Leveling kit or suspension lift?

TXGREEK · January 22, 2018

Swap out the shocks for bilstein 5100 leveling pieces @ full height & MOST dealers won't even realize you have a small lift...anyhow that's the route I went since the stock shocks are garbage & the bilsteins ride better on & off road. Added 2.25" block in rear as well as others mentioned that leaves you w/ some rake.

Bilstein 5100 already on order as well as new tires coming soon. Head mechanic advised not to add more than 1” in rear cause then the ride is affected as well (didn’t want the the 80’s look with fuzzy dice hanging from the rear view) and hence new shocks a must! [emoji1303]

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TXGREEK · January 23, 2018

Almost forgot, I was planning on ordering new fuel wheels too but decided against it, I really like the shiny 20”’s that it came with and besides, I don’t want my tires to stick out from my fenders, keeping the same size 275/55/20, just switching tires for better traction

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crushNchowda · January 23, 2018

15 hours ago, TXGREEK said:

Almost forgot, I was planning on ordering new fuel wheels too but decided against it, I really like the shiny 20”’s that it came with and besides, I don’t want my tires to stick out from my fenders, keeping the same size 275/55/20, just switching tires for better traction

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FWIW - you can run a 33" tire 275/60R20 no issue w/ that setup, you gain another 1/2" or so in ride height, more comfortable ride/better absorption of bumps etc. & manufacturers are making tires in that size that are P not LT rated so you don't take a big hit in MPG/performance/wear & tear jumping up to a heavy 10 ply LT tire.

I have Nitto Terra Grapplers in that size they weigh within a couple lbs of the stock goodyears, I also have general grabber arctic studded snows in the same size and they also come without any weight penalty (I think they're technically an "XL" not a "P" rated)

good luck

TXGREEK · January 23, 2018

FWIW - you can run a 33" tire 275/60R20 no issue w/ that setup, you gain another 1/2" or so in ride height, more comfortable ride/better absorption of bumps etc. & manufacturers are making tires in that size that are P not LT rated so you don't take a big hit in MPG/performance/wear & tear jumping up to a heavy 10 ply LT tire.

I have Nitto Terra Grapplers in that size they weigh within a couple lbs of the stock goodyears, I also have general grabber arctic studded snows in the same size and they also come without any weight penalty (I think they're technically an "XL" not a "P" rated)

good luck

Thank you, great information, my BFG KO2’s came in but I declined them cause they weigh much more than my original equipment Goodyear tires. I’ve been looking at the Toyo’s AT’s but very apprehensive on Asian made tires. I’ve heard so many mixed reviews about them and it’s extremely important to me that what ever Tire I switch to, they stick on the road being rain or snow. You’re absolutely correct, changing the tire going up in size is what kills the MPG, this is why I was looking at staying at the same size. I’m a BFG KO’s are all I’ve ever used, Does anyone have any experience with 10-20K miles on their Nittos or Toyo’s, driving in the rain whether they’re slippery when 10-20k miles on them?

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crushNchowda · January 23, 2018

4 hours ago, TXGREEK said:

Thank you, great information, my BFG KO2’s came in but I declined them cause they weigh much more than my original equipment Goodyear tires. I’ve been looking at the Toyo’s AT’s but very apprehensive on Asian made tires. I’ve heard so many mixed reviews about them and it’s extremely important to me that what ever Tire I switch to, they stick on the road being rain or snow. You’re absolutely correct, changing the tire going up in size is what kills the MPG, this is why I was looking at staying at the same size. I’m a BFG KO’s are all I’ve ever used, Does anyone have any experience with 10-20K miles on their Nittos or Toyo’s, driving in the rain whether they’re slippery when 10-20k miles on them?

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I can answer that for you w/ good first hand experience as well (except for the Toyos) - I actually initially installed BFG KO2's in 275/60R20 & while they look great, rode well (more cushy ride, decent grip wet/dry on pavement & we know they're good off road) the drop In acceleration/performance, change in shift patterns, longer braking distances, & drop in MPG was literally immediately noticeable & apparent. Wouldn't go into 4 cyl mode anymore (not that I really care) - but that's a pretty obvious indication its killing overall performance w/ the added unsprung weight. If you do some searching you may find the original thread I started comparing them, I want to say they weighed 55-60 lbs vs. around 39 lbs for the Wrangler SRA's, and the Nitto's I installed (same size) were 42-43 lbs or so despite the extra size over the stockers. I knew I'd regret the BFG's almost immediately like I said (I drive long distances for work at times) so I brought them back to the tire shop & swapped em for the Nittos + money back & am very happy. They're a better overall tire in every measure than the Wrangler SRA's - much better in rain, better than the BFG's in rain, but I don't think they'd perform as well as something like Michelin's LTX truck tire or whatever the call it. Offroad no comparison, I have a sloped dropoff in my backyard where my lawn ends & I have more "rough" landscaping & I would back my truck down & shovel off woodchips for ground cover and/or dump out pallets/fire wood for my large fire pit - EVERY time I did this when running the stock wranglers I had to stick it in 4wd to maneuver around in the thick woodchips/dirt & especially to get back up - not so w/ the Nitto Terra Grapplers, I was able to keep the truck in 2wd.

If that's not testament to the Nitto Terra Grappler G2 being a great all around 1/2 ton truck tire to have some aggressive looks, better offroad capability while still having decent rain/snow/dry pavement manners I don't know what is.

Personally I have not run the Nittos in the snow as I run dedicated set of studded snows, but I imagine they're better than the wranglers based on what I've seen/heard - however I'm guessing the BFG KO2's may have a slight edge on that as well as offroading (particularly w/ the thicker rubber sidewall) - rain is another story though....the BFG's are only marginally better than the stock wranglers & worse than the Nittos.

Edited January 23, 2018 by crushNchowda

TXGREEK · January 23, 2018

I can answer that for you w/ good first hand experience as well (except for the Toyos) - I actually initially installed BFG KO2's in 275/60R20 & while they look great, rode well (more cushy ride, decent grip wet/dry on pavement & we know they're good off road) the drop In acceleration/performance, change in shift patterns, longer braking distances, & drop in MPG was literally immediately noticeable & apparent. Wouldn't go into 4 cyl mode anymore (not that I really care) - but that's a pretty obvious indication its killing overall performance w/ the added unsprung weight. If you do some searching you may find the original thread I started comparing them, I want to say they weighed 55-60 lbs vs. around 39 lbs for the Wrangler SRA's, and the Nitto's I installed (same size) were 42-43 lbs or so despite the extra size over the stockers. I knew I'd regret the BFG's almost immediately like I said (I drive long distances for work at times) so I brought them back to the tire shop & swapped em for the Nittos + money back & am very happy. They're a better overall tire in every measure than the Wrangler SRA's - much better in rain, better than the BFG's in rain, but I don't think they'd perform as well as something like Michelin's LTX truck tire or whatever the call it. Offroad no comparison, I have a sloped dropoff in my backyard where my lawn ends & I have more "rough" landscaping & I would back my truck down & shovel off woodchips for ground cover and/or dump out pallets/fire wood for my large fire pit - EVERY time I did this when running the stock wranglers I had to stick it in 4wd to maneuver around in the thick woodchips/dirt & especially to get back up - not so w/ the Nitto Terra Grapplers, I was able to keep the truck in 2wd.

If that's not testament to the Nitto Terra Grappler G2 being a great all around 1/2 ton truck tire to have some aggressive looks, better offroad capability while still having decent rain/snow/dry pavement manners I don't know what is.

Personally I have not run the Nittos in the snow as I run dedicated set of studded snows, but I imagine they're better than the wranglers based on what I've seen/heard - however I'm guessing the BFG KO2's may have a slight edge on that as well as offroading (particularly w/ the thicker rubber sidewall) - rain is another story though....the BFG's are only marginally better than the stock wranglers & worse than the Nittos.

Nicely put, thank you

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TXGREEK · January 23, 2018

What other AT tires out there that give excellent traction in the rain?

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AgDoctor · January 23, 2018

Ridge Grappler does well in the rain. Some say better than BFG

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vancity_chad · January 24, 2018

4 hours ago, crushNchowda said:

I can answer that for you w/ good first hand experience as well (except for the Toyos) - I actually initially installed BFG KO2's in 275/60R20 & while they look great, rode well (more cushy ride, decent grip wet/dry on pavement & we know they're good off road) the drop In acceleration/performance, change in shift patterns, longer braking distances, & drop in MPG was literally immediately noticeable & apparent. Wouldn't go into 4 cyl mode anymore (not that I really care) - but that's a pretty obvious indication its killing overall performance w/ the added unsprung weight. If you do some searching you may find the original thread I started comparing them, I want to say they weighed 55-60 lbs vs. around 39 lbs for the Wrangler SRA's, and the Nitto's I installed (same size) were 42-43 lbs or so despite the extra size over the stockers. I knew I'd regret the BFG's almost immediately like I said (I drive long distances for work at times) so I brought them back to the tire shop & swapped em for the Nittos + money back & am very happy. They're a better overall tire in every measure than the Wrangler SRA's - much better in rain, better than the BFG's in rain, but I don't think they'd perform as well as something like Michelin's LTX truck tire or whatever the call it. Offroad no comparison, I have a sloped dropoff in my backyard where my lawn ends & I have more "rough" landscaping & I would back my truck down & shovel off woodchips for ground cover and/or dump out pallets/fire wood for my large fire pit - EVERY time I did this when running the stock wranglers I had to stick it in 4wd to maneuver around in the thick woodchips/dirt & especially to get back up - not so w/ the Nitto Terra Grapplers, I was able to keep the truck in 2wd.

If that's not testament to the Nitto Terra Grappler G2 being a great all around 1/2 ton truck tire to have some aggressive looks, better offroad capability while still having decent rain/snow/dry pavement manners I don't know what is.

Personally I have not run the Nittos in the snow as I run dedicated set of studded snows, but I imagine they're better than the wranglers based on what I've seen/heard - however I'm guessing the BFG KO2's may have a slight edge on that as well as offroading (particularly w/ the thicker rubber sidewall) - rain is another story though....the BFG's are only marginally better than the stock wranglers & worse than the Nittos.

Thanks for that detailed write up!

TXGREEK · February 1, 2018

Thanks for that detailed write up!

Wow, same here! Got rid of crappy stock Goodyears after I put the 2” front 1” rear then put on the KO2’s and noticed the crappy performance immediately, brought them back and said to hell with it, put on the Michelin Defenders 275/60/20 and the rest is history. The Defenders ride quality is like you’re riding on clouds compared to the KO2’s.

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TXGREEK · February 1, 2018

BTW, I have a buddy that runs a very well known truck accessories shop and he asked me “why don’t you just lift your truck to look like another lifted Gmc he had on the lot? I responded with “not sure why you’d want a lift cause though you’re truck sits up high what the hell is all that crap down below?” He responded with “it’s the lift kit!” LMAO!!!! Why would I want to lift my truck so as to have extra ground clearance but all that crap down below after lifted seems to be vulnerable when you off road. I’ll stick with the leveled performance truck I have.

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TXGREEK · February 1, 2018

BTW, I have a buddy that runs a very well known truck accessories shop and he asked me “why don’t you just lift your truck to look like another lifted Gmc he had on the lot? I responded with “not sure why you’d want a lift cause though you’re truck sits up high what the hell is all that crap down below?” He responded with “it’s the lift kit!” LMAO!!!! Why would I want to lift my truck so as to have extra ground clearance but all that crap down below after lifted seems to be vulnerable when you off road. I’ll stick with the leveled performance truck I have.

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Roadking01 · February 1, 2018

9 hours ago, TXGREEK said:

Wow, same here! Got rid of crappy stock Goodyears after I put the 2” front 1” rear then put on the KO2’s and noticed the crappy performance immediately, brought them back and said to hell with it, put on the Michelin Defenders 275/60/20 and the rest is history. The Defenders ride quality is like you’re riding on clouds compared to the KO2’s.

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I really can't wait till stock tires wear out ...I always run Michelins as replacements ..

great ride .. great traction pulling Snomobile trailer in snow... and most of all great tire life overall...

TXGREEK · February 1, 2018

I really can't wait till stock tires wear out ...I always run Michelins as replacements ..
great ride .. great traction pulling Snomobile trailer in snow... and most of all great tire life overall...

Discount Tire will actually give you something for them before they get worn out so try and get $50 each as trade in now

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crushNchowda · March 23, 2018

Figured I'd follow up since I now have experience w/ the Nitto Terra Grapplers in snow after 2 Noreaster storms in MA - I had taken my studded snow tire setup off I think 3-10, & we got 2' & then 1' of heavy snow. The Terra Grapplers did better than I anticipated, coming right off studded snows I thought I was going to have to really watch my driving to get used to non-snows, & while the Nittos certainly don't hold a candle to the studded snows when it came to cornering & especially braking (and to a degree higher speed grip/confidence on snow packed highways) - overall they were very competent in the snow & provided plenty of grip to get going & didn't slide nearly as poorly as the stock Wrangler SRA's when stopping or turning.

I should add however, the temps have only been just below freezing - if I were to run these Nittos in real frigid winter temps I'm sure the snow performance would've dropped off considerably, that's not really a knock on them though that's just the nature of an AT/all season tire vs. a dedicated snow tire. I would say for 90% of people driving in cold climates year round the Nittos would be a worthy consideration for a year round "do all" tire.