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Shadytree Alignment

Mossyoakglock

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Mossyoakglock Senior Enthusiast

Mossyoakglock

Posted
Posted

I had to take my truck to get an alignment done this past weekend. I took it in and picked it up and drove it home. I noticed that it was still pulling to the left when the steering wheel was straight (steering wheel off to the right when going straight) so I took it back and asked them to fix it. They said that he drove it and took it back in to tweaked the wheel but I don't think he did considering the amount of time he had it.

 

Is there a shady-tree mechanic procedure to get my steering wheel straight? If not, I'll take it back there Friday morning before I have to go into work to make sure they fix it this time.

 

Having a steering wheel that is not straight, especially after doing an alignment, is one of my pet peeves. Plus, the way I see it is that I paid you $60 to get an alignment and make sure the steering wheel is straight (twice) and you can't get it right and that's your job.

 

We've always taken our cars there and they usually do a great job so I'll see if they can get it right a 3rd time.

old-chevy-dude Senior Enthusiast

old-chevy-dude

Posted
Posted

god you know I hate shops that do this..

 

you are supposed to line the steering wheel up straight BEFORE you start the alignment.. it's not rocket science and it's freaking common sense.. if the steering wheel isn't straight to start how the hell do you actually align the damn thing within specs..

 

stupid shop..

 

 

take it back and stand there and make sure he does it right.. or tell him to find someone that actually knows how to use the freaking equipment.

dewfpo Senior Enthusiast

dewfpo

Posted
Posted
if the steering wheel isn't straight to start how the hell do you actually align the damn thing within specs..

 

You can align the front end with the wheel off center. Some techs/shops do it all the time. It will drive straight down the road and be within specs but the wheel will be off center. It's not right but happens all the time.

 

DEWFPO

old-chevy-dude Senior Enthusiast

old-chevy-dude

Posted
Posted
if the steering wheel isn't straight to start how the hell do you actually align the damn thing within specs..

 

You can align the front end with the wheel off center. Some techs/shops do it all the time. It will drive straight down the road and be within specs but the wheel will be off center. It's not right but happens all the time.

 

DEWFPO

 

 

 

I understand that... but common sense says.. "I'm aligning a vehicle the steering wheel should be straight" or even more so "if the wheel isn't straight then the customer will be back to bitch about it.."

Mossyoakglock Senior Enthusiast

Mossyoakglock

Posted
  • Author
Posted
if the steering wheel isn't straight to start how the hell do you actually align the damn thing within specs..

 

You can align the front end with the wheel off center. Some techs/shops do it all the time. It will drive straight down the road and be within specs but the wheel will be off center. It's not right but happens all the time.

 

DEWFPO

 

 

 

I understand that... but common sense says.. "I'm aligning a vehicle the steering wheel should be straight" or even more so "if the wheel isn't straight then the customer will be back to bitch about it.."

 

 

Which is what I'm going to be doing. I'm going to be nice about it but when I pay to have a service/maintenance done, I expect it to be right especially if that is your job and what you get paid to do.

 

Are they supposed to put a steering wheel lock on the steering wheel to keep it straight and centered as they align the vehicle?

jdubub Senior Enthusiast

jdubub

Posted
Posted

3rd time's a charm! :cheers: hopefully. almost every time ive gotten an alignment the same crap has happened

minibike132 Senior Enthusiast

minibike132

Posted
Posted

I see everyone that commented has obvious extensive allignment experience :cheers: .

 

Most of the new equipement is great at helping you get the wheel straight right out of the gate. The last place I was at had a great brand new Hunter machine that was real good at this.

 

BUUTTT when you have an old machine like the one I have now you can line that wheel up, go under and set the toe and check the wheel only to have it off 5 degrees. I've watched inexperienced guys do this on an old machine 10X before they start throwing wrenches. No matter what you do, no matter how tight you hold the wheel or how tight the suspension is when you adjust one side you will push or pull the other side a little. As I said newer machines have the processing power to watch that push and pull and help make the adjustments on the fly. The older ones take alot of getting used to.

 

Yes there is a "shadytree" way of setting the wheel straight but it isn't as uncommon as you might think. When I started out and old machines fought you on every single one we didn't worry about getting the wheel straight on the rack. By we I mean no one, not one single guy I know (not even in tech school) even bothered trying. Get it close, go on the road test and adjust the wheel after the road test.

 

Let's pick a direction (I forgot which way your wheel was off) say the wheel is off to the right 5 degrees. If the cross toe setting is supposed to be and is at zero while on the rack then the allignment is correct, the wheel being off is just a perception that the allignment is not correct. We want to change that 5 degrees of wheel perception back the other way while keeping the cross toe still at zero. This is easily done without hooking everything back up and doing it all over only to have it 5 off the other direction.

 

Simply mark the tie rod ends location, loosen them up and move them the exact same amount to turn both wheels in the direction percieved. If the wheel is off to the right and I turn the tie rod ends 1/4 turn each to pitch both wheels right to match the wheel then I have not changed the angles just the perception at the wheel.

 

The guy should have paid more attention to the wheel on the road test but shit happens, no one is perfect all the time. If this is a shop that does all your work and does it well then I wouldn't get all jacked up about a small oversight on a road test.

ChevyTech77 Senior Enthusiast

ChevyTech77

Posted
Posted
god you know I hate shops that do this..

 

you are supposed to line the steering wheel up straight BEFORE you start the alignment.. it's not rocket science and it's freaking common sense.. if the steering wheel isn't straight to start how the hell do you actually align the damn thing within specs..

 

stupid shop..

 

 

take it back and stand there and make sure he does it right.. or tell him to find someone that actually knows how to use the freaking equipment.

You haven't done many alignments, have you?

 

To the OP, take it back. The toe setting could be way off by this point if the tech didn't watch what he was doing while centering the steering wheel. It can be done right, without the alignment equipment, if it was right when it came off the rack but at this point, who knows for sure where it is.

ChevyTech77 Senior Enthusiast

ChevyTech77

Posted
Posted
I see everyone that commented has obvious extensive allignment experience :cheers: .

 

Most of the new equipement is great at helping you get the wheel straight right out of the gate. The last place I was at had a great brand new Hunter machine that was real good at this.

 

BUUTTT when you have an old machine like the one I have now you can line that wheel up, go under and set the toe and check the wheel only to have it off 5 degrees. I've watched inexperienced guys do this on an old machine 10X before they start throwing wrenches. No matter what you do, no matter how tight you hold the wheel or how tight the suspension is when you adjust one side you will push or pull the other side a little. As I said newer machines have the processing power to watch that push and pull and help make the adjustments on the fly. The older ones take alot of getting used to.

 

Yes there is a "shadytree" way of setting the wheel straight but it isn't as uncommon as you might think. When I started out and old machines fought you on every single one we didn't worry about getting the wheel straight on the rack. By we I mean no one, not one single guy I know (not even in tech school) even bothered trying. Get it close, go on the road test and adjust the wheel after the road test.

 

Let's pick a direction (I forgot which way your wheel was off) say the wheel is off to the right 5 degrees. If the cross toe setting is supposed to be and is at zero while on the rack then the allignment is correct, the wheel being off is just a perception that the allignment is not correct. We want to change that 5 degrees of wheel perception back the other way while keeping the cross toe still at zero. This is easily done without hooking everything back up and doing it all over only to have it 5 off the other direction.

 

Simply mark the tie rod ends location, loosen them up and move them the exact same amount to turn both wheels in the direction percieved. If the wheel is off to the right and I turn the tie rod ends 1/4 turn each to pitch both wheels right to match the wheel then I have not changed the angles just the perception at the wheel.

 

The guy should have paid more attention to the wheel on the road test but shit happens, no one is perfect all the time. If this is a shop that does all your work and does it well then I wouldn't get all jacked up about a small oversight on a road test.

Quick question, what the hell is cross toe? Just asking.

minibike132 Senior Enthusiast

minibike132

Posted
Posted
Quick question, what the hell is cross toe? Just asking.

 

If toe is +.5 L and +.5 R then the cross toe is 0

If toe is +.5 L and 0 R then cross toe is .5

If toe is -.5 L and +.5 R then cross toe is 1.0 and so on it's the difference between right and left just like cross camber and cross caster.

ChevyTech77 Senior Enthusiast

ChevyTech77

Posted
Posted

I've been doing alignments for 15 years and never heard of cross toe. You might be thinking of TOTAL toe

which is a spec in every alignment manual that i've ever seen but never cross toe. Cross camber and cross

caster yes.

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