2.7L Turbomax teardown

[GETGONE]

Youtube Channel I Do Cars finally got a 2.7L Turbomax engine to tear down with 146K miles on it.

 

 

[Grumpy Bear]

Yep, I'll run right out and get me one. 

Edited September 21, 2025 by Grumpy Bear

[Grumpy Bear]

 

DEXOS

 

Oil that was thermally oxidative resistive enough to keep the timing cover and valve area clean....

 

 

Failed to do so in the hottest area of the motor!

 

 

This didn't happen in the last ten minutes of it's life.

[PunchT37]

Seems like the 5.3 ain`t so bad after all.

[Grumpy Bear]

Pass ASTM “D7320 Sequence IIIG Engine Oil Test”  on the left. Fail on the right.

So what would you call the screen shot above?

 

   

 

Some oils prevent, Some oils restore. Most oils do neither.

 

Edited September 22, 2025 by Grumpy Bear

[newdude]

Looking at the rocker, it was drove too long with a ticking noise and experienced this TSB - MC-11019748-0001.pdf

[Grumpy Bear]

146K miles to destruction. So a few questions.

 

1.) How many of those miles was that rocker "ticking"? (had to be awhile as the axle was half gone).

2.) At that number of miles is this still a "defective part" that slipped through manufacturing/assembly final QC?

3.) Are the prematurely wiped out bores, baked rings, worn on rocker axle etc. due to an oil that was doing its job? 

 

While you ponder this remind yourself that the oil was changed often enough to prevent ALL rocker and timing cover deposits so it wasn't getting extended changes. It wasn't even getting 7.5K changes and stay that clean.  

[asilverblazer]

2 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

While you ponder this remind yourself that the oil was changed often enough to prevent ALL rocker and timing cover deposits so it wasn't getting extended changes. It wasn't even getting 7.5K changes and stay that clean.  

Are you saying the change interval was MORE frequent than 7.5K miles?

 

Your posts imply poor quality oil, which I am not denying, what oil would have prevented this?

[Grumpy Bear]

1 hour ago, asilverblazer said:

Are you saying the change interval was MORE frequent than 7.5K miles?

 

Your posts imply poor quality oil, which I am not denying, what oil would have prevented this?

 

How many motors have you seen with 7.5K OCI's with a timing chest that clean using any oil one can source at Walmart? 

 

 

I'm not implying it. I saying it straight away. Or at least the oil recommended isn't up to the job. 

 

The race is on to the bottom of the barrel. Less viscosity. Less anti-wear. How far do you think that can go before failure is certain? You will find the answer in the history of Gibbs Racing and their oils. This isn't new. It's been rinse and repeat for about a hundred years. GM has a history with advancing a chemistry that is destructive BEFORE the/a mechanical solution is affirmed. DEXRON without whale oil ring a bell? Chrysler ditto. Late 50's darn near ended them. We are past the stage where the focus is on IMPROVEMENT. We are in the profit and surrendered stage. Find yourself a oil that hasn't surrendered it's chemistry. You can even find a few at Walmart if you look hard enough. 

 

Sometimes that answer isn't in the oil but in the oil that is specified. Protect the machine, not the warranty. Not the legacy. Not loyalty. 

 

 

Edited September 23, 2025 by Grumpy Bear

[OnTheReel]

10 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

146K miles to destruction. So a few questions.

 

1.) How many of those miles was that rocker "ticking"? (had to be awhile as the axle was half gone).

 

The buying public is basically conditioned to ignore ticking sounds. Probably even sounds as loud as this one must have been. Between the noisy GDI injectors, widespread exhaust manifold leaks, and the usual lifter tick many OEMs have been known for, I’m not surprised if this owner was caught unaware. They’ve done such a great job eliminating cabin NVH on these trucks that something has to literally blow up to get a non-enthusiast’s attention.

[Grumpy Bear]

I've been sick for about two weeks now so catching up on my reading. Boy am I depressed. The amount of conflicting information is hideous. If you don't want the public to know what the what what is, then put tons of crap on the floor until even the experts can't tell where the floor is. That is were we are. 

 

So what can I lean on? The things that don't and can not change. Up is still up. 3.2.32 fps is still the acceleration of gravity. Earth revolves around the sun and base oils are Newtonian. At least to a degree than matters. Like solves like. And greed is everywhere. 

[Grumpy Bear]

 

[asilverblazer]

18 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Find yourself a oil that hasn't surrendered it's chemistry. You can even find a few at Walmart if you look hard enough. 

 

Sometimes that answer isn't in the oil but in the oil that is specified.

What oil hasn't surrendered its chemistry? 

What brand, label, specification, viscosity, color, flavor, price?

What is the average consumer (not a chemist) supposed to look for? 

 

BECAUSE: Without an explicit recommendation from a QUALIFIED person (which I am granting to you), all the average consumer do is rely on their own past experience, marketing, brand recognition, price to select something that meets the manufacturers requirements that we both know may or may not be in the owners/vehicles best interest.

[Grumpy Bear]

3 hours ago, asilverblazer said:

What oil hasn't surrendered its chemistry? 

What brand, label, specification, viscosity, color, flavor, price?

What is the average consumer (not a chemist) supposed to look for? 

 

BECAUSE: Without an explicit recommendation from a QUALIFIED person (which I am granting to you), all the average consumer do is rely on their own past experience, marketing, brand recognition, price to select something that meets the manufacturers requirements that we both know may or may not be in the owners/vehicles best interest.

 

Oh boy  !

 

1.) You may have noticed in the video the first thing he says is?, " Viscosity is the MOST IMPORTANT specification...." Then he goes on to show how the published numbers are good for a New York second. Good enough to get it in a bottle and little more. And there is where the fun begins. NOBODY, okay a few, will tell you what polymer VII they are using. (Torco does on a few products as well as HPL Lubricants). Which means that you have to assume the worst and what that looks like will depend on the distance between the first number and the second, in most cases. I.E. a 0W30 will have more polymer of a higher molecular weight than a 10W30. A 10W60 has a bucket load. Now we get a small clue in the video that 'most' Walmart oils use an OCP polymer including Mobil 1. 

 

None of this answers the question, how much is enough. Get in the "Way back machine" to the GM wear studies and you will find 3.7 cP HTHS the guide post. That study was done with a mineral Group II SAE 40 and as such is Newtonian and for the most part shear proof. Darn few oils today will pass muster against that benchmark. That is Zero SAE 20's, less than a handful of SAE 30's and only a few more SAE 0 to 10W40's. The few that do will carry the ACEA C3, C4 or A3/B4 specification listed on the back label. Those specifications assure an in the bottle minimum of 3.5 cP.  Dexos 2 is also a 3.5 cP minimum as are some other OEM specs such as Porsche C30/C40/A40. 

 

The catch. Mobil 1 Euro 0W40 carries the C3 spec. It also uses OCP polymers and Lake addresses than head on. It's closer to 3.0 cP or almost the minimum for an SAE 30 (2.9 cP is that minimum). How is that helpful?

 

Expect a minimum of 1 grade reduction in viscosity in a few hundred miles. So VIS UP. Take note of his comments about his Boxster oil requirements and how he manipulates that number with known values. Don't be mislead. Mobil 1 0W40 just makes a 30 weight by a hairs breadth after a few hours.

 

Death note. Engines produced with "Spray Bores" will not tolerate heavier oils.  

 

2.) This one is a bit easier. Phosphorus, Sulphur and Calcium/Magnesium. ANTIWEAR. My rule on this is if the motor uses no observable oil over a reasonable OCI then use full SAPS. If it uses some, use Mid SAPS. C3 oils are by and large mid SAPS. If it uses allot, your screwed. And use an oil with LSPI chemistry. That is less calcium and more magnesium. SAE SN+/SP oils are LSPI friendly. In fact most Euro oils are MID SAPS that don't display the FS label and are LSPI friendly. 

 

3.) Polarity aka Solvency. Are there shelf oils with some solvency? Yes but hard to deduce which ones as some use alkylated naphthalene, which doesn't show up in oxidation tests and a few use Os-PAG or Diesters to give is a solvency boost. Problem is not enough to be useful for anything but seal swell issues. So you've found an oil with enough viscosity and antiwear but not sure about solvency. What to do.. What you do is change is often or you will end up with a motor like the one in the OP's video. Clean on top, garbage in the rings. 2-3K OCI's. 

 

This will take me to my first pick for semi-shelf oil. CHEVORN HAVOLINE Pro-RS 5W30, (Havoline, a former Texaco product name). This oil is 25% minimum NOVI biobased natural Ester and runs about as clean as an oil can run. It is Mid SAPS and is reported to have a 3.5 cP HTHS so at least a 30W under stress. With some lab work this is likely a 5K oil. 

 

Another shelf pick a slot down is Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W30. 3.3 cP so not on the top of the list but a very clean running oil with allot of promise. Proprietary chemistry used in substituted of polar bases. A good 0W20 substitute. 3,750 to 5,000 with labs. 

 

Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 is a C3/C30 compliant oil which is a good 0W20 substitute. In fact Mobil recommends it for all ACEA C2 applications. Fair endorsement. 

 

You wanted  lighter shelf picks....there they are in order. Order on line more likely.  

 

Castrol Euro Spec 5W40 and Mobil 1 Euro 5W40 FS is what I use as shelf oil for 5W30 applications. I shy away from the 0W40's. 

 

Non-Shelf oils; 

 

My personal Go To is Red Line HP Euro 5W40 and I use this by the case in most everything that calls for 0W20 to 5W40. I have is proofed out to 3,750 miles with the first 5K test currently underway. This oil uses a 0-5 SSI polymer and darn little of it. Has a robust 4.4 cP HTHS and a good dose of Ester blended into a PAO base. Solidly over 3.7 cP HTHS. This can be an affordable oil with some relationship building and proper OCI selection based on labs. 

 

AMSOIL Euro 5W40's, there are two. Mid and Full SAPS versions seem to rely on AN's as the polar component but as they are not as transparent as they once were it is a bit of a guess. AMOILS hugs the lower end of the viscosity HTHS brackets but uses solid polymers. I can not find a SS series SAE40 and the *W30 versions, again, huge the basement on HTHS bending to MPG over wear considerations. But they are very clean robust oils that are affordable with a subscription. 

 

TORCO SR-5 5W30. Very close to Red Line HP 5W30 in chemistry. They are more guarded and cost a bit more but have a substantial Anti-wear package. 

 

High Performance Lubricants or HPL has multiple offerings and are not shy about supplying PDS sheets or answering inquiries. Even have a No-VII Group III/IV/AN selection if absolute is a requirement of knowing. 

 

Honestly I have no idea if any of these oils, no matter how robust, will keep the 2.7 alive but I can say some will keep the rings in good enough shape to give is a fighting chance. 

 

Every oil I've mentioned is not DEXOS compliant. They are not less than. They are so much more than. Decisions is up to you if you will protect a warranty or an engine. 

 

An interesting oil not on my list is Renewable Lubricants BioSyn-Xtra 5W40. A very clean running oil whose formulators are short on specifics and why not on my list.  Normally this isn't an issue for me but as they are not forthcoming and don't have a API seal then I also have nothing but their word to work with. I could buy a bottle and have it tested but than isn't my cuppa tea at this age. Used to be.  That and priced above many PAO/POE based oils. It is slicker than deer guts 

 

 

 

 

[asilverblazer]

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

1.) You may have noticed in the video the first thing he says is?, " Viscosity is the MOST IMPORTANT specification...." Then he goes on to show how the published numbers are good for a New York second. Good enough to get it in a bottle and little more. And there is where the fun begins. NOBODY, okay a few, will tell you what polymer VII they are using. Which means that you have to assume the worst and what that looks like will depend on the distance between the first number and the second, in most cases. I.E. a 0W30 will have more polymer of a higher molecular weight than a 10W30. A 10W60 has a bucket load. Now we get a small clue in the video that 'most' Walmart oils use an OCP polymer including Mobil 1. 

This paragraph coupled with my comments to the next one below is a struggle for me to follow, it seems we are chasing several different attributes to get to a selection or criteria. We start above looking at "viscosity" then "polymer VII" then the difference "between the first and second numbers" in the weights; 10W30 is low (20) compared to 10W60 (50) high. Is this differential number a clue to the higher weight polymer molecule? Which is presumably better.

 

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

None of this answers the question, how much is enough. Get in the "Way back machine" to the GM wear studies and you will find 3.7 cP HTHS the guide post. That study was done with a mineral Group II SAE 40 and as such is Newtonian and for the most part shear proof. Darn few oils today will pass muster against that benchmark. That is Zero SAE 20's, less than a handful of SAE 30's and only a few more SAE 0 to 10W40's. The few that do will carry the ACEA C3, C4 or A3/B4 specification listed on the back label. Those specifications assure an in the bottle minimum of 3.5 cP.  Dexos 2 is also a 3.5 cP minimum as are some other OEM specs such as Porsche C30/C40/A40. 

How much of "what" is enough? The weight of the polymer molecule above (polymer VII)?

 

Then you start talking about something else the cP HTHS. Probably too deep for a me to understand... BUT if a common consumer ignored everything up to this point and landed at "ACEA C3, C4 or A3/B4" as suitable must have on the label. 

 

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Expect a minimum of 1 grade reduction in viscosity in a few hundred miles.

OK

 

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

2.) This one is a bit easier. Phosphorus, Sulphur and Calcium/Magnesium. ANTIWEAR. My rule on this is if the motor uses no observable oil over a reasonable OCI then use full SAPS. If it uses some, use Mid SAPS. C3 oils are by and large mid SAPS. If it uses allot, your screwed. And use an oil with LSPI chemistry. That is less calcium and more magnesium. SAE SN+/SP oils are LSPI friendly. In fact most Euro oils are MID SAPS that don't display the FS label and are LSPI friendly. 

I understand the three conditions posted, no oil use, some oil use, a lot... Corresponding to full SAPS, mid SAPS, LSPI. C3 oils, are mid SAPS. SAE SN+/SP and Euro oils are both mid SAPS and LSPI acceptable.

 

What would a full SAPS oil be labeled, categorized, classified as?

 

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

1. CHEVORN HAVOLINE Pro-RS 5W30

2. Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W30.

3. Mobil 1 ESP 5W30

 

You wanted lighter shelf picks...

What do you mean by "lighter"? I am assuming a replacement for 20W based on the next comment. In any case, I didn't intend to make this distinction.

 

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Castrol Euro Spec 5W40 and Mobil 1 Euro 5W40 FS is what I use as shelf oil for 5W30 applications. I shy away from the 0W40's. 

 

22 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

My personal Go To is Red Line HP Euro 5W40 and I use this by the case in most everything that calls for 0W20 to 5W40. I have is proofed out to 3,750 miles with the first 5K test currently underway. This oil uses a 0-5 SSI polymer and darn little of it. Has a robust 4.4 cP HTHS and a good dose of Ester blended into a PAO base. Solidly over 3.7 cP HTHS. This can be an affordable oil with some relationship building and proper OCI selection based on labs. 

Thanks for the in-depth response and information in a more easily understood manner!