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Shell Rotella Gas Truck oil Report 3k Miles

Bob2C

By Bob2C
in Engines & Drivetrain

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Bob2C Enthusiast

Bob2C

Posted
Posted

Interesting high level of copper. Thoughts

 

84e831165d3a23ea1141aa48a6f1a13c.jpg

 

 

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HeySkippyDog Senior Enthusiast

HeySkippyDog

Posted
Posted

You have 23,000 miles.

I'm inclined to believe that's still some breaking in of the engine. They are not the fragile little flowers they are made out to be on here.

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Grumpy Bear Senior Enthusiast

Grumpy Bear

Posted
Posted

The entire Ecotec3 series shows high copper levels. Higher than other motor platforms according to Terry Dyson at Dyson Labs.

 

There is a VOA for this oil on BITOG. Some highlights below. 

 

ISO 4406:99 Cleanliness is just average. 19/18/14 (Blackstone can run this test) This can be improved which will improve the insolubles and lower wear rates with a good filter. I've seen AMSOIL Ea filters clean worse to a ISO 14/13/11. 

 

7.35 is the initial TBN. No TAN reported. I know most reporters don't give it a thought as long as it's over 1 but there is a good deal of commercial information suggesting it should never fall below the TAN. Rough rule of thumb is 30% of the initial TBN. Better would have a TAN run as well. It rises as oil ages and some oils have a fairly high ambient acid number. Blackstone can give you VOA information on that. 

 

Initial 100 C viscosity is 8.5 The NEW SAE range is 6.9 to 9.3. Your reported 6.61 is getting into the new 16W range. You don't have enough fuel to dilute this far. Shear is a good guess. 

 

This link will have some info on that topic

 

https://www.selectsynthetics.com/part-2--oil-viscosity-grades-.html

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Grumpy Bear Senior Enthusiast

Grumpy Bear

Posted
Posted
54 minutes ago, gone_fishing said:

Looks overall. I have ran a few UOA's on my Sierra and copper was originally in the mid 30's PPM but started to trend downwards eventually. Last few reports had copper in the low 20's PPM. Some have said its from the oil cooler. Here is some information that supports that: https://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/646/copper-diesel-engine-oil

Interesting point on oil temperature in that link. 220 F starts leaching and it goes up exponentially with temperature.  I know you have a Scan Gauge II and track your oil temp. What does it run down the road after a few hours?

 

35 K ago my copper was 24 ppm on a 5 K OCI. Last UOA was at 80 K. I should have another look someday. 

Bob2C Enthusiast

Bob2C

Posted
  • Author
Posted
Looks overall. I have ran a few UOA's on my Sierra and copper was originally in the mid 30's PPM but started to trend downwards eventually. Last few reports had copper in the low 20's PPM. Some have said its from the oil cooler. Here is some information that supports that: https://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/646/copper-diesel-engine-oil

Good article. Thanks for sharing.


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gone_fishing Enthusiast

gone_fishing

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Interesting point on oil temperature in that link. 220 F starts leaching and it goes up exponentially with temperature.  I know you have a Scan Gauge II and track your oil temp. What does it run down the road after a few hours?

 

35 K ago my copper was 24 ppm on a 5 K OCI. Last UOA was at 80 K. I should have another look someday. 

Typical highway driving (not towing) during the summer, the oil temp and coolant temp are very close to each other. Usually between 202-206F. Can take a while for oil to get up to these temps depending on ambient temps. In the winter, oil temps are maybe a little under coolant temp (5-10 degrees).

 

When I tow my boat, I keep the trans in 5th gear (which of course raises RPMs). I usually tow between 65-70 MPH. Coolant temp usually stays where it normally does but oil will rise to around 220F. What's interesting is I have ran in 5th gear while not towing and oil temps are about the same as when towing (220F range). I don't think its the towing load the causes the temps to rise but mostly the increase in RPM's. Granted I am towing a relatively light boat (under 3000 lbs) and local roads are generally flat so I'm not working the engine very hard. I think the highest towing oil temp I've ever seen is around 230F. That was on a hot day, AC on, and a long trip on interstate.

Grumpy Bear Senior Enthusiast

Grumpy Bear

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, gone_fishing said:

Typical highway driving (not towing) during the summer, the oil temp and coolant temp are very close to each other. Usually between 202-206F. Can take a while for oil to get up to these temps depending on ambient temps. In the winter, oil temps are maybe a little under coolant temp (5-10 degrees).

 

When I tow my boat, I keep the trans in 5th gear (which of course raises RPMs). I usually tow between 65-70 MPH. Coolant temp usually stays where it normally does but oil will rise to around 220F. What's interesting is I have ran in 5th gear while not towing and oil temps are about the same as when towing (220F range). I don't think its the towing load the causes the temps to rise but mostly the increase in RPM's. Granted I am towing a relatively light boat (under 3000 lbs) and local roads are generally flat so I'm not working the engine very hard. I think the highest towing oil temp I've ever seen is around 230F. That was on a hot day, AC on, and a long trip on interstate.

Well that nails down one thing I've wondered. The 5.3 has the oil cooler in the cold tank ( I was told) but the 4.3 has it in the hot tank. Before I lowered the thermostat it was routinely over 225 F, would hit 245 F on a hot day even at lower highway speeds. Saw 250 F + on 100 F days running 70 mph. Now it's running 195 F summer 188 F winter with the 170 F water stat. My water temp at highway runs 175 F summer 170 F winter. I've noticed the higher numbers in 5th gear as well. 

Z45 Senior Enthusiast

Z45

Posted
Posted

The appearance of Copper in a used oil analysis should not be cause for alarm or repair unless other abrasive wear metal such as iron, aluminum, chromium, etc. are present at higher than normal levels. There are several possible sources for high Copper levels. Leaching from oil coolers, leaks from cooling systems, external contaminates, an oil additive, or from excessive wear. In all of these cases, other metals, materials and contaminates will be present.

Bob2C Enthusiast

Bob2C

Posted
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Posted

Thanks for the replies. Much better informed now.


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mookdoc6 Senior Enthusiast

mookdoc6

Posted
Posted
On ‎5‎/‎20‎/‎2020 at 12:53 PM, Bob2C said:

Thanks for the replies. Much better informed now.


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I posted 100k worth of used oil analysis so you can check that out.  GM's always have had HIGH copper readings in V8's gas/diesel and takes well over 100k and up to 200k dependent upon driving factors to normalize.  

Bob2C Enthusiast

Bob2C

Posted
  • Author
Posted
I posted 100k worth of used oil analysis so you can check that out.  GM's always have had HIGH copper readings in V8's gas/diesel and takes well over 100k and up to 200k dependent upon driving factors to normalize.  

Thanks. I’ll check them out.


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Grumpy Bear Senior Enthusiast

Grumpy Bear

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, mookdoc6 said:

I posted 100k worth of used oil analysis so you can check that out.  GM's always have had HIGH copper readings in V8's gas/diesel and takes well over 100k and up to 200k dependent upon driving factors to normalize.  

Where are these Mook?

mookdoc6 Senior Enthusiast

mookdoc6

Posted
Posted
30 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Where are these Mook?

I posted 100k worth of UOA in a thread called "For Grumpy's eyes only" or something like that.

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