Jump to content

Another 6L80 FAILED!

PhilGMCYukon
 Share

Recommended Posts

PhilGMCYukon New Member

PhilGMCYukon

Posted
Posted

Hello everyone, 

 

I own a 2019 Yukon 5.3 4x4. (70k miles)  The dreaded transmission slippage has hit my vehicle. It has become relatively undriveable. I can accelerate it to speed but slowly to allow the transmission to engage gears. I took the vehicle to an independent shop who told me they had some computer tool to manually control the transmission (never heard of such a tool), and there is an internal failure. They want $3600 to take it apart and try to fix the problem. I'd rather not let anyone start taking things apart. Took to GMC service center, and they deemed the transmission faulty and and want to replace it $6500. The warranty went out last October. I tried to petition GM for cost assistance since its barely out of warranty, and they will only help if the dealer will also provide some kind of cost assistance. Dealer said without a transmission maintenance record, I can kick rocks. 

 

Since this issue has come up, I see online now ongoing issues with this transmission with overheating. A service bulletin was released in 2021 about the trans Thermal Bypass Valve. It seems my transmission has been running super hot, and now its cooked. Anyone have any advice on how to petition the dealer or manufacture to fix this??

  • Sad 2
KARNUT Senior Enthusiast

KARNUT

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, PhilGMCYukon said:

Hello everyone, 

 

I own a 2019 Yukon 5.3 4x4. (70k miles)  The dreaded transmission slippage has hit my vehicle. It has become relatively undriveable. I can accelerate it to speed but slowly to allow the transmission to engage gears. I took the vehicle to an independent shop who told me they had some computer tool to manually control the transmission (never heard of such a tool), and there is an internal failure. They want $3600 to take it apart and try to fix the problem. I'd rather not let anyone start taking things apart. Took to GMC service center, and they deemed the transmission faulty and and want to replace it $6500. The warranty went out last October. I tried to petition GM for cost assistance since its barely out of warranty, and they will only help if the dealer will also provide some kind of cost assistance. Dealer said without a transmission maintenance record, I can kick rocks. 

 

Since this issue has come up, I see online now ongoing issues with this transmission with overheating. A service bulletin was released in 2021 about the trans Thermal Bypass Valve. It seems my transmission has been running super hot, and now its cooked. Anyone have any advice on how to petition the dealer or manufacture to fix this??

Transmission service record? Did things change with newer models? Before I joined this website and knew better. The owners manual would say transmission fluid change could be anywhere from 100K to 150K. My last truck an older one didn’t get its first fluid change until 165K when I bought it. It still happily shifting at 184K. Are they saying you should have followed the severe service maintenance? Wouldn’t that be 60K miles? Sounds like hair splitting to me. Good luck.

  • Like 1
CMoore711 Enthusiast

CMoore711

Posted
Posted (edited)

I agree with @Karnut with only 70K miles I would push back on the dealer.

 

Owners manual says "normal" maintenance first transmission fluid service is at 97.5K miles. 

"Severe" maintenance schedule first transmission fluid service is at 47.5K miles and 2nd one at 90K miles.

 

There may be an argument that based on normal use (no towing) at 70K miles you wouldn't have serviced the transmission yet.  So you can ask the dealer at only 70K miles what type of transmission maintenance record should exist?  No matter what their answer is tread lightly with a "non-confrontational approach".

 

"Well I was reviewing my owners manual in the Service and maintenance section and it states here on page 397 in the Maintenance Schedule for Normal use, which is what I follow since I don't tow or anything with it, and the first transmission fluid service doesn't need to occur until I'm at 97.5K miles?  So if I'm operating my vehicle normally based on the manufacturer's recommendation why would I have a transmission service prior to 97.5K miles?".  Then service guy may down the Sever Maintenance schedule rabbit hole and then I'd simply say "But I don't use my vehicle for any "severe duty" use;  I don't tow or haul anything it's simply a family kid hauler."

 

That being said a lot of this will be based on your relationship with the dealer and it will still be at their discretion.  Personally, I wouldn't count on much coming out of that conversation.

 

Being that your out of warranty I also wouldn't put the a GM remanufactured 6l80 transmission back in it either.  Find a good reputable transmission builder that knows the 6l80 specifically (they exist), have one built for you with upgraded clutch packs, stronger than normal/OE parts, no thermal bypass valve so it runs cooler, and a billet torque converter at stock stall speed and call it a day.  You'll still be in the $6,500 +/- range.  Then start changing the transmission fluid and filter every 45-50K miles.  It's a $500 service that will extend the life of your $6,500 transmission significantly.  And at the rate you drive with a 2019 with only 70K miles $500-$600 every 3-4 years for proactive maintenance is nothing. 

Edited by CMoore711
  • Like 3
Grumpy Bear Senior Enthusiast

Grumpy Bear

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 4/18/2024 at 10:32 AM, CMoore711 said:

I agree with @Karnut with only 70K miles I would push back on the dealer.

 

Owners manual says "normal" maintenance first transmission fluid service is at 97.5K miles. 

"Severe" maintenance schedule first transmission fluid service is at 47.5K miles and 2nd one at 90K miles.

 

There may be an argument that based on normal use (no towing) at 70K miles you wouldn't have serviced the transmission yet.  So you can ask the dealer at only 70K miles what type of transmission maintenance record should exist?  No matter what their answer is tread lightly with a "non-confrontational approach".

 

"Well I was reviewing my owners manual in the Service and maintenance section and it states here on page 397 in the Maintenance Schedule for Normal use, which is what I follow since I don't tow or anything with it, and the first transmission fluid service doesn't need to occur until I'm at 97.5K miles?  So if I'm operating my vehicle normally based on the manufacturer's recommendation why would I have a transmission service prior to 97.5K miles?".  Then service guy may down the Sever Maintenance schedule rabbit hole and then I'd simply say "But I don't use my vehicle for any "severe duty" use;  I don't tow or haul anything it's simply a family kid hauler."

 

That being said a lot of this will be based on your relationship with the dealer and it will still be at their discretion.  Personally, I wouldn't count on much coming out of that conversation.

 

Being that your out of warranty I also wouldn't put the a GM remanufactured 6l80 transmission back in it either.  Find a good reputable transmission builder that knows the 6l80 specifically (they exist), have one built for you with upgraded clutch packs, stronger than normal/OE parts, no thermal bypass valve so it runs cooler, and a billet torque converter at stock stall speed and call it a day.  You'll still be in the $6,500 +/- range.  Then start changing the transmission fluid and filter every 45-50K miles.  It's a $500 service that will extend the life of your $6,500 transmission significantly.  And at the rate you drive with a 2019 with only 70K miles $500-$600 every 3-4 years for proactive maintenance is nothing. 

 

I have 243,000 miles on a GM Ecotec 2.4 Oil burner. Local dealer told me that at this number of miles people are generally on their third motor. So, he asked me how I got just ONE to go that far?

 

Answer? 

 

With zero help from GM! 

 

image.png.896bb5207bb2b478f00b644971622b60.png

 

Protect the transmission, not the warranty. 

:idiot:

Edited by Grumpy Bear
  • Haha 1
newdude Senior Enthusiast

newdude

Posted
Posted
On 4/12/2024 at 5:30 PM, PhilGMCYukon said:

Hello everyone, 

 

I own a 2019 Yukon 5.3 4x4. (70k miles)  The dreaded transmission slippage has hit my vehicle. It has become relatively undriveable. I can accelerate it to speed but slowly to allow the transmission to engage gears. I took the vehicle to an independent shop who told me they had some computer tool to manually control the transmission (never heard of such a tool), and there is an internal failure. They want $3600 to take it apart and try to fix the problem. I'd rather not let anyone start taking things apart. Took to GMC service center, and they deemed the transmission faulty and and want to replace it $6500. The warranty went out last October. I tried to petition GM for cost assistance since its barely out of warranty, and they will only help if the dealer will also provide some kind of cost assistance. Dealer said without a transmission maintenance record, I can kick rocks. 

 

Since this issue has come up, I see online now ongoing issues with this transmission with overheating. A service bulletin was released in 2021 about the trans Thermal Bypass Valve. It seems my transmission has been running super hot, and now its cooked. Anyone have any advice on how to petition the dealer or manufacture to fix this??

 

 

The original TBV was correct at the time the truck was built.  It full opened at 194F and that was the normal operating temperature as designed. 

 

GM determined due to the mass amount of torque converter failures (which mostly a design of the converter issue rather than the heat but the heat doesn't help as it shortens fluid life) that 194F was "too hot" and lowered it to 158F full open on the new thermostat.  

 

You will probably get nowhere with GM on it if the dealer won't help on assistance.  This is why its always important to keep records if you are trying for work under warranty or for customer assistance just outside of warranty.  

  • 2 months later...
cbarn Enthusiast

cbarn

Posted
Posted
On 4/24/2024 at 5:19 PM, newdude said:

The original TBV was correct at the time the truck was built.  It full opened at 194F and that was the normal operating temperature as designed. 

 

GM determined due to the mass amount of torque converter failures (which mostly a design of the converter issue rather than the heat but the heat doesn't help as it shortens fluid life) that 194F was "too hot" and lowered it to 158F full open on the new thermostat.  

 

Sorry to re-open this thread after a few months, but I'm in a similar situation - used 2018 Suburban (bought with 96K miles on it) just came back from the shop after the torque converter shredded itself and shot metal through the transmission.  Fortunately I'd purchased it with an extended warranty specifically because I'd seen issues at about 100K with transmissions, so the full replacement at the dealer was covered.  What I don't know, though, is whether the new transmission (a rebuild) would have the lowered thermostat - driving home by a rather circuitous route (but no highway) I didn't see temp exceed 162F (and it's a 93F day).  Any way to check this?

newdude Senior Enthusiast

newdude

Posted
Posted
On 7/11/2024 at 7:08 PM, cbarn said:

 

Sorry to re-open this thread after a few months, but I'm in a similar situation - used 2018 Suburban (bought with 96K miles on it) just came back from the shop after the torque converter shredded itself and shot metal through the transmission.  Fortunately I'd purchased it with an extended warranty specifically because I'd seen issues at about 100K with transmissions, so the full replacement at the dealer was covered.  What I don't know, though, is whether the new transmission (a rebuild) would have the lowered thermostat - driving home by a rather circuitous route (but no highway) I didn't see temp exceed 162F (and it's a 93F day).  Any way to check this?

 

 

It the work was done at the dealer, you should have the part #s of what was installed on the truck on your paperwork.  85585333 is the number. 

 

The other method is crawl under it and see if you see "70" stamped in the TBV.  

 

Chances are pretty high the dealer installed it because of the TSB for the TBV, and your temps on a hot day sound about right for the new one being installed.  

  • Like 1
MaverickZ71 Senior Enthusiast

MaverickZ71

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, newdude said:

 

 

It the work was done at the dealer, you should have the part #s of what was installed on the truck on your paperwork.  85585333 is the number. 

 

The other method is crawl under it and see if you see "70" stamped in the TBV.  

 

Chances are pretty high the dealer installed it because of the TSB for the TBV, and your temps on a hot day sound about right for the new one being installed.  

 

At the last 2 GM dealers I was at, they no longer give you that backup paperwork showing part numbers, labor hours, fluids/quantities, shop supplies, etc. They have it printed out, but they don't let you have it. You sign a single page cover sheet that you are paying $X and accepting your vehicle as is after they performed X service, and then you get an unsigned, simplified copy of that one sheet back. If you had 6 services performed, it shows a half-assed description of only the first thing they did. When I said hey, we used to get all of those backup details, the Service Mgr smirked and said yeah, and labor used to be $75 an hour, too, and closed the window. 🤬

Edited by MaverickZ71
  • 4 months later...
Tusz New Member

Tusz

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 4/12/2024 at 5:30 PM, PhilGMCYukon said:

Hello everyone, 

 

I own a 2019 Yukon 5.3 4x4. (70k miles)  The dreaded transmission slippage has hit my vehicle. It has become relatively undriveable. I can accelerate it to speed but slowly to allow the transmission to engage gears. I took the vehicle to an independent shop who told me they had some computer tool to manually control the transmission (never heard of such a tool), and there is an internal failure. They want $3600 to take it apart and try to fix the problem. I'd rather not let anyone start taking things apart. Took to GMC service center, and they deemed the transmission faulty and and want to replace it $6500. The warranty went out last October. I tried to petition GM for cost assistance since its barely out of warranty, and they will only help if the dealer will also provide some kind of cost assistance. Dealer said without a transmission maintenance record, I can kick rocks. 

 

Since this issue has come up, I see online now ongoing issues with this transmission with overheating. A service bulletin was released in 2021 about the trans Thermal Bypass Valve. It seems my transmission has been running super hot, and now its cooked. Anyone have any advice on how to petition the dealer or manufacture to fix this??

Hey Phil and everyone, another one bites the dust. 98k miles 2019 Yukon. Mine is doing the exact same as what you described. What a shame. 5 years old and bought it brand new….Was curious what you ended up doing and how your trans has been, Phil?. Mines getting rebuilt Monday from a shop that knows these and I’m getting a billet convertor. I’m gonna bring up to him about the TSB  about the thermostatic bypass valve for the 6L80. Effectively lowering the thermostatic valve operational temperature at 150 degrees instead of 190. Is that something I should definitely have done?. Another question I have is with going forward with a new rebuilt trans without the oem convertor, would it be wise to to delete the AFM on the engine?. I’ve read in other places that does not help these transmission 

Edited by Tusz
  • 3 weeks later...
mikemcclain8 Enthusiast

mikemcclain8

Posted
Posted

While I can't speak directly to the question about AFM delete, I can say that I bought a '15 suburban with 60,000 miles on it and immediately put in the Range to delete AFM.  I made it to 229,000 miles before the transmission blew up.  So, maybe it helps as the transmission guy told me they often go out between 100-150k.

swathdiver Senior Enthusiast

swathdiver

Posted
Posted
On 4/12/2024 at 5:30 PM, PhilGMCYukon said:

Hello everyone, 

 

I own a 2019 Yukon 5.3 4x4. (70k miles)  The dreaded transmission slippage has hit my vehicle.

 

It's been almost a year now Phil, what's the outcome to this story?

 

diyer2 Senior Enthusiast

diyer2

Posted
Posted

Trans fluid changes makes a lot of sense to me, and using better fluid.

  • Like 1
BIGDOGx Senior Enthusiast

BIGDOGx

Posted
Posted
On 12/17/2024 at 7:06 AM, diyer2 said:

Trans fluid changes makes a lot of sense to me, and using better fluid.

I dont get why the manual states the wrong advice of 100k intervals, no one should go 100k on the original trans oil. That is literally begging to have premature trans failure imo. I would say 50 or a bit under if you tow, and 60-65k if you dont and im talking a real service with dropping the pan and changing the filter.

  • Like 1
swathdiver Senior Enthusiast

swathdiver

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, BIGDOGx said:

I dont get why the manual states the wrong advice of 100k intervals, no one should go 100k on the original trans oil. That is literally begging to have premature trans failure imo. I would say 50 or a bit under if you tow, and 60-65k if you dont and im talking a real service with dropping the pan and changing the filter.

 

Almost everybody's driving habits fall under the severe service category.  The interval is about 45K miles for that year.

 

I had my transmission fluid analyzed at 36K and they said it had 10K of life left in it.  We now change it between 36-40K or so, sooner if we've done any towing of substance.

 

Redesigning the cooling system and using that thermostat on the side of the transmission condemned many of them to a service life of only about 100K miles.  They also had condenser issues because of this.  Sometimes newer ain't better.  

  • 3 months later...

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share
Go to topic listing

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Forum Statistics

    250.5k
    Total Topics
    2.7m
    Total Posts

  • Member Statistics

    342,947
    Total Members
    8,960
    Most Online
    Sothpaw27
    Newest Member
    Sothpaw27
    Joined

  • Who's Online   1 Member, 0 Anonymous, 475 Guests (See full list)

  • Latest Articles

  • Posts

    • Grumpy Bear
      Some Assembly is Required

      By Grumpy Bear · Posted

      www.enginelabs.com/news/what-i-learned-today-bearing-clearances-vs-oil-viscosities/     www.enginelabs.com/news/oil-viscosity-can-the-numbers-be-misleading/ The Big Lie… Coming full circle to the reason Lake discusses the Porsche engines in particular. Based on the 2000 samples in the SPEEDiagnostix database, increasing the oil viscosity in these engines, even those run on the track, showed no significant difference in results.   The smoking gun was in the oil chemistry. That is where the data shows higher instances of more wear. Molybdenum was the key; the higher the amount, the less the wear. Speed postulates that higher viscosity oils have more thickeners to artificially inflate their viscosity numbers. These thickeners lose viscosity under shear, and the result is that not all oils of the same viscosity have the same shear stability.   Having enough viscosity is the most important characteristic, but according to Speed, once that required viscosity level is reached, additive chemistry matters more than additional viscosity. Speed also states, oil pressure problems on the racetrack aren’t a viscosity problem; it’s an oiling system problem. Running a thicker oil is just a band-aid for an underlying oiling system problem.
    • Grumpy Bear
      Some Assembly is Required

      By Grumpy Bear · Posted

      Can it still be Assembled II?   Viscosity on the decline by various means. Heat on the rise making that worse. Engine RPM in the tank. Smaller motors with more boost trying to emulate an electric motor. Full torque, zero rpm. Then we will triple the OCI. Argh.    But wait....there is more. LSPI has pushed a shift from Ca to Mg and as that cost more PLUS the run to lower sulfur compounds the TBN is moving in the wrong direction for the increased OCI's demanded.    That not being enough to placate a demand for a parameter they can't measure the other sulfur bearing compounds are also under attack. That would be zinc and phosphorus sulfonate compounds. To some degree those are being replaced with boron esters and others, i.e. titanium ect. All of which have shorter service lives. And there there is the "Secrete Sauce" marketing for AW adds that 'Can't be detected by UOA's" but trust me because I (the blenders) never ever lie.    Spoiler alert; ALL additives are sacrificial! Smaller amounts of the old blended with less robust versions of the new do not equal longer service lives. So what are the blenders recommending? Wait for it.......   MOVING THE GOAL POSTS! OMG      Let's declare the long standing TAN/TBN crossover irrelevant and tell people that soot is a great 'graphite' based lubricant which can aid tribo films. Wait, what? Let's declare that the standards used for oxidation and nitration were to conservative and can be expanded. Let's tell them that because GDI fuel dilution, although being a VISCOSITY KILLER and an acid generator is actually okay because we have better base oils that limit viscosity failure limits. (Said knowing this is measured in fractions of a centipoise and in bases not commonly used in shelf oils)   Lying from the heart is not just the new normal but we have a public, a very young public, that is so ignorant of the facts and so sure of their "RESEARCH" into AI driven models base in regurgitated  instead of scientific research based unvarnished, peer reviewed FACTS that the incoming guard is loosing their grip on reality and the OEM's are tickled pink while the blends bend the knee.    You have an ever limited set of tools to work with. And sooner or later those will be taken from you as the API and the EPA strangle the last remaining fluids from the system. What you have left is your wits. If you care to use them.    At some point in the very near future it will not longer be possible to do "What is best for the machine", and be replaced with "The best you have access too". You WILL be rewarded with half the life and twice the cost. That isn't that hard to predict.         
    • Chuck FB
      Software Update

      By Chuck FB · Posted

      I trust you saw the other comment where he knew what he was talking about !. Yes, these darned newer vehicles with all their so smart they are stupid technology, goes and drains the battery down. As you might see my other comment, I installed a Noco 5 battery tender under the hood and at this point still have the cord routed so I have to lift the hood and then plug it in but am typically parked in a garage or a shed so its not risking the engine hood in the wind. That way I am assured or hopefully so of not finding I have a battery drawn down and can't even start the truck and that also damages the battery to draw it down too far. 
    • Chuck FB
      Software Update

      By Chuck FB · Posted

      I guess no surprise my guesses were wrong !, at least now I know if I ever happen to see it grayed out in my own truck as to what is going on.    I never happened to catch my truck with it grayed out, it seemed every time I would test to see if there was an update it never found anything and yet more than once I would check to see if there was an update and there was nothing, then a day later or even that same morning I would drive to town and after more than one engine shut down in town as I did my errands it would pop up that there is an update now ready to install and the only place I have a connection to the internet is at home by wifi so its not as if it grabbed the download while driving. I don't trust these new vehicles due to all the crap they can decide to do while sitting for some days not running and run the battery down so most of the time if I know the truck will sit for a few days I plug in the battery tender I have mounted under the hood and so the only time the truck must have downloaded software was when it was sitting in the garage where the signal is awful but I have that tender plugged in and somehow it managed to download it. I honestly detest all this crap, way to easy to leave a person stranded.    Since I don't trust any of it I don't do the install of the already downloaded software until I get home and sometimes have even sat in the truck to watch what its doing as its going through the process to its conclusion as its not like it is set up that it will tell you the next time you fire up the engine that the update that was initialed actually installed or installed properly. Yes I can go into the updates and see the list. After I go through the install where I feel its safe to do so in case it breaks down as a result, I will plug in the battery tender after the fact to recharge as I don't know how much power its taking just to do the install and that can take a while for it to install. 
    • nfisherman
      Software Update

      By nfisherman · Posted

      Thanks for the reply. All settings were correct and the engine was off, as it was supposed to be. It turned out to be something simple. I took a drive for about an hour. I must have had a low battery without knowing it. The voltage gauge on the display looked ok. At the end of my drive, I shut off the engine and the update prompt came up and it updated normally. It’s ironic because one of the features of the update is a reduction of battery drain. 

  • GM-Trucks.com Clubs

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...