GM Facing Class Action Lawsuit Over Lifters

BlaineBug · April 27, 2023

23 minutes ago, newdude said:

A full mechanical delete, sure that's more than just programming. GM could simply write a new ECM calibration that can be flashed at the dealer to disable AFM, just like someone can do with HP Tuners. It would at least be something that could be offered as we all know they won't fork out of pocket for a full mechanical delete. That would be reserved for those with a current down truck from AFM failure or if someone complained enough.

An electronic disable does significantly reduce the odds of future failure (not 100% eliminate failure rate but close to it).

I'm not really sure. I recall all of those folks being happy during the "chip shortage" where they were saying that the was no more AFM. I had to clarify that this information wasn't true. I am also not sure if electronically disabling the cylinder deactivation has any meaningful change in failure rate. I am not sure if there is any solid evidence that shows AFM or DFM failure only when in deactivation mode. I suppose failure would be possible at any time, personally.

BlaineBug · April 27, 2023

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Grumpy Bear · April 27, 2023

IMHO, the problem with lifter topics is that they try to fit all failures into a single causal mode. That's like saying that all tree branches break due to overweight pigeons sitting on them and getting rid of pigeons will stop all branches from breaking.

There are several TSB's out on this issue and many more without. Broken lifter lock pin spring. Low oil pressure. Low oil level. High oil level. Oil foaming. Wrong oil. Oil pump issue. Leaking VLOM. Faulty VLOM solenoid. Broken valve spring. Retainer or keeper failure. Failed pushrod. Bad heat-treat of cam, roller, lock pin or roller axle. Worn lifter bore. Rocker trunnion failure. Stud failure. Failed cam position sensor. ECU or ECU harness issue.

How many of these will a disabler address? How many will a DOD delete address? How many will better maintenance address? How many will low bid contracts cause? How bad will half measure repairs aggravate the situation? How many bases can you cover?

BlaineBug · April 27, 2023

1 minute ago, Grumpy Bear said:

IMHO, the problem with lifter topics is that they try to fit all failures into a single causal mode. That's like saying that all tree branches break due to overweight pigeons sitting on them and getting rid of pigeons will stop all branches from breaking.

There are several TSB's out on this issue and many more without. Broken lifter lock pin spring. Low oil pressure. Low oil level. High oil level. Oil foaming. Wrong oil. Oil pump issue. Leaking VLOM. Faulty VLOM solenoid. Broken valve spring. Retainer or keeper failure. Failed pushrod. Bad heat-treat of cam, roller, lock pin or roller axle. Worn lifter bore. Rocker trunnion failure. Stud failure. Failed cam position sensor. ECU or ECU harness issue.

How many of these will a disabler address? How many will a DOD delete address? How many will better maintenance address? How many will low bid contracts cause? How bad will half measure repairs aggravate the situation? How many bases can you cover?

When lifters are failing on brand new engines, maintenance has zero input.

newdude · April 27, 2023

2 hours ago, BlaineBug said:

I'm not really sure. I recall all of those folks being happy during the "chip shortage" where they were saying that the was no more AFM. I had to clarify that this information wasn't true. I am also not sure if electronically disabling the cylinder deactivation has any meaningful change in failure rate. I am not sure if there is any solid evidence that shows AFM or DFM failure only when in deactivation mode. I suppose failure would be possible at any time, personally.

We've sold a good amount of 5.3 with DFM missing from the chip shortage. None have come with lifter failure so far. M 2019 LD I had disabled via HP Tuners from day one and went almost 50k mi with zero lifter failure before I traded for my 2.7 HO.

Edited April 27, 2023 by newdude

Grumpy Bear · April 27, 2023

5 minutes ago, BlaineBug said:

When lifters are failing on brand new engines, maintenance has zero input.

Wrong oil, low oil, high oil, oil foaming are all maintenance inputs Blain that can happen on the initial prep. Besides, picking one of more than a dozen causes?

KARNUT · April 27, 2023

1 hour ago, Grumpy Bear said:

IMHO, the problem with lifter topics is that they try to fit all failures into a single causal mode. That's like saying that all tree branches break due to overweight pigeons sitting on them and getting rid of pigeons will stop all branches from breaking.

There are several TSB's out on this issue and many more without. Broken lifter lock pin spring. Low oil pressure. Low oil level. High oil level. Oil foaming. Wrong oil. Oil pump issue. Leaking VLOM. Faulty VLOM solenoid. Broken valve spring. Retainer or keeper failure. Failed pushrod. Bad heat-treat of cam, roller, lock pin or roller axle. Worn lifter bore. Rocker trunnion failure. Stud failure. Failed cam position sensor. ECU or ECU harness issue.

How many of these will a disabler address? How many will a DOD delete address? How many will better maintenance address? How many will low bid contracts cause? How bad will half measure repairs aggravate the situation? How many bases can you cover?

I had several small block Chevy engines in the 70s most were noisy some had cam wear problems. Some got diesel oil during oil changes because it was there. Every one got the snot kicked out of them. Non failed. I just got rid of recently a 92 modified Chevy engine powered truck. It was stroked, blown with 12 lbs of boost, MSD ignition. It used one qt of oil every 500 miles for the 12 years I had it. Where am I going with this? I don’t mind doing a little more preventive maintenance to reach a mileage goal. It seems some vehicles need extensive maintenance just to reach normal mileage goals. Those I’ll avoid.

Edited April 27, 2023 by KARNUT