How well the stock intake works

SILVER SLED · October 27, 2020

Those times were using the dashhawk. I didn't use it much for times for the TBSS, but it was usually only about a tenth off actual times. Those times are so good I have my doubts as to how accurate it is.

SILVER SLED · October 27, 2020

2 minutes ago, TNTSilverado said:

Nice, I also read you had a Trailblazer SS ? Did you do any upgrades. I had a 2006 Superior Blue AWD SS 10 years ago. Loved it, was very quick for it's time, except I couldn't stand the terrible 4 spd. I had a 3200 stall, CAI, tune.I went through 2 transmissions in the darn thing.

I had an 07 TBSS, white, awd new back in 07. I had Vector Motorsports tune, my home made "cold air" intake, ud pulley. It ran a best 13.08 at 104. I was/am SLOWWHITE on TBSSowners.com. No transmission work, I kinda got lucky on that.

TNTSierra · October 27, 2020

4 minutes ago, SILVER SLED said:

I had an 07 TBSS, white, awd new back in 07. I had Vector Motorsports tune, my home made "cold air" intake, ud pulley. It ran a best 13.08 at 104. I was/am SLOWWHITE on TBSSowners.com. No transmission work, I kinda got lucky on that.

Nice. I was/am TNTSS on there. Have not been to the site in a few years

SILVER SLED · October 27, 2020

14 minutes ago, TNTSilverado said:

Nice. I was/am TNTSS on there. Have not been to the site in a few years

I'd like to find someone with a stockish TBSS to run. Milan dragway has a test and tune the next two weekends. I had no intentions and not much time to go there, but I am now kinda curious.

TNTSierra · October 27, 2020

Just now, SILVER SLED said:

I'd like to find someone with a stockish TBSS to run. Milan dragway has a test and tune the next two weekends. I had no intentions and not much time to go there, but I am now kinda curious.

I didn't ever run my TBSS but from the seat of my pants and how well this 10 Spd shifts. I think my truck can take this. My best friend and son's good father has 2 stout race cars both pushing over 800+ at the crank and he also stated my new truck would beat my old SS. That 4 spd really hindered those vehicles. They needed a 6 spd back then to really keep the LS2 in its sweet spots.

SILVER SLED · October 27, 2020

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Edited October 27, 2020 by SILVER SLED

SILVER SLED · October 27, 2020

6 minutes ago, TNTSilverado said:

I didn't ever run my TBSS but from the seat of my pants and how well this 10 Spd shifts. I think my truck can take this. My best friend and son's good father has 2 stout race cars both pushing over 800+ at the crank and he also stated my new truck would beat my old SS. That 4 spd really hindered those vehicles. They needed a 6 spd back then to really keep the LS2 in its sweet spots.

That TBSS was one of my favorite vehicles. A real sleeper and stop light killer (awd). I had mine revving to 6900rpm in first to help make up for the big lag in the 1-2 gear split in that transmission. I don't think this truck or my 18 6.2 were as quick as my TBSS was, that would make this a 12 second truck.

TNTSierra · October 27, 2020

Just now, SILVER SLED said:

That TBSS was one of my favorite vehicles. A real sleeper and stop light killer (awd). I had mine revving to 6900rpm in first to help make up for the big lag in the 1-2 gear split in that transmission. I don't think this truck or my 18 6.2 were as quick as my TBSS was, that would make this a 12 second truck.

Yours sounded like it ran a lot better than mine. I know the 07-09 ran better than the 06's and they made improvements on them. You couldn't swap out for a 6 spd in a 2006, but 2007 and up you could do a swap. IDk if you can now or not, but back in 2010 you couldn't.

Yes, I miss mine as well. The AWD and lowered stance was aggressive, and able to haul 5 people and a boat to the lake was awesome for the time. I had a magna-flow catback on it and it was LOUD! I recently googled them on cars.com and they are going for hefty prices. I wanted to get a stock one for my son when he drives in 3 years, but OUCH, they are going for a nice price. Plus, with it being an SUV, I'd rather have him in that instead of a camaro.

SILVER SLED · October 27, 2020

8 minutes ago, TNTSilverado said:

Yours sounded like it ran a lot better than mine. I know the 07-09 ran better than the 06's and they made improvements on them. You couldn't swap out for a 6 spd in a 2006, but 2007 and up you could do a swap. IDk if you can now or not, but back in 2010 you couldn't.

Yes, I miss mine as well. The AWD and lowered stance was aggressive, and able to haul 5 people and a boat to the lake was awesome for the time. I had a magna-flow catback on it and it was LOUD! I recently googled them on cars.com and they are going for hefty prices. I wanted to get a stock one for my son when he drives in 3 years, but OUCH, they are going for a nice price. Plus, with it being an SUV, I'd rather have him in that instead of a camaro.

I have a son driving in three years and the Trailblazer in my signature will be the vehicle he drives.

Ed/2020RST · October 29, 2020

I have limited experience building V-8 4 stroke engines with big HP. I do however, have extensive experience with 2-stroke outboards for racing applications. Along with putting a "Tune" in the ECU, the main things we always did was to change reeds, cut & polish both the intake and exhaust sides, and opened up the front of the cowling to make them breath better. On your trucks you notice very little change due to ambient air temps but if you are an outboard boat owner you see a very noticable difference when the weather is hot or cold. That being said, a CAI as it's name implies does much more than reduce intake air temps. Getting rid of the stock airbox streamlines the airflow to the intake, the increased area of the filters and design increases air volume which is a must to increase HP. Increased intake volume is no good if the exhaust is restricted, so we add cat-back systems, headers etc.. These 2 mods alone help any motor "breath" better and only stands to reason that HP will increase. However, this increase is limited to what the computer tells the fuel system to do! The folks that build these systems know this fact and build them to stay within the parameters set by a stock computer which eliminates the requirement to add a "Tune" which will void your factory warranty. Some of the CAI folks will actually give and "Claim" what their product will do some will not, but I highly doubt that these systems would have such a high degree of popularity if they didn't work at least to some degree. Someone here mentioned back-pressure. A 2-stroke motor has a "Tuner" or header which is designed to increase back pressure which gives the motor low end torque. Due to EPA restrictions todays motors are required to have catalytic converters on all vehicles. Catalytic converters already create back-pressure (Restriction) as does the flapper valve and mufflers. Removing the flapper valve and doing a muffler swap relieves some of this restriction but the CCs still allow for some degree of back-pressure.

I know there is more involved when we talk about building HP in a 4 stroke motor such as fuel systems, cam duration, lift etc.. but they are all still related to a motors ability to "Breath" which is what a CAI and a cat-back systems is designed to help a motor do!

Grumpy Bear · October 30, 2020

When Superflo first put out their flow benches they came with a pretty good book on the benches ability to estimate hp from air flow. 1.63 SCFM /hp. At that time 323 cubic inches spinning 5600 rpm had a ceiling of about 320 crankshaft horsepower. So what changed between then and now? THERMAL EFFICIENCY. Thermal efficiency is up around 10% for the SBC. Thank you GDI and VVT very much. Which brings up two solid facts. A motors peak power is limited by it's CID & RPM and thermal efficiency.(normally asperated) Notice I didn't say cam or heads or TB or CAI... That is because they are restrictions to displacement and rpm and efficiency. TE for the Ecotec3 motors (all) is 35%. (I've posted documentation on that several times) Back in the day (1950-1960's) it ran 20 to 30% all motor. SBC was between 20-25% depending on the paticulars. OHC cam motors of the day perhaps 30% in race tune.

What that means is IF the displacement isn't changed and IF the peak RPM is the same the power that can be pulled from an Ecotec3 motor of this size is going to be about 370 hp at the the flywheel on 87 pump E-10. Maybe another 5 or 7 tuned with E-10 93 octane. That's tune, headers, CAI...you name it. That's allot of money for 20 hp

In my day a 327 that came in grandma's wagon made about 250 crankshaft power. There was allot of room left on the table with a carb, manifold and headers. ALLOT of room. About 50-75 hp. worth of room before a cam swap.

Pick a real dog like the Ford 300 6 and you could net 70 hp falling off a log for about $200 and a good ear.

Those days are done.

Your not buying a motor with 8:1 compression you can stuff 11.5:1 into. They already have them. Your not buying a motor with a flow restricted carburetor and a dual plane manifold and an ignition with 15% misses built it. Your buying GDI and coils that start forest fires. Your not buying 1-1/4 single exhaust with a muffler that would choke a Briggs & Stratton.

You want 1960's percentage gains from todays motors you need some serious power adders.

Sqrls · October 30, 2020

Larger or shorter is not always better for airflow ducting in engines. By increasing the diameter for instance, you increase the theoretical maximum CFM, but the pistons are creating the same amount of vacuum (suction), so the velocity and pressure of the air goes down, therefore the actual CFM does not change much. However, the air is less dense entering the cylinders. This is why many vehicles have such intricate and long intake rubber designs as the restrictions can help make more power.