Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted
15 hours ago, newdude said:

 

 

When GM offered their own factory nav upgrade for 2019 and 2020 for IOS radio (which they then discontinued not even 2 months into 2020 MY), they gave you an SD card and an authorization code.  GM would issue the reprogramming of the necessary modules to make it happen.

 

2021, the option never existed.  The IOS radio also changes part #s for 2021 as well and 95% likely don't have the ability to upgrade from GM to factory navigation.

 

GM isn't in the wrong here.  GM's systems issue programming updates and software #s based directly from the options your VIN presents with.  Truck is a 2021 with IOS radio and w/o nav, that's the programming the radio receives.  

 

I get that MVI uses OE radios for the swap, but GM has NO indication that your VIN was upgraded to have factory nav, so all the cal files issued are as the truck was built.

 

All I can say at this point?  Pay the $75 and see if the dealer can call GM Techline and try to bring it back.  Or, try to keep a cool head and see if the dealer is willing to split or eat the $75 to see if anything can be done.  Or, move on and use Apple Carplay/Android auto and Google maps, Waze, etc.  10x better than factory nav.  

 

GM didn't "steal" it from you, the dealer didn't "steal" it either.  You went in with an issue, the truck was reprogrammed with the latest factory calibrations which means no nav.  

 

Thank you for the info.  To be clear, my truck is a 2020.  So, the hardware is all there.  Your explanation of the process prior to GM ceasing the program gives me a little hope.  Everything about MY2021 is therefore moot as it relates to my situation. 

 

As for MVI, they didn't swap anything.  I sent them a module from my truck that is located on the passenger side, bottom of dash area, on the far right side behind the glove box.  MVI then performed their magic to add factory nav, and sent it back.  I then reinstalled that module into my truck, inserted the SD card, and voila.  Nothing was swapped out.  I chose to go this route to avoid fighting with XM if I'd swapped that module.  It was the more expensive, and more time consuming, route to go. 

 

You and I will have to agree to disagree on what constitutes theft.  However, my point still stands that they can't claim to be a tech company when they don't behave like one.  For example, how many times have you had a cell phone that's run an OS update and your 3rd party apps suddenly disappeared?  I'm willing to wager that number is 0.  Same here for me.  GM should've known this could've been an issue of their going to be a tech company.  Nonetheless, something was taken from me and I want it back.  I shouldn't be compelled to pay.  That is actually illegal.  I did absolutely nothing wrong.  I own my truck.  It is not a lease. 

  • Like 2
Posted
10 hours ago, downtheroadar said:

Use WAZE, it has live traffic routing, has live updates from other users that show road hazards and where police are sitting.  

That's a bit difficult when your phone is sitting in the wireless phone charger and my truck doesn't have wireless Android Auto or Apple CarPlay.  I get the live traffic updates with the factory navigation, along with suggested reroutes.  I don't really care about speed traps, etc.  I go fast enough to not be a problem in traffic, and slow enough to not get ticketed.  That's +4 in surface roads, and +8 on the freeway. 

Posted
9 hours ago, bwoodsmn said:

 

The path for resolution for this goes thru MVI.  I understand you're pissed at GM, but, how are they to know what aftermarket vendors are doing to their firmware to make the aftermarket devices work?  Now, as far as MVI is concerned, it might be helpful to assume positive intent - it may very well be that the GM update that broke the system was not anticipated by MVI - and MVI needs to figure this out, not just for you, but for anyone considering buying their hardware. There's also no guarantee if GM winds back the firmware update, that the MVI system would then work.

 

Its also a new update from GM, and I doubt that GM gave MVI any heads up the changes were coming.  Give MVI a little tine to fix this, or at least to communicate to their customers what the modification path looks like. MVI has to consider that this might be an ongoing process, where GM updates , the MVI mods break, MVI sends an update, and on and on.  MVI has a problem.  Unfortunately its your's too.

I'm not a tech guy, so thanks for your input.  To answer your question, a possible resolution would be to treat the OS in a similar manner cell phones are treated.  How many OS updates have you been through where 3rd party apps are not affected?  I don't know the exact number for myself as I've been dealing with that for over a decade, but I can't recall ever losing an app unless I deliberately deleted it.

  • Like 1
Posted

You may not have lost an app, but it’s not uncommon at all to have the app error out with a new OS update.  And as for being a tech company, how often have you ever seen Apple (a tech company for sure) allow a module to be removed from its phone and allowed a third party to perform “their magic” on it and still support the product?  In fact, their products are highly locked down.

 

I think your resolution will end up being with MVI.  They need to support their process which is apparently not supported or coordinated with the manufacturer.

  • Like 1
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, GN2018 said:

You may not have lost an app, but it’s not uncommon at all to have the app error out with a new OS update.  And as for being a tech company, how often have you ever seen Apple (a tech company for sure) allow a module to be removed from its phone and allowed a third party to perform “their magic” on it and still support the product?  In fact, their products are highly locked down.

 

I think your resolution will end up being with MVI.  They need to support their process which is apparently not supported or coordinated with the manufacturer.

I can't speak about Apple since I have never used one of their products.  It is my understanding the Android OS does allow developers to do things, though.

 

There are also 3rd party companies where you can take your device for repairs or modifications and the manufacturer still backs the phone.  Those company's employees do receive training from the manufacturer, just like a dealership's technicians do.  Iirc, one such company is called UbreakIfix.

Edited by Transient
Posted

Hopefully mvi will give you a discount on reprogramming the module again.  Got a question:  did reflashing the module actually fix your camera problem?

  • Like 1
Posted
1 hour ago, Transient said:

That's a bit difficult when your phone is sitting in the wireless phone charger and my truck doesn't have wireless Android Auto or Apple CarPlay.  I get the live traffic updates with the factory navigation, along with suggested reroutes.  I don't really care about speed traps, etc.  I go fast enough to not be a problem in traffic, and slow enough to not get ticketed.  That's +4 in surface roads, and +8 on the freeway. 

So you'd rather spend several hundred dollars for a junk Nav program that'll get overwritten instead of a $10 USB cord?  Ok.  Gotcha.  By the way, wireless AA or AC is junk, too.  Drains the battery quickly so you need a cord anyhow.

  • Like 1
Posted

GM, like Apple, has their software as a closed system, meaning that it can't/shouldn't be altered by unauthorized parties.  Apple iOS used to be hacked, called "jail breaking", by hackers to turn on functionality that was in the operating system but not turned on by Apple.  When Apple sends out a new update for iOS, it wipes out the jail break.  In a similar sense, GM does not know that additional functionality has been added to your truck.  They only know what they know by what is assigned to your VIN.  So when they reflashed your module, it was what they have marked down to your VIN.  When someone gets official GM accessories added by the dealer, and it involves flashing some software, I think it gets added to your VIN so that in the future, any reflashes should have that change included.  

 

IMO - when MVI updates the module for NAV, they should either "lock" the change, or let GM know that the change occurred so that it can be added to your VIN.  This would avoid future issues with software updates or reflashes. 

  • Like 3
Posted
21 hours ago, newdude said:

 

 

None of this is GM's fault.  YOU had an aftermarket sourced program installed into your radio.  GM can't do anything to restore an AFTERMARKET program, even if its "GM" software.

 

You took it in for an issue.  They reprogrammed the modules to the latest FACTORY calibration.  The truck was built WITHOUT NAV, so that is what goes back in.  

 

Sucks to be you.  

spacer.png

  • Like 1
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, AirForceAngler said:

So you'd rather spend several hundred dollars for a junk Nav program that'll get overwritten instead of a $10 USB cord?  Ok.  Gotcha.  By the way, wireless AA or AC is junk, too.  Drains the battery quickly so you need a cord anyhow.

I’m curious my newest vehicle is an 15 CRV. When I unplug from the USB my phone switches to Bluetooth within a couple of seconds while I’m plugging in my earphones for my walk. When I get back from my walk it switches back to the vehicle. Is that just an iPhone thing or do other phones work that way? Iv only used  iPhones. Question 2. I thought CarPlay used your phones navigation through the dash display. As I stated earlier I use my phone for everything, don’t have any problem with the small screen. My phone navigation has saved my from more than a few traffic jams. Especially going through Houston or Atlanta.

Edited by KARNUT
  • Like 1
Posted
7 minutes ago, KARNUT said:

I’m curious my newest vehicle is an 15 CRV. When I unplug from the USB my phone switches to Bluetooth within a couple of seconds while I’m plugging in my earphones for my walk. When I get back from my walk it switches back to the vehicle. Is that just an iPhone thing or do other phones work that way? Iv only used  iPhones. Question 2. I thought CarPlay used your phones navigation through the dash display. As I stated earlier I use my phone for everything, don’t have any problem with the small screen. My phone navigation has saved my from more than a few traffic jams. Especially going through Houston or Atlanta.

Switching to bluetooth after unplugging may be a function of either your phone or your CRV, I'm not sure there.  And it may depend on the settings of either one, too.  

Regarding CarPlay (and Android Auto), it does use your phones navigation on the infotainment screen, along with other Apps as well.  CarPlay and AA basically mirror your phone's screen on the radio screen.  Some apps that work with this are Maps, Waze, Spotify, Apple Music and others.  Instead of fumbling around on your phone's screen, you can now view your Maps, or select songs/playlists on the larger radio screen instead of fumbling around on your phone.  It also means you don't have to have your phone mounted on your dash to see it.  Everything is on your radio screen now.

  • Like 2
Posted
2 hours ago, Transient said:

Thank you for the info.  To be clear, my truck is a 2020.  So, the hardware is all there.  Your explanation of the process prior to GM ceasing the program gives me a little hope.  Everything about MY2021 is therefore moot as it relates to my situation. 

 

As for MVI, they didn't swap anything.  I sent them a module from my truck that is located on the passenger side, bottom of dash area, on the far right side behind the glove box.  MVI then performed their magic to add factory nav, and sent it back.  I then reinstalled that module into my truck, inserted the SD card, and voila.  Nothing was swapped out.  I chose to go this route to avoid fighting with XM if I'd swapped that module.  It was the more expensive, and more time consuming, route to go. 

 

You and I will have to agree to disagree on what constitutes theft.  However, my point still stands that they can't claim to be a tech company when they don't behave like one.  For example, how many times have you had a cell phone that's run an OS update and your 3rd party apps suddenly disappeared?  I'm willing to wager that number is 0.  Same here for me.  GM should've known this could've been an issue of their going to be a tech company.  Nonetheless, something was taken from me and I want it back.  I shouldn't be compelled to pay.  That is actually illegal.  I did absolutely nothing wrong.  I own my truck.  It is not a lease. 

Good points here and clarity. My phone has had many updates and retains all downloads though updates. Not all from the apple store that I can recall. Car companies have let it know for a long time they want all services and repairs done at the dealer. There’s bill in congress now to change that.

  • Like 1
Posted
22 minutes ago, KARNUT said:

Good points here and clarity. My phone has had many updates and retains all downloads though updates. Not all from the apple store that I can recall. Car companies have let it know for a long time they want all services and repairs done at the dealer. There’s bill in congress now to change that.

I've had apps that have quit working or required an update in the when my phone's OS was updated.  It is usually up to the creators of the Apps to update their product to be compatible with the current OS.  Similarly, it should be up to MVI to create a product or product support that will keep working when a vehicles software is updated.  I still don't see this as GM's issue, but MVI's.

  • Like 2
Posted
3 hours ago, Transient said:

Thank you for the info.  To be clear, my truck is a 2020.  So, the hardware is all there.  Your explanation of the process prior to GM ceasing the program gives me a little hope.  Everything about MY2021 is therefore moot as it relates to my situation. 

 

As for MVI, they didn't swap anything.  I sent them a module from my truck that is located on the passenger side, bottom of dash area, on the far right side behind the glove box.  MVI then performed their magic to add factory nav, and sent it back.  I then reinstalled that module into my truck, inserted the SD card, and voila.  Nothing was swapped out.  I chose to go this route to avoid fighting with XM if I'd swapped that module.  It was the more expensive, and more time consuming, route to go. 

 

You and I will have to agree to disagree on what constitutes theft.  However, my point still stands that they can't claim to be a tech company when they don't behave like one.  For example, how many times have you had a cell phone that's run an OS update and your 3rd party apps suddenly disappeared?  I'm willing to wager that number is 0.  Same here for me.  GM should've known this could've been an issue of their going to be a tech company.  Nonetheless, something was taken from me and I want it back.  I shouldn't be compelled to pay.  That is actually illegal.  I did absolutely nothing wrong.  I own my truck.  It is not a lease. 

The 3rd party apps might not disappear but, I've had some that do not work right when the new update was down loaded. That is not OS companies fault because the app quit working that is the company that made the apps fault. So do you go complaining to OS company or the app company for it not working?

 

My understanding is that all new GM trucks starting with the 2019 models. If you don't order the option (NAV, Trailer Brakes, and others) from the time the truck is built. GM has basically made it so you can't go back and install them. I know you paid for NAV to work in your truck but when you asked them to fix the camera and they needed to update the software. GM will only let the dealer upload the software version that is assigned to your trucks VIN. Even paying the $75 to get an answer from GM at this point is probably a waste of money because I serious doubt they will change anything from the factory settings. I know that's not the answer you want to hear.

  • Like 1
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
  • Forum Statistics

    250.5k
    Total Topics
    2.7m
    Total Posts
  • Member Statistics

    342,913
    Total Members
    8,960
    Most Online
    Smitty462
    Newest Member
    Smitty462
    Joined
  • Who's Online   4 Members, 1 Anonymous, 693 Guests (See full list)


  • Latest Articles

  • Posts

    • Can it still be Assembled I?    Stribeck says that we need a certain amount of viscosity under conditions of load and velocity to prevent two surfaces of a know roughness from tearing each other asunder. And we have marketing trying to tell the masses that those two surfaced require less of that commodity due to more exact limits being placed on the same old clearances. We also know that there are limits to how hard something can before it becomes to brittle to be viable and to smooth to 'wet' the surface and that both of those conditions have been known and met since about the Second World War.    That viscosity value shook out at 10 centistokes at 212 F just under a hundred years ago.  Give this a look: [Anton Parr]     What is advertised is the Kinematic viscosity (mm2/s) or that which has been density adjusted but the value we are after is the dynamic viscosity (mPa.s) or true viscosity. You can see that this number is dependent on density thus base stock and temperature. You can also see that an SAE 30 doesn't reach that value in this example. However an SAE 30 that is at the upper end of the SAE 30 range; 12.5 cSt (mm2/s), might. 12.5 * .83 = 10.375 (mm2/s). If you could find an SAE 30 at the upper end these days.   Then there is the complication of viscosity modifiers or VII or VM, whatever you wish to call them. Polymers added to very thin base oils, perhaps 3 to 6 cP oils, that will meet the SAE *W30 spec at 'tested' shear rates and 100 C/212F  target temperature. So a polymer fortified base that is a fraction of the 10 cP requirement Stribeck insist upon.   This could be all well and good if those polymers didn't have two very problematic 'features'. They shear or loose viscosity both 1.) permanently and 2.) temporality. And they do both omitted in the advertised data with the distinct  purpose of deceiving the consumer of the actual operating state of the fluid. I've shown the example of Warren Oils COSTCO 10.91 cSt 5W30 formuation several times where the 100 C HTHS value is 6.9 cP!! That's the temporary shear down and with and SSI or shear stability index of 9.4 cSt. Note the intentional deception in using mixed units?    After a short while that 9.4 cSt oil has a viscosity corrected dynamic value of 7.8 cP. But as the SSI is still within the range of an SAE *W30 whose lower value is 9.3 cSt.    This allows them to continue to call this SAE 16 weight oil a 30 weight, the cake, and still meet the API requirements for fuel efficiency IMPROVEMENT mandated by the EPA. The eating of the cake. By the time you've worn out your motor doing the responsible thing by adhering to the warranty requirements, (the stick), you get deprived of the carrot, wear control. So sad, to bad.   So what can be done? Do I need actually say? [Anton Parr]       Even this must be monitored if the oil is on the low side and the VII an organic or you opt for a 0W40 with an even lighter base oil and more / higher MW VII. (Note the lower density of the 40 weight versus the SAE 30 mono-weight?)    There is another workaround. Temperature. An SAE *W30 run at a bulk temperature of between 180 and 195 F.    Being the belt and suspenders sort I am I do both. Run it cook and run it heavy.    In Part II I'll work the AW package. 
    • So, do I go elbow-deep on this thing or list it for sale and play dumb? Seems to "runs good."   I'm about $1200 away from having: -a rebuilt injector ($300) -a new cat ($250) -a new cat back exhaust (OE style) ($300) -a new AC compressor ($200) -AC refrigerant charge ($150)   In theory, this should rectify the obvious detracting issues from its value and operability. Cold AC with a non-squeaking AC pulley both sounds and feels good. An exhaust that isn't cut/hacked in 17 different places and doesn't vibrate on a crossmember would make it sound and feel less janky. A working cat would help the stink, and will save the earth, but *if and only if* the fuel system is working properly, which would also address the intermittent "rich" CEL.   Heard a good one... CEL for "Rich condition" means you haven't spent enough money on the truck lately, and it's letting you know.   Rebuilding the injector would seem to be the most important part. Replacing the cat would be secondary. I don't think mine is plugged or overly restricted, but it might be a little restricted? I have no good way to tell other than seat of the pants feel. I hate the smell.   The current theory is I have a rich idle problem: A bad fuel pressure regulator, or a leaking injector(s) being the highest probabilities. I already replaced the FPR but that doesn't mean its replacement isn't also bad. It was a new part from Dorman, but the packaging looked like it had been sitting on a shelf for 20 years.   This is the (single) upstream O2 sensor shown at idle. I'm getting a lot of "rich" it seems. Sometimes it stays high like that and doesn't drop down. That makes me think it's processing injector leaks or a partially stuck open injector.     Other times it looks like this. Nice oscillations between rich and lean, which is what I think it should be. Under load and at speed, the oscillations are nice and tight and uniform looking, high and low.     Fuel trims suggest the PCM is compensating pretty hard at idle to pull fuel out. But it's not enough to trip a CEL. Something about slowing to a stop: brake vaccum booster, EGR, or the EVAP purge is delayed, or there's pooled fuel in the intake again that's draining into a cylinder is enough to set the CEL. Of course, in two days of driving, it hasn't set. I was hoping to actually look at the freeze-frame data when it sets. IAT is high because it's idling on an 83 degree day here.  
    • Have considered installing a DC to DC charger in your camper to replace your isolator?  
    • Common failure.  You need to replace the fuel door housing.   The painted cover transfers over to the new housing.  To remove the old one there is 4 spots where you poke the plastic to release it.  
    • No such thing as regenerative braking on a pure ICE vehicle.     Regenerative braking is the re-capture of energy from electric motors and stores it in the battery pack.  So hybrids, PHEV and EVs have regenerative braking.     What you are seeing is the charging system changing modes is all.  Its likely entering charge mode for some sort of reason is all.  All of the charging modes will be listed below.   As for L10 vs D.  L10 turns off automatic grade braking.  L10 puts you in control of grade downshifts where in D it will automatically do it based on brake pedal position and other factors.  Otherwise L10 and D drive exactly the same aside from that one aspect.    Battery Sulfation Mode The BCM will enter this mode when the interpreted Generator output voltage is less than 13.2 V for 45 minutes. When this condition exists the BCM will enter Charge Mode for 2–3 minutes. The BCM will then determine which mode to enter depending on voltage requirements.   Charge Mode The BCM will enter Charge Mode when ever one of the following conditions are met:   Windshield wipers are ON for more than 3 s. Climate Control Voltage Boost Mode Request is true, as sensed by the HVAC control module via serial data. High speed cooling fan, rear defogger, and HVAC high speed blower operation can cause the BCM to enter the Charge Mode. The estimated battery temperature is less than 0°C (32°F). Battery State of Charge is less than 80%. Vehicle speed is greater than 145 km/h (90 mph) A current sensor malfunction exists. System voltage is determined to be below 12.56 V When any one of these conditions is met, the system will set targeted generator output voltage to a charging voltage between 13.9–15.5 V, depending on the battery state of charge and estimated battery temperature.   Fuel Economy Mode The BCM will enter Fuel Economy Mode when the estimated battery temperature is at least 0°C (32°F) but less than or equal to 80°C (176°F), the calculated battery current is less than 15 A and greater than −8 A, and the battery state-of-charge is greater than or equal to 80%. Its targeted generator output voltage is the open circuit voltage of the battery and can be between 12.5–13.1 V. When fuel economy mode is active, the generator is not charging, only maintaining open circuit battery voltage. The BCM will exit this mode and enter Charge Mode when any of the conditions described above are present.   Headlamp Mode The BCM will enter Headlamp Mode when ever the head lamps are ON (high or low beams). Voltage will be regulated between 13.9–14.5 V.   Start Up Mode When the engine is started the BCM sets a targeted generator output voltage of 14.5 V for 30 s.   Tow/Haul Mode (if applicable) Pressing the Tow/Haul Mode button located on the center stack, the vehicle system voltage is raised and the remote (non-vehicle) battery will be charged. Having the headlamps on will raise the system voltage and if the Tow/Haul button is applied it will not serve any purpose. The voltage is regulated between 13.9-14.5 V.      
  • GM-Trucks.com Clubs

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...