Another oil thread

[KARNUT]

2 minutes ago, customboss said:

Here’s another thing @KARNUT this website continually allows an Internet, right wing focus that’s usually more nationalist, populist and acts like it’s just normal American thought. I’m here to tell you as a combat veteran who’s suffering for my service I get sick of hearing just one side of the story and by golly, I should have the opportunity to speak without being squelched. It affects our GM trucks. It affects our fuel. It affects our lives, so don’t lecture me about something you never freaking gave blood or treasure to.

and finally, I have begged for this website to turn me off and shut me off as my dementia progresses and as my pain progresses and they won’t do it I’ve asked him to do it so you argue with them all of you that complain about hearing a different point of view, and it offends your delicate little sensibilities Tell him to shut me off. I don’t need to be here. I’m here because I’m trying to share with maybe younger members who haven’t heard this point of view veterans point of view a person who lost his career point of view because he served this constitution.  I care about it. 

Well I got sucked in again. He’s probably hurling insults by now. It’s par the course for losers of common sense during discussion. And this is an oil thread he’s once again going to get locked. So i need to just stop responding to this €%%>?}.

[customboss]

1 minute ago, KARNUT said:

Well I got sucked in again. He’s probably hurling insults by now. It’s par the course for losers of common sense during discussion. And this is an oil thread he’s once again going to get locked. So i need to just stop responding to this €%%>?}.

I’m addressing energy and oil. All you have to do is respond truthfully instead of promoting your point of view that happens to be extremely political but nobody here seems to recognize it because I guess just agree with it. I only respond to what’s posted in these places.

[customboss]

Renewable Lubricants, Inc.’s Post

Renewable Lubricants, Inc.

1,495 followers

2d

What exactly are renewable lubricants and why do they matter? Unlike conventional lubricants derived from petroleum, renewable lubricants are formulated from biobased or re-refined materials. Many of these products meet the criteria to be classified as Environmentally Acceptable Lubricants (EALs) under the EPA’s Vessel General Permit (VGP). To earn that designation, a lubricant must be: Readily biodegradable Non-toxic to aquatic life Not bioaccumulative But not all renewables are biodegradable and that’s not always the goal. Take re-refined base oils: these are high-quality base oils recovered from used lubricants through advanced refining processes that remove contaminants, restore performance, and return the oil to a like-new state. They extend the service life of oil molecules and reduce the need to tap new crude. While re-refined oils may not be 'readily biodegradable,' they are renewable and RLI uses them for applications like motor oils, where biodegradability is not functional. Why? Because once a motor oil hits the crankcase, it's tasked with capturing combustion byproducts, functioning like a septic system and a lubricant. The focus here is stability, detergency, and protection not biodegradation. It’s time to ask: What’s really inside your lubricant systems? Learn more: https://renewablelube.com #RenewableLubricants #VGP #Sustainability #ReRefinedOils #MotorOil #Biobased #CleanTech #HydraulicFluids #EnvironmentalCompliance

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[customboss]

[customboss]

USA Home grown made esters.
 

 

Fields of Innovation: The Story of Renewable Lubricants

Renewable Lubricants, Inc.

Renewable Lubricants, Inc.

We Manufacture High-Performance Environmentally…

Published Jun 22, 2023

+ Follow

Once nestled in the heart of the countryside, there existed a farm unlike any other. This was no ordinary farm, for it was the birthplace of a company called Renewable Lubricants, Inc., (RLI). Known as the largest and oldest environmentally friendly lubricant manufacturer in North America, this company had a mission deeply rooted in service, innovation, and preserving the planet.

Renewable Lubricants prides itself on producing high-performance, environmentally friendly, sustainable products. The full line of lubricants, greases, and cleaners directly replace conventional petroleum products, offering a sustainable alternative that is both effective and kind to the Earth. With over 180 US and International Patents, the commitment to excellence is evident in every facet of our work.

Founded in 1991 as a research and development company, RLI aims to minimize reliance on foreign oil and conserve petroleum for essential applications. It all began with an ambitious inventor toiling away in his garage, concocting corn-based engine oil. From those humble beginnings, the company has grown exponentially, now offering an impressive array of over 250 products.

Fueling the passion for innovation were grants from prestigious institutions like the United Soybean Board, the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA), and the Department of Defense (DOD). Lubrizol and Dow AgroSciences also lent their support to the company's groundbreaking endeavors. With government grants, contracts, and working agreements in their repertoire, Renewable Lubricants had forged invaluable partnerships with the Department of Defense, Department of the Interior, Department of Energy, Department of Agriculture, and numerous other esteemed organizations.

[customboss]

21 minutes ago, customboss said:

Why? Because once a motor oil hits the crankcase, it's tasked with capturing combustion byproducts, functioning like a septic system and a lubricant.

Liked that comment. Unique thought. 

[txab]

I've got 3 cases of this to try 

[customboss]

35 minutes ago, txab said:

I've got 3 cases of this to try 

My 1978 Jeep J20 AMC 360 V8 likes it. 
 

The former L3B turbo 4 in the Custom TrailBoss loved it too. 

[txab]

Throwing it into the 5.3 next

[Grumpy Bear]

Block Pore Testing ISO 4406-99

 

There is this idea that the ISO 4406-99 block pore test is useless because 1.) the oil is dark and 2.) what is captured are additives like Moly. 

 

Block pore is done by measuring the TIME it takes a volume of sample to pass a screen (sieve)  of a particular mesh. An algorithm then calculates the ppm at that particle size. that algorithm is base on known measurements of weighed samples (tests done to standardize the test) in clean oils. Myth #1 busted. Time can't measure color and a sieve can't filter it. It is an ISO professionally recognized standard benchmark. 

 

Colloidal additives, like Moly, are of such fine size, typically 0.05 to 0.3 micron as not to be captured in the finest 4.0 micron sieves used in the ISO 4406-99 Test which is the finest screen used in this test.  Others (additives) are in solution and as a solution would require RO type filtration. That is 0.0001 micron to remove.

 

AMSOILS EaBP bypass systems filter down to 2 micron at 98.75 efficiency. Is AMSOIL saying their filter strips the additives from their oils? 

 

Can it be tricked by air in the sample? Yea, if the operator is an idiot. What can happen in a high school lab and what does happen in a certified lab is quite different. 

 

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colloid 

 

 https://www.freepurity.com/pages/micro-ultra-nano-and-reverse-osmosis-filtration-whats-the-difference

 

Now, particle counters can be tricked by dark oils. 

 

PQ Index

 

https://en.oelcheck.com/wiki/pq-index/

 

Dimensionless number. Almost always under 25 in a healthy motor that tells you nothing, until it does, and even then can't tell you much but "Oh crap". It's an idiot light test. More useful for more forgiving gear boxes and diffs than engines. Speed Diagnostics uses a hand held to tell you if there is iron over 10 micron present. If so, and it is rare, the other quantitative test are possible. 

 

ASTM D5185 MOD

 

https://testoil.com/data-interpretation/introduction-elemental-spectroscopy/

 

The test is deadly in the 0 to 5 micron range but will detect to @ 10 micron. Stating otherwise is just untruthful. Thus the usefulness of Speed Diagnostics 'one hitter'. Again there are other quantitative test for abnormal results. Your lab, if it is a good one, will advise further testing and methods if applicable. 

 

Summary. Block pore is an indication of filtration effectiveness. Nothing more, nothing less and it is useful if extended life is your goal. GM test studies used this test! 

 

Edited August 2, 2025 by Grumpy Bear

[customboss]

10 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

There is this idea that the ISO 4406-99 block pore test is useless because 1.) the oil is dark and 2.) what is captured are additives like Moly. 

Where did you get that idea?

 

PQ is an excellent test for large ferritic particles ICP or AA misses. 

 

Most labs don't use pore block tests for particle counting why you mentioned that? 

 

You help 50% then confuse the rest for those that care. 

[customboss]

10 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Colloidal additives, like Moly, are of such fine size, typically 0.05 to 0.3 micron as not to be captured in the finest 4.0 micron sieves used in the ISO 4406-99 Test which is the finest screen used in this test.  Others (additives) are in solution and as a solution would require RO type filtration. That is 0.0001 micron to remove.

Incorrect and misleading.  Pore blockage and laser light counting WILL count additives that alglomerate in " clumps " for lack of a better term, and count them at low um readings. Water present and they stick together even worse.  

 

So for a clean reference oil test the unactivated additives that in an operating engine or machine ( normally  heating activation and plating out in MOS2 or forms of that in ester or synthesized versions) will show up.  Many additives are absorbed into the alloys as in phosphorus case and react with the metal lowering the PPM reading or particle counter algorthimic estimate. PC is always an estimate within a statistical mean. 

 

Cyclonic or centrifugal oil filters can remove additives, saw it first hand in testing in Europe with MB diesels and centrifugal filters using Mobil DELVAC 1 in early 2000's. 

 

The take away is you need an experienced trained analyst to interpret oil analysis and the methods used ALSO understanding the application, filtering, environment, and lubricant and fuel in use or you guess. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 2, 2025 by customboss

[customboss]

10 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Block Pore Testing ISO 4406-99

 

There is this idea that the ISO 4406-99 block pore test is useless because 1.) the oil is dark and 2.) what is captured are additives like Moly. 

 

Block pore is done by measuring the TIME it takes a volume of sample to pass a screen (sieve)  of a particular mesh. An algorithm then calculates the ppm at that particle size. that algorithm is base on known measurements of weighed samples (tests done to standardize the test) in clean oils. Myth #1 busted. Time can't measure color and a sieve can't filter it. It is an ISO professionally recognized standard benchmark. 

 

Colloidal additives, like Moly, are of such fine size, typically 0.05 to 0.3 micron as not to be captured in the finest 4.0 micron sieves used in the ISO 4406-99 Test which is the finest screen used in this test.  Others (additives) are in solution and as a solution would require RO type filtration. That is 0.0001 micron to remove.

 

AMSOILS EaBP bypass systems filter down to 2 micron at 98.75 efficiency. Is AMSOIL saying their filter strips the additives from their oils? 

 

Can it be tricked by air in the sample? Yea, if the operator is an idiot. What can happen in a high school lab and what does happen in a certified lab is quite different. 

 

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colloid 

 

 https://www.freepurity.com/pages/micro-ultra-nano-and-reverse-osmosis-filtration-whats-the-difference

 

Now, particle counters can be tricked by dark oils. 

 

PQ Index

 

https://en.oelcheck.com/wiki/pq-index/

 

Dimensionless number. Almost always under 25 in a healthy motor that tells you nothing, until it does, and even then can't tell you much but "Oh crap". It's an idiot light test. More useful for more forgiving gear boxes and diffs than engines. Speed Diagnostics uses a hand held to tell you if there is iron over 10 micron present. If so, and it is rare, the other quantitative test are possible. 

 

ASTM D5185 MOD

 

https://testoil.com/data-interpretation/introduction-elemental-spectroscopy/

 

The test is deadly in the 0 to 5 micron range but will detect to @ 10 micron. Stating otherwise is just untruthful. Thus the usefulness of Speed Diagnostics 'one hitter'. Again there are other quantitative test for abnormal results. Your lab, if it is a good one, will advise further testing and methods if applicable. 

 

Summary. Block pore is an indication of filtration effectiveness. Nothing more, nothing less and it is useful if extended life is your goal. GM test studies used this test! 

 

 

Particle Quantification Test

The concept of a "Particle Quantification test scale" is not explicitly mentioned in the provided context. However, there are several methods and indices related to particle quantification that are discussed. For instance, the Particle Quantification Index (PQI) is a bulk magnetic index used to measure the total ferromagnetic content in oil samples. This index is used as a screening test to determine the presence of ferrous debris, which can indicate wear in machinery.

 

Another method mentioned is the use of image analysis for quantifying the surface texture of coarse aggregate particles. This approach involves erosion and dilation techniques to measure surface irregularities at the pixel level, providing a quantitative index for surface texture.

 

Additionally, particle size distribution analysis is discussed, which involves determining the percentage of particles of different sizes in a sample. This can be done using various methods such as Laser Diffraction, Dynamic Light Scattering, and Sieve Analysis. The results are often presented in tabular or graphical form, and statistical parameters like d10, d50, and d90 are used to describe the distribution.

These methods and indices provide different ways to quantify particles, depending on the specific application and the type of particles being analyzed.

[Grumpy Bear]

 

[Grumpy Bear]

API SQ

 

https://www.chevronlubricants.com/en_us/home/learning/from-chevron/personal-rec-vechicles-and-equipment/understanding-the-new-api-sq-category.html