Leveled w/ Bilstein 5100s, are new Upper Control Arms needed?

hurlz07tahoe · July 11, 2016

Sorry for beating this dead horse some more. but I can't find my specific question. I'm lookin got level the front of my 2015 1500 with the Bilstein 5100s. For those that have done this, are new UCAs needed to make a proper upper ball joint angle? What about to get the alignment right?

I was looking at the Fabtech and Cognito UCAs with the uni-ball design.

thearizonacowboy · July 11, 2016

They're not "needed" but definitely worth the money to correct the angles. My upper ball joint was making all kinds of noise (Fox coilovers installed) until I installed new arms. The quality of Cognito UCAs are definitely higher than the OEM arms too.

Before:

After:

hurlz07tahoe · July 11, 2016

They're not "needed" but definitely worth the money to correct the angles. My upper ball joint was making all kinds of noise (Fox coilovers installed) until I installed new arms. The quality of Cognito UCAs are definitely higher than the OEM arms too.

Before:

After:

Awesome. Thanks for the pictures. They say "1000 words!!"

thearizonacowboy · July 11, 2016

No problem, if you're looking at uniball UCAs, I highly recommend Camburg's 1.25" uniball UCA

thearizonacowboy · July 11, 2016

Make sure you know which suspension you already have (steel vs aluminum): Camburg has UCAs for both options

https://camburg.com/shop/suspension/camburg-chevy-1500-2wd-4wd-07-15-1-25-performance-uniball-upper-arms-oem-steel/

https://camburg.com/shop/suspension/camburg-chevy-gmc-1500-2wd-4wd-14-15-1-25-performance-uniball-upper-arms-oem-alum/

ChevyRoofer · July 11, 2016

They're not "needed" but definitely worth the money to correct the angles. My upper ball joint was making all kinds of noise (Fox coilovers installed) until I installed new arms. The quality of Cognito UCAs are definitely higher than the OEM arms too.

Does installing the 5100 series shocks to replace the OEM shocks actually change the angle enough to hurt the stock UCAs over 2-4 years time?

I was under the impression of something different.

thearizonacowboy · July 11, 2016

Does installing the 5100 series shocks to replace the OEM shocks actually change the angle enough to hurt the stock UCAs over 2-4 years time?

I was under the impression of something different.

Some people will say yes and some will say no. But after just a short while, I started having popping noises with my Fox leveling coilovers set at 2". I'm sure they would be "okay" for 2-4 years but it's not something I would be comfortable with. And the new arms really do help with the ride quality overall. It's a nice upgrade that you'll notice and appreciate.

hurlz07tahoe · July 11, 2016

Some people will say yes and some will say no. But after just a short while, I started having popping noises with my Fox leveling coilovers set at 2". I'm sure they would be "okay" for 2-4 years but it's not something I would be comfortable with. And the new arms really do help with the ride quality overall. It's a nice upgrade that you'll notice and appreciate.

Do you have larger blocks in the rear? What size tire are you riding on?

gabekalp · July 11, 2016

I have about 17k miles on my stock arms with kings set at about 3"

While I plan on getting arms, I haven't pulled the trigger yet. I've had no issues so far

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh and I'm running 35" tires

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

thearizonacowboy · July 11, 2016

Do you have larger blocks in the rear? What size tire are you riding on?

Back when I was rocking that setup I had a 2" block in the rear sitting on 33s. I'm currently installing a whole new setup.

ChevyRoofer · July 11, 2016

I see that now haha. Now who has the proof?

Edit: Found one from a rep actually. Looks like that's good enough proof for me.

Some people will say yes and some will say no. But after just a short while, I started having popping noises with my Fox leveling coilovers set at 2". I'm sure they would be "okay" for 2-4 years but it's not something I would be comfortable with. And the new arms really do help with the ride quality overall. It's a nice upgrade that you'll notice and appreciate.

First, the 6112 is not available for the gm truck yet.

1. Pre loading is not how a 5100 works. It just raises the spring perch. The truck raises along with the spring perch. The ball joint won't see any different load or angle with a 5100 shock, unlike a spacer kit.

2. Longer, many times longer.

3. Remains to be seen.not available yet

4. Yes, a 5100 will provide better ride and control.

5. He said "show me the money!"

Its really isnt a comparison. Spacers do not improve the ride, cause extra wear on joints, limit UPTRAVEL, overextend stock components. A .5" spacer wont be as bad as a 3". A spacer does nothing for performance except lift the truck. A spacer can cause stock shocks to be over compressed causing shock failure. This has been proven time and time again on many make and models of trucks.

A bilstein, regardless of setting, does not limit travel up or down. It will provide extra suspension articulation over stock, allow for full suspension range of motion, improve the ride with better valving and dampening characteristics, allow for better dampening on rough roads as they are monotube shocks vs a cheap twin tube. As they use the stock upper mount, the shock angle is in a better position which will keep the coil from hitting the arm.

I posted a link that answer all of these questions above. PLEASE READ THIS - http://www.bilsteinus.com/fileadmin/user_upload/user_upload_us/pdfs/Bil_LevShks_WebArticle.pdf

hurlz07tahoe · July 12, 2016

Thanks, ChevyRoofer. Good finds!

I'm still not sold on how raising the UCA upper pin locations, regardless of the type of lift, doesn't affect the UCA ball joint angle. I suppose you correct some of it with larger tires, but I'm not sure if it's a linear relationship between tire size and height increase of the UCA pin locations.

Donstar · July 12, 2016

1. Pre loading is not how a 5100 works. It just raises the spring perch. The truck raises along with the spring perch. The ball joint won't see any different load or angle with a 5100 shock, unlike a spacer kit.

I believe that I misread this when it was first posted. It now doesn't make sense. The net effect of raising the perch is lengthening the overall strut which should increase control arm angles in the same manner as using spacers. The advantage to the Bilsteins (as I understand) is a slightly longer and much better quality shock than stock. How can ball joints "not see any different load or angle" with Bilsteins?

ChevyRoofer · July 12, 2016

1. Pre loading is not how a 5100 works. It just raises the spring perch. The truck raises along with the spring perch. The ball joint won't see any different load or angle with a 5100 shock, unlike a spacer kit.

I believe that I misread this when it was first posted. It now doesn't make sense. The net effect of raising the perch is lengthening the overall strut which should increase control arm angles in the same manner as using spacers. The advantage to the Bilsteins (as I understand) is a slightly longer and much better quality shock than stock. How can ball joints "not see any different load or angle" with Bilsteins?

Follow that link above for a comparison between the Bilstein's and other leveling kits/strut spacers/etc. Was good info and a good read.

As long as Bilstein isn't just making this stuff up they post on their website (very doubtful and wouldn't be this popular still)...I'd have to be inclined to believe them about their product.

Donstar · July 12, 2016

Follow that link above for a comparison between the Bilstein's and other leveling kits/strut spacers/etc. Was good info and a good read.

As long as Bilstein isn't just making this stuff up they post on their website (very doubtful and wouldn't be this popular still)...I'd have to be inclined to believe them about their product.

Thanks, I have read the Bilstein pages and believe it is a good product. However, I am missing where it claims Bilsteins do not create any different angles to the suspension geometry. You cannot increase the height of the strut without altering the stock angles of your control arms, as well as the drive and steering components.