new truck 1st OIL CHANGE 500 miles or less

[GETGONE]

I knew of the tighter clearances of a new engine, hence the break in period and that material has to go somewhere as it breaks in. Also heat is the enemy of oil and causes it to break down faster. I would expect higher heat to happen in the initial break in period which will degrade the oil. Most modern oil this isn't much of an issue anymore, but still another reason for a shorter first oil change.

Is GM using synthetic in all new vehicles? I know there was great debate on this surrounding the LS motors and particular the 2001-2002 Camaro/Firebird LS motors. I don't think I ever saw a definitive answer.

[diyer2]

 It still comes down to did  you get a good motor or a bad one.

[KARNUT]

8 hours ago, GETGONE said:

I knew of the tighter clearances of a new engine, hence the break in period and that material has to go somewhere as it breaks in. Also heat is the enemy of oil and causes it to break down faster. I would expect higher heat to happen in the initial break in period which will degrade the oil. Most modern oil this isn't much of an issue anymore, but still another reason for a shorter first oil change.

Is GM using synthetic in all new vehicles? I know there was great debate on this surrounding the LS motors and particular the 2001-2002 Camaro/Firebird LS motors. I don't think I ever saw a definitive answer.

My 06 trailblazer ss had mobile one factory fill. And I watch mobile one go in at dealer oil changes. My 02 Avalanche gets synthetic at dealer oil changes when they do it. As stated on the recipe.

[Grumpy Bear]

9 hours ago, GETGONE said:

I knew of the tighter clearances of a new engine, hence the break in period and that material has to go somewhere as it breaks in. Also heat is the enemy of oil and causes it to break down faster. I would expect higher heat to happen in the initial break in period which will degrade the oil. Most modern oil this isn't much of an issue anymore, but still another reason for a shorter first oil change.

Is GM using synthetic in all new vehicles? I know there was great debate on this surrounding the LS motors and particular the 2001-2002 Camaro/Firebird LS motors. I don't think I ever saw a definitive answer.

 

Here is a for instance. Manufacture A chooses a piston made of a hypereutectic alloy while manufacture B chooses a forged 2618 alloy. 

 

The 2618 piston will be fit cold (for a 4" bore in a water-cooled motor) to roughly .004" 

The hypereutectic alloy will be fit cold somewhere close to .001". 

Both of these will have THE SAME hot running fully worn in clearance of .001-.0015"

 

During running it, break-in or fretting up, whatever you choose to call it rougher surfaces than those obtained AFTER break-in add sensible heat. Sensible heat is what expands materials. Doesn't take much to nip up .001". 

 

This video will explain not just cost but give you an idea how much the OEM compromise on road car design to 'stupid proof' your baby. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[diyer2]

Same answer, roll of the dice. Will it burn oil, have a bad bearing, throw a rod, have a failed lifter? 

[Grumpy Bear]

21 hours ago, GETGONE said:

I would expect higher heat to happen in the initial break in period which will degrade the oil. Most modern oil this isn't much of an issue anymore, but still another reason for a shorter first oil change.

 

It can. Once upon a time in a land far far away was a Grumpy old man who built Brit singles. In that day Castrol Castor Bean oils were a 'rage'. I'd give instructions on break-in and those instructions would be ignored. Sometimes in as little as five miles that motor comes back with the oil burned into cinder. Split the cases, chisel it out, cooked goose, OMG are you kidding me clapped out oil.

 

Listen up. "Todays" oils STILL thermally oxidize. An apple left on the counter turns brown. Thermal oxidation. Same thing happens to motor oil. Difference is the "initiation temperature". Group 1 oils start this process at about 160 F and each 20 F doubles the rate of oxidation. Group III and IV just move that temperature up the scale about 20 to 40 F and once started the 20F per double still stands. Chemistry doesn't listen to marketing HYPE. When you hear Mobil say Mobil 1 will take 500 F; kids that is time based. Mom would tap her licked moistened fingers on a hot iron to see if it was hot enough for the task without burning herself BUT if she leaves them on the iron...3rd degree burns will happen. Mobil 1 at 500 F is not long for this world.

 

Liars lie and marketing lies with conviction and from the heart. Are there oils that will go 500 F? Yep. NPG esters BUT no one is using them as a stand-alone lubricant but jet turbines.

 

If your bulk oil temperature is 210 F rod and main oil temps will be roughly 285 F and ring to cylinder interface oil temps hovering 300 F. Well beyond any commercial motor oils oxidation temperature. Kind of why HTHS viscosity is such a big deal.  

 

Every time the oil industry increases the oils heat tolerance by 20 F the OEMs find a way to increase bulk temps 25F. This isn't getting better....

 

10 hours ago, diyer2 said:

Same answer, roll of the dice. Will it burn oil, have a bad bearing, throw a rod, have a failed lifter? 

 

Repeat this 50 more times and it will still have nothing to do with the topic at hand. And yes, you are not wrong. Just has nothing to do with the need for an early change.  

Edited November 2, 2022 by Grumpy Bear

[Dunn]

never had an issue.......ive done both and also been careless and not changed oil for incredible lengths of time on engines that had nearly 300k miles......sometimes i think we as humans just like to trip out on stuff however insignificant it might be.....i have been guilty plenty and have not givin a crap at same time......do whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy........i will say the 10 spd tranny is so much better to drive than the 8spd.......I also blasted home to LA from phoenix in my new truck right off the lot doing 90mph at 1 a.m. the other night, i would actually vote its better than babying it.........i wont debate it or have any proof that it is.......i just have other stuff to trip on and worry about these days, lol

[KARNUT]

3 hours ago, Dunn said:

never had an issue.......ive done both and also been careless and not changed oil for incredible lengths of time on engines that had nearly 300k miles......sometimes i think we as humans just like to trip out on stuff however insignificant it might be.....i have been guilty plenty and have not givin a crap at same time......do whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy........i will say the 10 spd tranny is so much better to drive than the 8spd.......I also blasted home to LA from phoenix in my new truck right off the lot doing 90mph at 1 a.m. the other night, i would actually vote its better than babying it.........i wont debate it or have any proof that it is.......i just have other stuff to trip on and worry about these days, lol

I’ve been going to the same two dealerships for 30 years with little exceptions. More than a dozen vehicles cars and trucks. I’ve had friends and an ex son-in-law work there. I’ve used one shop for 40 years. I’ve run and sold specialty clearing equipment all my life. Been OEM for several major manufacturers. My company holds patients for specialty equipment. Sold oil including Amsoil for 40 years. No one ever mentioned earlier oil changes for anything. Saying all that I’m convinced that the cylinder deactivation engine needs special care to operate properly. And to last any reasonable length of time. And to a lesser extreme DI engines. There’s a lot more going on internally. 

[Grumpy Bear]

Forums are great places to find HELP.

At least they use to be.

 

Now, just a place for pigeons to crap on everything 

[customboss]

5 hours ago, Dunn said:

never had an issue.......ive done both and also been careless and not changed oil for incredible lengths of time on engines that had nearly 300k miles......sometimes i think we as humans just like to trip out on stuff however insignificant it might be.....i have been guilty plenty and have not givin a crap at same time......do whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy........i will say the 10 spd tranny is so much better to drive than the 8spd.......I also blasted home to LA from phoenix in my new truck right off the lot doing 90mph at 1 a.m. the other night, i would actually vote its better than babying it.........i wont debate it or have any proof that it is.......i just have other stuff to trip on and worry about these days, lol

ur " lucky" Brah. 

[KARNUT]

Funny when the easily insulated come out the read will little comprehension. Then assume they are being insulted or disagreed with. Amusing really.

[Grumpy Bear]

[customboss]

18 minutes ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Forums are great places to find HELP.

At least they use to be.

 

Now, just a place for pigeons to crap on everything 

There are folks who care, there are folks who don't and most consumers are use/run/drive to breakage and fix or replace. They don't care.  Its the folks who can't do science at all that think they can that irritate me.  Raised on a midwest farm my Pop was the run to break, my Grandad from Louisiana was a master machinist and he took the utmost care and didn't buy and waste as much $$  as my farmer Pop did.  

[Dunn]

4 hours ago, KARNUT said:

I’ve been going to the same two dealerships for 30 years with little exceptions. More than a dozen vehicles cars and trucks. I’ve had friends and an ex son-in-law work there. I’ve used one shop for 40 years. I’ve run and sold specialty clearing equipment all my life. Been OEM for several major manufacturers. My company holds patients for specialty equipment. Sold oil including Amsoil for 40 years. No one ever mentioned earlier oil changes for anything. Saying all that I’m convinced that the cylinder deactivation engine needs special care to operate properly. And to last any reasonable length of time. And to a lesser extreme DI engines. There’s a lot more going on internally. 

 

they are fine right out of the plant....you can actually go longer now, remember it was every 3k miles for oil changes when all the jiffy lubes first popped up, lol

2 hours ago, customboss said:

ur " lucky" Brah. 

its called "common sense" .......and its a fading trait in the world today

[JimCost2014]

Then assume they are being insulted or disagreed with.

 

The site in one sentence.