For You Electric Vehicle Fans

[Likarok]

Well it is not without some emissions. Unless you don't fart like I do when I drink Beer!

[Donstar]

In the past six months I have lived through two of the most devastating weather episodes in my long lifetime.  Climate change is credited to these events and our dependence on fossil fuels is touted as a cause of climate change.   We can scream bullshit but our opposition won't fix our flooded farmlands, dead livestock, or washed out bridges.  How about a whole town I've visited many times that was burned to the ground?   Right now it makes sense to me that the deadly crap coming out of my truck's exhaust daily for several years isn't good.   If I run my vehicle in a confined space, it would kill me.  I can't help but think that the millions of vehicles running continuously for decades  harms our encapsulated earth.   I know there are many members who I respect that will blow a gasket for me dissing fossil fuels.  However, even when factoring in the environmental impact of producing EV's, I believe getting rid of the need for gas powered personal automobiles is a positive move.  Another way to reduce emissions is to use gas prices to make personal gas powered vehicles unaffordable for average people.  No thanks.  I'd far rather get rid of my exhaust pipe than depend on public transportation!

[OnTheReel]

There’s a distinct lack of practicing what one is preaching. Both here and on the world stage.
 

I’m not against cleaner air. But I am against Al Gore and all these other grifters getting rich off their theories while being completely unaffected by their own policies. And I am against making our country miserable and poor while China and India continue to pollute beyond anyone’s comprehension.

 

If the EV transition is to be made, it needs to be done in a manner that won’t make us into a third world country. That means taking it slow. Allow the technology and the grid to catch up to our demands. Let people make their own decision to adopt EVs when they are a compelling alternative without government subsidy or coercion. 

 

Jamming gas prices up right now to force working class people onto the bus or into an EV is idiotic and frankly evil. Some of these people can’t afford much more than a $2,000 car. What’s the cheapest EV on Autotrader right now? 30 grand? If they can’t swing that, they should lose their independence and just ride the bus? Does quality of life and freedom not mean anything to anyone?

[KARNUT]

1 hour ago, Donstar said:

In the past six months I have lived through two of the most devastating weather episodes in my long lifetime.  Climate change is credited to these events and our dependence on fossil fuels is touted as a cause of climate change.   We can scream bullshit but our opposition won't fix our flooded farmlands, dead livestock, or washed out bridges.  How about a whole town I've visited many times that was burned to the ground?   Right now it makes sense to me that the deadly crap coming out of my truck's exhaust daily for several years isn't good.   If I run my vehicle in a confined space, it would kill me.  I can't help but think that the millions of vehicles running continuously for decades  harms our encapsulated earth.   I know there are many members who I respect that will blow a gasket for me dissing fossil fuels.  However, even when factoring in the environmental impact of producing EV's, I believe getting rid of the need for gas powered personal automobiles is a positive move.  Another way to reduce emissions is to use gas prices to make personal gas powered vehicles unaffordable for average people.  No thanks.  I'd far rather get rid of my exhaust pipe than depend on public transportation!

Ok answer me this. In the seventies it was the coming ice age. Now it’s warming. Same people different problem. We definitely can cause pollution. Changing the climate, call me skeptical. Growing up in New Jersey’s we experienced extreme different types of weather around Christmas. One year short sleeves playing out side. The next 2ft of snow. This year in Texas we experienced the biggest freeze I can remember. What failed us and deaths were the results? Windmills and solar power. When the experts speak I turn it off. We just were treated to a real life trial. Every aspect was on video. Jury had a result. Halt the people disagree with the out come. I don’t blame people for believing the whole man made warming idea. In ten years it’ll be back to cooling.

Edited November 20, 2021 by KARNUT

[Donstar]

Gas powered cars and trucks are significant contributors to climate change.  We've known this for a long time and the results of our slow acceptance and response are showing.  Automakers are currently producing a good selection of clean burning alternatives.  At a minimum, I'll have a choice between a Silverado EV, Ford Lightening, or Rivian for my next pickup.  Either of these choices would be an easy and  exciting transition!   

[KARNUT]

Yea and getting Covid doesn’t make you immune to Covid. I wonder if it’s the same experts? 

[customboss]

THEY who are THEY?   Science is based on demonstrable facts, that means that in 1973 the coming ice age was incorrect and founded on poor science.  Science means re-evaluating and not allowing personal bias to drive decision making based on that science.  In simple terms we do the best we can but it's not gospel until its irrefutable. 

 

Politics is part of the process and the practical real world way we govern.  US politics that sets us apart is rule of law guided by the constitution. Thats THE ONLY THING that separates USA from anywhere else.  As a disabled combat veteran I am saddened by the turn to authoritarianism and selfish misguided idea of what our RIGHTS are. We don't have the right to impose on others, hurt others, infect others, our rights are based on doing the common good for the fellow citizen.   BTW  the GOVERNMENT is US. You and me. If you hate the US government its essentially hating the collective us.  Voting only way to change that. And USA is not burger king, its all a compromise. We have become so fat and lazy and entitled we think voting = ordering the burger MY WAY.... part of that is having less than 1% of us serving in uniform or otherwise. We NEED more selfless service for all.  

 

Scientists don't base fact finding based on politics, the fact the radio station you listen to, FB page you read, TV programs you watch says different doesn't change demonstrable fact. 

 

The ability to discern demonstrable fact from bias is a real demonstrable problem since mass digital data info is being used to misinform on steroids, seems to me  like a dream for Nazi propagandist Goebbels could not have dreamt of.  

 

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State."

--Joseph Goebbels

 

Another fact is that just because you can read or hear IT you may not understand IT.  None of us know everything about everything.  Regardless of opinion or experience we ought to listen and read more and post and talk less.  At least hear the other speak or share and listen and to take that into account. 

 

Having said that I drove a Tesla X  a week ago. Our rural electric CO-OP offered a Y and X Tesla electric cars and I must say as an engineer and former professional pilot, race car team owner and driver it was wonderful.  My only problem was I am physically so messed up I had trouble getting out!  I can't fit into my oldest daughters GS corvette either so thats on me.  

 

It's nothing new except the technology is better check this out for back to the future, ROCKAUTO had this question on their newsletter see attached. 

 

https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=6384804

Edited November 21, 2021 by customboss
comment on citizen entitlement

[KARNUT]

1 hour ago, customboss said:

THEY who are THEY?   Science is based on demonstrable facts, that means that in 1973 the coming ice age was incorrect and founded on poor science.  Science means re-evaluating and not allowing personal bias to drive decision making based on that science.  In simple terms we do the best we can but it's not gospel until its irrefutable. 

 

Politics is part of the process and the practical real world way we govern.  US politics that sets us apart is rule of law guided by the constitution. Thats THE ONLY THING that separates USA from anywhere else.  As a disabled combat veteran I am saddened by the turn to authoritarianism and selfish misguided idea of what our RIGHTS are. We don't have the right to impose on others, hurt others, infect others, our rights are based on doing the common good for the fellow citizen.   BTW  the GOVERNMENT is US. You and me. If you hate the US government its essentially hating the collective us.  Voting only way to change that. And USA is not burger king, its all a compromise. We have become so fat and lazy and entitled we think voting = ordering the burger MY WAY.... part of that is having less than 1% of us serving in uniform or otherwise. We NEED more selfless service for all.  

 

Scientists don't base fact finding based on politics, the fact the radio station you listen to, FB page you read, TV programs you watch says different doesn't change demonstrable fact. 

 

The ability to discern demonstrable fact from bias is a real demonstrable problem since mass digital data info is being used to misinform on steroids, seems to me  like a dream for Nazi propagandist Goebbels could not have dreamt of.  

 

"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State."

--Joseph Goebbels

 

Another fact is that just because you can read or hear IT you may not understand IT.  None of us know everything about everything.  Regardless of opinion or experience we ought to listen and read more and post and talk less.  At least hear the other speak or share and listen and to take that into account. 

 

Having said that I drove a Tesla X  a week ago. Our rural electric CO-OP offered a Y and X Tesla electric cars and I must say as an engineer and former professional pilot, race car team owner and driver it was wonderful.  My only problem was I am physically so messed up I had trouble getting out!  I can't fit into my oldest daughters GS corvette either so thats on me.  

 

It's nothing new except the technology is better check this out for back to the future, ROCKAUTO had this question on their newsletter see attached. 

 

https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?arnumber=6384804

Sadly being in business most of my life from New Jersey to Texas. Selling  equipment all over the US and over seas. Someone always wants to get paid. With the government it’s worse. The government it’s life after where the money is. Lobbyist, private jobs in certain industry.  Who’s making money on this big electric non oil push? Naturally I’m a private sector guy. If you want it solved that’s where it happens. The only thing government is (maybe was) good at is the military. Tesla is almost there some other electric vehicles are getting close. The power grid is way off. Perfect nuclear for the power grid. Again sadly corruption is the problem especially in the government.

[Donstar]

18 hours ago, customboss said:

THEY who are THEY? 

I like your reaction to "they".  I agree that "we" reflects the democratic process.

 

We all have a personal responsibility to understand the impact of greenhouse gases on climate change. There is a lot of factual, apolitical, easy to read information available.  EV's are one way we can reduce our carbon emissions with little inconvenience.  The selection is growing at a rapid pace and I think this coming year will be very exciting for truck fans!.  This forum is directed towards those of us who take tremendous satisfaction in owning a personal vehicle.  Our discussions should focus on understanding and improving our transition from gas to electricity.   Type in "Rivian" on your YouTube search and view the advantages and versatility of an electric powertrain.  Imagine owning a vehicle  that goes 0-60 in 3 seconds while doing a favor to our planet!  I know we all have different experiences and influences but if a dozen Silverado EV's appeared on our local dealer's lot today, they'd be sold by tonight!

[KARNUT]

37 minutes ago, Donstar said:

I like your reaction to "they".  I agree that "we" reflects the democratic process.

 

We all have a personal responsibility to understand the impact of greenhouse gases on climate change. There is a lot of factual, apolitical, easy to read information available.  EV's are one way we can reduce our carbon emissions with little inconvenience.  The selection is growing at a rapid pace and I think this coming year will be very exciting for truck fans!.  This forum is directed towards those of us who take tremendous satisfaction in owning a personal vehicle.  Our discussions should focus on understanding and improving our transition from gas to electricity.   Type in "Rivian" on your YouTube search and view the advantages and versatility of an electric powertrain.  Imagine owning a vehicle  that goes 0-60 in 3 seconds while doing a favor to our planet!  I know we all have different experiences and influences but if a dozen Silverado EV's appeared on our local dealer's lot today, they'd be sold by tonight!

I am all for any performance vehicle. Like a famous race car driver once said I just want to go fast. My problem is the speed in which our government is pushing this change. Believe me I’ve been around long enough to know there’s more to the story than we have to do it now OR WE ARE GOING TO DIE! We all remember the dreadful 70s to the 90s when the auto makers started making vehicles fun again. It did make emissions cleaner. It took some adjustment time. We also remember the start up solar panel company our government gave billions to that failed. The electric car push is putting the cart ahead of the horse. As we learned in Texas last winter even 15 percent renewables if done wrong can lead to grid shut downs. California experience it every year. Car emissions get cleaner every year. There’s something else going on, there always is. Experience, age, equals not gullible. 

[customboss]

3 hours ago, KARNUT said:

I am all for any performance vehicle. Like a famous race car driver once said I just want to go fast. My problem is the speed in which our government is pushing this change. Believe me I’ve been around long enough to know there’s more to the story than we have to do it now OR WE ARE GOING TO DIE! We all remember the dreadful 70s to the 90s when the auto makers started making vehicles fun again. It did make emissions cleaner. It took some adjustment time. We also remember the start up solar panel company our government gave billions to that failed. The electric car push is putting the cart ahead of the horse. As we learned in Texas last winter even 15 percent renewables if done wrong can lead to grid shut downs. California experience it every year. Car emissions get cleaner every year. There’s something else going on, there always is. Experience, age, equals not gullible. 

Respectfully I'm with you until claiming renewables caused the Texas ERCOT meltdown. I am a retired OEM power generation chem engineer and can assure you that for YEARS  Caterpillar, Waukesha, Cummins, PSI and other nat gas power generators in the oil field begged Texas oil field operators to winterize their Natgas fueled power generation especially in Permian Basin.  On the state level the fact ERCOT and Texas grid failed was totally predictable and had happened in albeit lower impact over many years. 

 

Stick to the facts, not made up mis-info about reality. I lived in Texas for years, including the oil field so I am not some tree hugger speaking up here.  

 

From the link below " Even with this warning, Texas power producers embraced this risk and failed to properly winterize their infrastructure. One of the major factors that separates winterized plants outside of the South is that the turbines are not housed inside a building and are exposed to the elements. This is because Texas is a summer optimized market. Building structures around turbines would cause a loss of heat-rate optimization (efficiency) and total output capabilities (capacity) during the summer. In fact, non-extreme cooler temperatures are beneficial to thermal generating units’ efficiency.  In addition, ERCOT underestimated its need for reserve power capacity before this event and compounded its error by hours of indecision before alerting state utilities to commence rolling blackouts to protect against a complete grid meltdown." 

 

https://thepipeline742032307.wordpress.com/2021/03/12/ercot-and-the-2021-february-freeze/

 

Gov oversight lacking and greed NEEDLESSLY drove Texas and my family to freeze there.  It will happen again because of misinformation about the real causes. 

 

Reuters article debunking the renewables lie: https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-texas-wind-turbines-explain-idUSKBN2AJ2EI

 

 

Edited November 22, 2021 by customboss

[KARNUT]

38 minutes ago, customboss said:

Respectfully I'm with you until claiming renewables caused the Texas ERCOT meltdown. I am a retired OEM power generation chem engineer and can assure you that for YEARS  Caterpillar, Waukesha, Cummins, PSI and other nat gas power generators in the oil field begged Texas oil field operators to winterize their Natgas fueled power generation especially in Permian Basin.  On the state level the fact ERCOT and Texas grid failed was totally predictable and had happened in albeit lower impact over many years. 

 

Stick to the facts, not made up mis-info about reality. I lived in Texas for years, including the oil field so I am not some tree hugger speaking up here.  

 

From the link below " Even with this warning, Texas power producers embraced this risk and failed to properly winterize their infrastructure. One of the major factors that separates winterized plants outside of the South is that the turbines are not housed inside a building and are exposed to the elements. This is because Texas is a summer optimized market. Building structures around turbines would cause a loss of heat-rate optimization (efficiency) and total output capabilities (capacity) during the summer. In fact, non-extreme cooler temperatures are beneficial to thermal generating units’ efficiency.  In addition, ERCOT underestimated its need for reserve power capacity before this event and compounded its error by hours of indecision before alerting state utilities to commence rolling blackouts to protect against a complete grid meltdown." 

 

https://thepipeline742032307.wordpress.com/2021/03/12/ercot-and-the-2021-february-freeze/

 

Gov oversight lacking and greed NEEDLESSLY drove Texas and my family to freeze there.  It will happen again because of misinformation about the real causes. 

 

Reuters article debunking the renewables lie: https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-texas-wind-turbines-explain-idUSKBN2AJ2EI

 

 

I lived in Texas for 42 years and some hard freezes. Iv probably put more miles on pipelines and utility lines than HWYs. (Slight exaggeration). Don’t know why  that matters except sometimes I hear things. Never had problems of last winter’s magnitude before. It was mentioned on several news programs that renewables plus not winterizing properly caused the problems. Using prior knowledge of the hard freezes years ago without the past winter’s problems. Would lead to the conclusion renewables where the trigger. You seem to know your stuff judging by past post and bring alternative knowledgeable views without insults. I’m sizing you up. Another guy on here had seemingly knowledgeable info and couldn’t handle debating when opinions differed. I don’t pull things out of the air and go mostly from experience. I don’t paste info or articles. You can always find competing alternatives. Global warming is a good example. Oil changing intervals another. I’ve lived and have experience enough to know. Money, power, politics dictates more than science and truth. Enjoy your post so far.

[customboss]

4 hours ago, KARNUT said:

Money, power, politics dictates more than science and truth.

We agree on that!   Thanks for your gentility and sharing your experience, I don't take anyones position lightly.  If we all knew all we think we do we wouldn't need each other and we DO!  

Warm Regards.

[Grumpy Bear]

On 11/22/2021 at 6:17 PM, customboss said:

Money, power, politics dictates more than science and truth.

 

On 11/22/2021 at 6:17 PM, customboss said:

We agree on that!   Thanks for your gentility and sharing your experience, I don't take anyones position lightly.  If we all knew all we think we do we wouldn't need each other and we DO!  

Warm Regards.

 

I can not disagree with the quoted statement. However, and in the final analysis, 'choice' is still individual and best results come from choosing truth. Politics, power, money may make one popular and even afford some protection  but as noted in Eccl 7:12:

 

 

For wisdom is a protection just as money is a protection, but the advantage of knowledge is this: Wisdom preserves the life of its owner.

 

Just a thought from someone much wiser than I. 

[Donstar]

I don't believe the move to EV's is being overly forced or pushed. I think we're dragging on the move but understand there is a lot invested into our current way of moving people.  The snowball is simply getting too large to slow or ignore!  For those of us who will only consider trucks, the Rivian is receiving a lot of attention but the F150 (Lightening) will, I believe, remove all hesitancy amongst pickup drivers.  If you haven't watched recent YouTube reviews of this vehicle, have a look.  The performance specs of the base model of the Lightening when compared to the Raptor are shocking. I'm sure the delay/tease of the Silverado EV  is strategic but I'd rather have all choices at their respective dealerships. I think next year we're going to witness the start of a rapid decline of the gas powered vehicles on Dealer's lots.  Personally, I'd be very reluctant to buy a new gas powered truck at this time.