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RAM sells more than Silverado for 2nd quarter


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4 minutes ago, flyingfool said:

22mpg is accurate... 24 mpg your driving atleast 58mph with the wind to your back

 

i find city driving yields 12-13mpg on cheap gas, and 89-91 octaine will bump you 2mpg gain

 

That's the average. The best I got was 28.8 after a 50-mile trip. Other users have reported the same. I know I could get better gas mileage with Mexican gas though.

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The new Ram is a nice truck but after multiple issues with both my Jeeps and the dealer near me being unable/unwilling to fix them and what a POS the 2013 Ram we have at work is, I'm finished with FCA. In a few years all these new customers will learn the same lesson I did. 

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3 minutes ago, MikeNH said:

The new Ram is a nice truck but after multiple issues with both my Jeeps and the dealer near me being unable/unwilling to fix them and what a POS the 2013 Ram we have at work is, I'm finished with FCA. In a few years all these new customers will learn the same lesson I did. 

 

Previous owners like you were the reason why I didn't go for the $15k off RAM. I always research before I buy. There are dumb owners who bitch about everything and the informed who have driven other cars and know the grass is greener on the other side. From what I read out of RAM owners, I felt a lot of the complaints were legitimate. The Silverado.. not as much as the RAM.. in fact, Ford and Silverado was about the same after reading different forums.

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Wow, there is a lot of confirmation bias going on in this thread. I looked at buying a Sierra SLE, test drove it first, and then compared it the Ram Bighorn.

 

You want an honest opinion from someone who isn't brand loyal?

 

  • engine (slight edge to the ram 5.7; 5.3 wasn't quite as powerful; both have a long solid history of being mostly bullet proof.)
  • transmission (a draw; the ZF 8 speed in the ram is smooth, fast, world class, and used in very expensive cars in Europe, plus the 707+ HP monster of a Grand Cherokee Track Hawk etc; 8 speed vs 8 speed, I'll take Ram's. However GM has the 10 speed, but reduce points here because you need to pay extra for it and only offered on costly trims.)
  • ride/handling (goes to the ram; the default coil suspension is almost car like, and the GMC had some noticeable "side skip" going over some train tracks)
  • interior (goes to the ram, even without the 12 inch screen. Quality of materials, and overall styling is nicer. The GMs are functional and simple, the Ram is functional and beautiful.)
  • interior dash (the Sierra is far better than the Chevy, the Chevy dash looks like a 1990 cavalier with the same black and orange dials, depressing gauges and ugly font. The Sierra is very nice, equivalent to the Ram)
  • interior space (equivalent, both have very large and spacious cabins)
  • major features (panoramic sunroof, air suspension, radar cruise, adjustable pedals; quite a large edge for the Ram here. The Sierra has HID, very cool and something Ram needs to add. But overall, major features goes to the Ram)
  • minor features (usb ports etc etc who cares; it's a truck)
  • truck bed (slight edge to the GM; slightly bigger bed, cool tailgate though only available on upper trims)
  • capability for towing, payload etc (pretty much equivalent)
  • dependability (it's all the same; I've been a member of this forum and the Ram forum and they all have issues and they all have crummy dealers and good dealers)
  • exterior (very subjective; I like both, slight edge for me goes to the Chevy and GMC, they look awesome even though I like the Ram as well. One of the main turn offs of the Ram, in my opinion, is the whole "cattle theme". The "big horn", "long horn", "ram head", macho bull____. I just want a nice truck. The Chevy and GMC is a little more classy in that regard, though the Ram has come a long ways in 2019 moving more in a classy direction.)
  • MPG (slight edge to the GM twins; the 5.3/6.2 is slightly more advanced than the aging Hemi is, in terms of cylinder deactivation)

 

That leaves "cost". The same class truck in GMC/Chevy, after rebates and dealer handouts, would cost me $10,000 more than the equivalent Big Horn.

 

Dang, $10,000+. That's it, game over, bought the Ram, no regrets. I just won't spend upwards of $10,000 more for no reason, and "perceived quality" is not a good reason, we can all find horror stories for any brand on the internet. I'm not brand loyal (the entire concept is ludicrous as brands surely don't care about you), and I buy the best truck for the price I want to spend. That was, objectively and subjectively, the Ram 1500. 10 grand gets me a lot of wiggle room for any future repairs should I keep the truck for a long time outside the warranty period.

 

But we'll see, in a few years if it's time to upgrade, maybe Chevy might improve some of the shortcomings, specifically the interior and ride/handling. For me the rest of all that list above isn't terribly important.

 

However, as a current Ram owner, popularity means absolutely nothing to me. Couldn't care less if Ram was in first or fifth place. Ford is currently far out ahead of GM and Ram, if popularity was equivalent to "best truck" then we should all be driving Ford.

Edited by the wanderer
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More updated design, much nicer interior, larger more powerful Hemi engine (than the 5.3) with MDS but without the AFM problems, available mild hybrid model, much superior tuning on the 8 speed auto transmission, no leftover-from-the-1950s shifter-on-the-column, class exclusive optional air suspension, RamBox, and multi-function vertically-split tailgate, along with comparable reliability and dealer network = winner winner chicken dinner for the Ram.  

Edited by MaverickZ71
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4 minutes ago, MaverickZ71 said:

More updated design, much nicer interior, larger more powerful Hemi engine (than the 5.3) with MDS but without the AFM problems, available mild hybrid model, much superior tuning on the 8 speed auto transmission, no leftover-from-the-1950s shifter-on-the-column, class exclusive option air suspension and RamBox, comparable reliability and dealer network = winner winner chicken dinner for the Ram.  

 

Woops, forgot the ram side boxes (cool, but not needed for me), and the shifter. Believe it or not, I like the GM column shifter better than the dial, but this is admittedly subjective. I find the shift lever more "trucky", and the dial has confused my brother who test drove it and through it into park instead of drive when switching out of reverse. He shifted it about 4 times in the entire trip and each time had to stop and really concentrate on which way to turn the dial. I personally never had a problem with that aspect of it though.

 

As for the Ram etorque, I think the jury is still out on that? It does seem to work well for start/stop and slightly better MPG, but some don't like the effect it has, mainly that typical "drag" as the brakes kick in and recharge.

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32 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

That leaves "cost". The same class truck in GMC/Chevy, after rebates and dealer handouts, would cost me $10,000 more than the equivalent Big Horn.

 

Dang, $10,000+. That's it, game over, bought the Ram, no regrets. I just won't spend upwards of $10,000 more for no reason, and "perceived quality" is not a good reason, we can all find horror stories for any brand on the internet. I'm not brand loyal (the entire concept is ludicrous as brands surely don't care about you), and I buy the best truck for the price I want to spend. That was, objectively and subjectively, the Ram 1500. 10 grand gets me a lot of wiggle room for any future repairs should I keep the truck for a long time outside the warranty period.

It depends on what options you want and what kind of incentives you can get. Based on their respective build and price websites, a Ram with the features I'm looking for would be $10k more than a Chevy and I doubt anyone in Canada is giving that kind of discount, even Dodge. And that's with a 200 lb lower GVWR due to no max towing package on the Ram.

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6 minutes ago, Cpl_Punishment said:

It depends on what options you want and what kind of incentives you can get. Based on their respective build and price websites, a Ram with the features I'm looking for would be $10k more than a Chevy and I doubt anyone in Canada is giving that kind of discount, even Dodge. And that's with a 200 lb lower GVWR due to no max towing package on the Ram.

 

Are you in Canada? Because I am, and there is no way on God's green earth that you would be paying 10,000 more for the Ram with same features. It's literally the other way around, I just went through this process in Southern Ontario. Ram knocked off about 11 K in discounts, dealer through in another couple thousand discount. The local chevy dealers offered me $1000 discount (total) plus 0% financing. Heck, I was quoted $53,000 for a Sierra work truck with black bumpers and vinyl floors (though it had 4x4). Insane, considering that was more than I paid for my Big Horn almost fully optioned up (no sunroof, air, or led lighting).

 

Edit: don't go by the MSRP on the their websites, those are pretty much equal between the two. Go into the dealer and get an actual quote, then compare.

Edited by the wanderer
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9 minutes ago, Cpl_Punishment said:

And that's with a 200 lb lower GVWR due to no max towing package on the Ram.

Nah man, don't go there :) Towing is totally up to features you add, and you are more than likely going to be restricted by payload first rather than GCWR. 200 pounds is a rounding error.

 

I think the ram does have a towing package, but could be wrong. In any case, they offer towing mirrors, a 3.92 rear end, a class 4 hitch receiver, and an integrated brake controller. Pretty sure that's all that defines a "max tow" these days even if there is no dedicated package for that.

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26 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

 

Are you in Canada? Because I am, and there is no way on God's green earth that you would be paying 10,000 more for the Ram with same features. It's literally the other way around, I just went through this process in Southern Ontario. Ram knocked off about 11 K in discounts, dealer through in another couple thousand discount. The local chevy dealers offered me $1000 discount (total) plus 0% financing. Heck, I was quoted $53,000 for a Sierra work truck with black bumpers and vinyl floors (though it had 4x4). Insane, considering that was more than I paid for my Big Horn almost fully optioned up (no sunroof, air, or led lighting).

 

Edit: don't go by the MSRP on the their websites, those are pretty much equal between the two. Go into the dealer and get an actual quote, then compare.

I was going by the websites. Have to go to a Sport to get heated front bucket seats in a Ram so once you add all that towing stuff, it's about $62k vs about $53k for a Silverado RST. 

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3 hours ago, flyingfool said:

22mpg is accurate... 24 mpg your driving atleast 58mph with the wind to your back

 

i find city driving yields 12-13mpg on cheap gas, and 89-91 octaine will bump you 2mpg gain

I get 22 doing 70 MPH, 24-25 doing 60 MPH, 28 mpg if I set it at 55 and do a couple of the less ridiculous hypermiling techniques... mostly canceling cruise control instead of breaking as I approach towns and speed limits drop from 55 to 25. I think 89 octane is the sweet spot between price and improvement. Premium did seem to give a good fuel economy bump.

 

I checked the accuracy of the computer's fuel economy against my hand calculated number. Using TFL Truck's method, I found that the computer was 0.12 MPG higher than my hand calculated fuel economy. Accurate enough for me.

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11 minutes ago, Cpl_Punishment said:

I was going by the websites. Have to go to a Sport to get heated front bucket seats in a Ram so once you add all that towing stuff, it's about $62k vs about $53k for a Silverado RST. 

Just priced it out; big horn with no options other than bucket seats + level 2 equipment group (which is where the heated seats are found), $42,000.

 

Add the hemi + tow group + 3.92 rear end, $44,500. That's including Ram discounts, but dealers can usually knock off a few as well.

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5 minutes ago, the wanderer said:

Just priced it out; big horn with no options other than bucket seats + level 2 equipment group (which is where the heated seats are found), $42,000.

 

Add the hemi + tow group + 3.92 rear end, $44,500. That's including Ram discounts, but dealers can usually knock off a few as well.

Discounts must be better in Ontario. I get $51k when I dress it up the way I like it. 

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2 minutes ago, Cpl_Punishment said:

Discounts must be better in Ontario. I get $51k when I dress it up the way I like it. 

That very well could be possible, and I will say that's one aspect I find a little frustrating since you have to go into a dealer and get an actual quote to know where you're at.

 

I will say this though; the Ram guys were very hungry for my sale. The GM dealers almost didn't even seem to care. No real digging to help me work out a better price, no incentives, just some sort of (almost "arrogant") attitude that "we build the best truck and we're not going to play ball or care one way or the other". It took one dealer 2 weeks to get back to me if I was still interested in the quote I got, and a second dealer didn't even follow up.

The Ram dealer wasn't going to let me out the door without a purchase, and pretty much forced my hand by offering me the best deal I could get on my trade in, and he knew it too; one of those "the deal expires today" type of thing. I might have pushed back harder on that, but at that point I knew I was going to get the Ram anyway so why bother.

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7 hours ago, MaverickZ71 said:

Toyota must be doing something to maintain the teflon coating on their marketing image.  Remember how they never had public recalls or service bulletins until their management got called before Congress?  And magically there were lots of recalls and bulletins that appeared after that.  A friend has had TWO generations of Tacomas recalled because the frames rusted all the way through.  Go figure.  (But then again, half the people in America are registered liberals, which proves it's easy to fool some of the people all of the time.) 

 

FCA doesn't have to worry about JD, mostly because they don't have the stacks of cash that the other manufacturers do.  Fiat sucks and won't sell in America no matter what they do, Chrysler is down to about 2 vehicles for sale pending shuttering, Dodge is surprisingly still doing fine pumping out Hemi coupes and sedans, Ram just passed GM for the Number 2 spot in truck sales, and people are crazy about high-$ Jeeps.  Remember when GM had a chance to buy Jeep cheap and passed it up to create the Hummer division?  In retrospect, that sure was a smart move.  NOT.  Time will tell what happens to FCA since Sergio Marchionne's death (R.I.P.)

 

FCA has plenty of money. They're pulling in billions in profits every year. Surely they have could pull enough change from between the couch cushions to pay off JDP. I mean, apparently GM can afford to pay them off, so it shouldn't be too hard for Fiat-Chrysler to get their brands bumped up the list. GM even managed to pay JDP off and get their Fort Wayne plant on the Plant Quality Awards in 2017. A GM plant doesn't make it on there too often. How much do you think they paid JDP for that one? 

 

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