Why does anyone still make a 3/4 ton when you can get a 1 ton SRW with a gas motor?

[Chuck FB]

1 hour ago, newdude said:

 

 

 

6.2 and 3.0 Duramax in a High Country come with the 2 speed case no matter what, and can both be combined with NHT max trailer.  This is achievable right in the build and price on chevy.com.  

 

Was just looking to add some facts/details to this for others reading who may be thinking of NHT vs HD if they'd rather steer towards the NHT setup and don't need the HD capability.  

 

As for the "vehicle surviving wildlife", once you've spent time at a body shop you realize it doesn't really matter.  They are all designed to crumple.  

 

You got me curious about that now, perhaps in part it was because I was trying to add Z71 to max tow and it would not do it, and while some lower trims will list on its own the option of "two speed transfer case" alone as a choice, that was a no go as well other than the 6.2 as I believe it can be matched up within the LTZ trim with that engine and two speed and max tow, as well as its High Country trim. Also I was looking on the Canadian site, not sure if there would be option differences between the two countries. 

 

I might have said this elsewhere on here but a neighbour had bought a used 2022.5 model year refresh with the 3.0 but its a GM elevation and his criteria for finding a used truck was to have crew cab with a front bench seat and the 3.0 engine, and to be sure to have the max tow with the 3.73. What he found had the short box and he ended up buying it even though he wanted the 6.5 box. What he had not realized through his want list is that he assumed it would have a two speed transfer case and only when he had it at home and was going through things he went to "try out" 4 low and realized it wasn't there. I already knew what he was leading up to before he said it, I personally feel GM has missed out on sales because of them going this route but that's just from my own view point, their bottom line may say different. 

 

My wording wasn't specific enough about the animal collision theme as I am sure your very correct on the fact that the vehicle is a mess and a very expensive mess to repair regardless of size. What I was eluding to is the passengers survival and be that not injured or much less so vs wishing one was dead in the aftermath or actually dead. There are so many animal accidents around here and its a sparsely populated area in the scheme of things and yet some winters there will be one animal after another plowed up by the snow plow on the edge of the ditch along the local rural highway. I've been fortunate in that I've only hit one deer with a pickup so far and was a small deer and caused relatively minimal damage in the scheme of things, but I've also hit two deer with tractor trailers and both trucks had moose bumpers on them but still managed to bend the bumper of one of the trucks and insurance doesn't like to pay out for that, or passenger vehicles for that matter due to the number of claims they would get. 

Edited July 29, 2025 by Chuck FB

[Crazy Canuck]

On 7/28/2025 at 10:43 AM, newdude said:

 

 

2020-current HD does have some frame differences in the rear half.  Extra crossmember or two that the 2500 does not get UNLESS you order a 2500HD with the NHT max trailer which gets you the 3500HD frame and 12" axle.  

Mine has that and I frankly wonder why it says 2500 in the side instead of 3500 unless there are other differences I don't know about.  The spring pack is definitely more stout.  My first 24 was a real 2500.  I don't notice any real difference in ride, the road here are so terrible the ride in a civic is fairly brutal.

[Chuck FB]

15 minutes ago, Crazy Canuck said:

Mine has that and I frankly wonder why it says 2500 in the side instead of 3500 unless there are other differences I don't know about.  The spring pack is definitely more stout.  My first 24 was a real 2500.  I don't notice any real difference in ride, the road here are so terrible the ride in a civic is fairly brutal.

Which province are you in or purchased the truck in as I am surprised such a unit even made it into dealership inventory assuming it was a dealership order vs a special order someone backed out on. I won't pretend to know the various licensing issues that some provinces may have over others but I am in Alberta and the 1 ton single wheel typically way outnumbers the 3/4 ton on lots and tends to be so lower end trim work trucks that are spec'd as a 3/4 to get the cost as low as they can. Licensing would actually cost more here if its licensed as commercial and going across into other provinces the higher the GVW I believe but if driven personally it makes no difference. Just seems some of these GVW levels have more to do with some of the states that automatically throw a 1 ton into a category if used commercially that the driver has to hold a commercial drivers license, yet some states have a lower fee for a 1 ton plate over a 3/4 ton which makes no sense either. 

 

The only thing I have picked up on so far looking at a 3/4 vs 1 ton single wheel spring pack aside from the obvious upper overload pack, is that the bottom leaf which is an overload in a sense is longer on the 3/4 vs the 1 ton. If your ever at the dealership and looking at trucks and it does help to compare with the same tire size as a visual point of reference or you can use a tape measure, you can see if your bottom tapered spring has the same length spring forward and rearward of the axle vs other 3500's. I never noticed that until I had bought my truck and was comparing the packs of a 3/4 that sat near mine, that it really was different. Also the bottom leaf is not centered from front to back, more spring sticks to the rear of the truck although the 3/4 has a similar theme but longer in both directions. 

 

I never have heard any concrete info on torque management, I have heard said that the 3/4 had it or more of it in low gears vs the 1 ton and if so I would only be guessing to say they would logically tune yours as a 1 ton since its got the heavy rear diff. 

[Z45]

Lots of fleets buy on spec and the lowest cost, and often $1 decides the winning bid.  

[Crazy Canuck]

On 8/7/2025 at 9:46 PM, Chuck FB said:

Which province are you in or purchased the truck in as I am surprised such a unit even made it into dealership inventory assuming it was a dealership order vs a special order someone backed out on. I won't pretend to know the various licensing issues that some provinces may have over others but I am in Alberta and the 1 ton single wheel typically way outnumbers the 3/4 ton on lots and tends to be so lower end trim work trucks that are spec'd as a 3/4 to get the cost as low as they can. Licensing would actually cost more here if its licensed as commercial and going across into other provinces the higher the GVW I believe but if driven personally it makes no difference. Just seems some of these GVW levels have more to do with some of the states that automatically throw a 1 ton into a category if used commercially that the driver has to hold a commercial drivers license, yet some states have a lower fee for a 1 ton plate over a 3/4 ton which makes no sense either. 

 

The only thing I have picked up on so far looking at a 3/4 vs 1 ton single wheel spring pack aside from the obvious upper overload pack, is that the bottom leaf which is an overload in a sense is longer on the 3/4 vs the 1 ton. If your ever at the dealership and looking at trucks and it does help to compare with the same tire size as a visual point of reference or you can use a tape measure, you can see if your bottom tapered spring has the same length spring forward and rearward of the axle vs other 3500's. I never noticed that until I had bought my truck and was comparing the packs of a 3/4 that sat near mine, that it really was different. Also the bottom leaf is not centered from front to back, more spring sticks to the rear of the truck although the 3/4 has a similar theme but longer in both directions. 

 

I never have heard any concrete info on torque management, I have heard said that the 3/4 had it or more of it in low gears vs the 1 ton and if so I would only be guessing to say they would logically tune yours as a 1 ton since its got the heavy rear diff. 

 I am in Ontario.  This truck was definitely a dealer order for inventory.  I did take pictures of the rear spring pack of the old truck right before I traded it in so I could compare the difference myself as I wanted to know.  They both appear to be a pack of four with an overload spring on the bottom.  The additional 2 on top seems to be the major difference outside of what could be thickness, spring rate etc. that I have no idea about.  The length and where the spring is wrapped at the rear anyways could be different as well.  Both trucks are 2024 2500 Denali Ultimate.  The 3/4 ton trucks seem to be a lot more prevalent here in Ontario than their 1 ton cousins.

[Chuck FB]

I too did not try to note if there were any differences in length of the main spring pack springs as per the three springs under the spring with the eye bushings, but what I did see and your photos also show this is that the bottom tapered overload spring is different in length as in shorter on your new truck. I realize your photos are not taken at the same angle on each shot but I would say from looking at my spring pack ( and again mine being on the gas one ton ) that my spring pack lower overload tapered spring looks to be the same length as your new max tow truck and my upper overloads are also two leafs. It would not be that surprising if they use the same spring pack for the gas and diesel versions in the 3/4 ton, as well as the different spring pack with the upper overload style for the 1 ton version of gas or diesel since the back of the trucks weigh very similar. The front axle is where the extra weight of the diesel sits and why the standard torsion bar diameter is larger and rated higher on the diesel ( unless one gets the gas truck with the snow plow prep ). 

 

The max tow package does cost somewhat less than buying a 1 ton rated truck, it doesn't give quite as high a weight rating but if that doesn't matter then its a mute point, and not sure about Ontario licensing and if that lowers your rate over a 1 ton. 

 

I suspect the reason why the dealers up here tend to bring in more 1 tons and especially if its a crew cab, is customer demand and part of that would be oil field and forestry, and farmers as well just buying it to get more payload since the price spread isn't that much and as I pointed out before the insurance rate tends to be a bit lower. 

[Crazy Canuck]

Makes sense to me on the 1 tons out there.  I am pretty sure here it's by weight but I'm not 100%

[Rick_]

On 7/28/2025 at 8:43 AM, newdude said:

 

 

GVWR, GVWR and GVWR.  You can order a 2500HD de-rated to 10,000 GVWR for DOT purposes.  Can't order a de-rated 3500HD.  

 

 

A company I worked for used to order these, upfit to rear duals and avoid having to stop at weigh stations just for having a two place sled trailer in tow with a couple passengers.  Their 1 tons were for the 8 place featherlight gooseneck sneaking in at just under 26,000.

MN has a license tab fee break for 1 tons so that might be a consideration.

My 3/4 ton diesels rode and handled way better than my 1 ton.  

The Max trailering package on a 1/2 ton 3.0L is not quite enough spring to handle a tongue weight of 700some lbs and the 3.73 went away for 2023 and newer in favor of a numerically lower (3.42?) ratio.  I like the 3.73s in my 2022 and air springs are easier to add than air bags in coil spring rears...

[Chuck FB]

1 hour ago, Rick_ said:

A company I worked for used to order these, upfit to rear duals and avoid having to stop at weigh stations just for having a two place sled trailer in tow with a couple passengers.  Their 1 tons were for the 8 place featherlight gooseneck sneaking in at just under 26,000.

MN has a license tab fee break for 1 tons so that might be a consideration.

My 3/4 ton diesels rode and handled way better than my 1 ton.  

The Max trailering package on a 1/2 ton 3.0L is not quite enough spring to handle a tongue weight of 700some lbs and the 3.73 went away for 2023 and newer in favor of a numerically lower (3.42?) ratio.  I like the 3.73s in my 2022 and air springs are easier to add than air bags in coil spring rears...

I am curious as to what 3/4 ton to 1 ton you were comparing the ride of. I would imagine over the years there may have been main leaf pack differences between the two models and part of that may have depended on what GVW they gave the 3/4 truck and made a lighter pack for it. Currently there doesn't appear to be much difference with a GM 3/4 vs 1 ton, they shorten the lower overload a bit and then add two thin leaves to the upper overload which don't come into play until a lot of weight is on the truck to get those upper overloads to touch the frame pads. Also it would depend on which front torsion bars were optioned, and even what tire size and type, and pressure was being carried. Now a Ram for example is a very different beast going from the 3/4 to 1 ton as its a soft coil spring vs the beefed up leaf spring in the 1 ton and that gets talked a lot about as per the very different ride between those two trucks.

 

I took a look now to confirm if the 3.0 diesel can be had with the 3.73 axle that comes with the max tow package and that is definitely the case, however and has been all along that the gas engines jump up from the 3.23 to the 3.42 ratio when they are equipped with max tow. The issue is if one wants the two speed transfer case and only certain engine and trim levels allow the max tow and two speed transfer case to be paired. I know the 6.2 engine can be in a high country or LTZ but the Canadian website anyway doesn't spell that out at the end, nether does the 3.0 diesel in the high country. Unless the US website is more clear, that would be a dealership question to someone who can spit out all the RPO codes etc that GM will mate together ( and yes, Newdude may have all these answers in his head with what GM will or won't combine as a desired list of options ).

Edited August 19, 2025 by Chuck FB

[Crazy Canuck]

On 8/19/2025 at 10:17 AM, Rick_ said:

A company I worked for used to order these, upfit to rear duals and avoid having to stop at weigh stations just for having a two place sled trailer in tow with a couple passengers.  Their 1 tons were for the 8 place featherlight gooseneck sneaking in at just under 26,000.

MN has a license tab fee break for 1 tons so that might be a consideration.

My 3/4 ton diesels rode and handled way better than my 1 ton.  

The Max trailering package on a 1/2 ton 3.0L is not quite enough spring to handle a tongue weight of 700some lbs and the 3.73 went away for 2023 and newer in favor of a numerically lower (3.42?) ratio.  I like the 3.73s in my 2022 and air springs are easier to add than air bags in coil spring rears...

When looking at the rear end ratios, be sure to take into account the transmission as well to compare apples to apples.  For example, the ten speed with the 3.42 will actually have a lower first gear ratio than the six speed with the 3.73.

[Pryme]

1 hour ago, Crazy Canuck said:

When looking at the rear end ratios, be sure to take into account the transmission as well to compare apples to apples.  For example, the ten speed with the 3.42 will actually have a lower first gear ratio than the six speed with the 3.73.

I thought I read the gear ratios on the 10 and 6 were extremely close. I only recall because I thought it weird that it didn’t gain any advantage low or high much. Just a bunch more shifting in between very similar spreads. 
 

just looked it up. 1st 4.03 vs 4.70 and final drive .67 vs .64. About 4% difference on the final drive. 

Edited August 23, 2025 by Pryme

[Epsilon Plus]

6L90:

1st: 4.03

2nd: 2.36

3rd: 1.53

4th: 1.15

5th: 0.85

6th: 0.67

 

10L100:

1st Gear: 4.54:1

2nd Gear: 2.86:1

3rd Gear: 2.06:1

4th Gear: 1.72:1

5th Gear: 1.48:1

6th Gear: 1.26:1

7th Gear: 1.00:1

8th Gear: 0.85:1

9th Gear: 0.73:1

10th Gear: 0.63:1

[Chuck FB]

Epsilon, double check 9th gear ratio as my searches ( based on info some site compiles ) shows it as 0.68

 

10th and 9th gear ratios are so very close going by the tach, in my mind too close but it is what it is and expect there is a reason for it based on the various clutch packs engaging to flow power through certain gear sets that are used in combination for other gear ratios as well it what I suspect. 

 

Comparing the upper ratios ( based on the info I have ), 9th in the 10 speed is virtually the same as 6th in the 6 speed. Then 8th gear in the 10 speed is the same as 5th in the 6 speed. Another interesting item I noted is that while the 10 speed does indeed have a direct ratio for 7th so I assume no gears being used but straight power through the trans, the 6 speed does not have a direct drive ratio. 

 

Another item that I know in the past with 3 and 4 speed transmissions, which was a real downfall to moving a load in reverse and that is the ridiculously fast reverse ratios. So in this example the 10 speed has a 4.54 reverse and the 6 speed has a 3.06.   That is almost a 50% gear reduction in the 10 speed and when it comes to backing up a trailer in soft conditions or up a hill that would be very helpful. 

[GAMark]

On 7/26/2025 at 11:00 AM, PBNB said:

When we were looking for a truck to replace the crappy Tundra, we looked at 3/4 tons and the selection was very limited. The ones we saw were more like work trucks with cloth and minimal accessories.  We looked at Ram and GM mainly because of the big diesel offerings. The Ram dealership was too shady to deal with (bait and switch).

 

The 1 ton came with more options and was full of features that we couldn't find elsewhere.

 

[ManyCamaroz]

On 7/28/2025 at 12:44 AM, chwilliams said:

 

The lack of a column shifter in the 1500 put me over the fence to the 2500.

 

Also, I don't like the squarish tile pipes.

I thought I read the column shifter was still electronic but a column shifter was used to appease the average buyer.