note the markings on the side, put old filter in the new filter box. Wipe out pan. Throw away one empty quart container. Cap the others, one will usually have some room in it still.

 

There may be "some drop" on the dip stick, it's never been a quantity to warrant measuring for sake of comparing to any previous reading. Of course, given this conversation I'll be making much more careful observations of the reading on the dipstick, to see what 1 quart plus minus looks like within the marked area.

 

However, the dipstick, in my opinion, isn't the most accurate gauge to determine "oil consumption, use, etc." not that I have any better alternative. I think it's best suited to determine if engine has a reasonable amount of oil to prevent failure.

 

If an EXACT amount was required, it wouldn't have a range specified, it would have a single mark. GM knows some oil will be lost, note the acceptable consumption per mile. The larger capacity pans that have come about in the last decade I think are a result of that, to allow for some between changes without the result of oil starvation. 

Oil dipsticks have a range (usually marked with "L" and "F" or a crosshatched area) because oil naturally expands as it gets hot. This range gives your engine a safe margin of operation, ensuring there is enough oil to properly lubricate moving parts without overfilling it past the maximum

[riddler]

Just now, riddler said:

Oil dipsticks have a range (usually marked with "L" and "F" or a crosshatched area) because oil naturally expands as it gets hot. This range gives your engine a safe margin of operation, ensuring there is enough oil to properly lubricate moving parts without overfilling it past the maximum

Expansion and retraction not consumption