RST chassis gas vs diesel towing capabilities

[OlyMike]

If the MY RST chassis is capable of towing up to 11,600 with a swap to the gas 5.3L from my 3.0 duramax, does it make much of a difference if I max out the tongue weight or go a bit over it with a trailer? Keep in mind the trailer would still be below the 3.0's reduced tow max of 9300lb, which I've read is reduced due to heat with towing inside the engine compartment with the new 3.0 duramax. 

I ask this because I'm looking at buying a sub 6000lb UVW toy hauler, but some of the tongue weights are floating between 750-1120lbs. One that I like is 920lb, but I'm sure I might go over that with anything added to bedroom area......but I suppose the 800lb in bikes in  the back would reduce some of the nose weight. I've done estimations on a couple of trailers adding bikes, gear, people, food and liquids and would be under the max towing weight. My only concern it tongue weight, but the RST hitch should be able to carry more weight than the 10% listed by GM.

Edited December 28, 2020 by OlyMike
typo

[newdude]

10 hours ago, OlyMike said:

If the MY RST chassis is capable of towing up to 11,600 with a swap to the gas 5.3L from my 3.0 duramax, does it make much of a difference if I max out the tongue weight or go a bit over it with a trailer? Keep in mind the trailer would still be below the 3.0's reduced tow max of 9300lb, which I've read is reduced due to heat with towing inside the engine compartment with the new 3.0 duramax. 

I ask this because I'm looking at buying a sub 6000lb UVW toy hauler, but some of the tongue weights are floating between 750-1120lbs. One that I like is 920lb, but I'm sure I might go over that with anything added to bedroom area......but I suppose the 800lb in bikes in  the back would reduce some of the nose weight. I've done estimations on a couple of trailers adding bikes, gear, people, food and liquids and would be under the max towing weight. My only concern it tongue weight, but the RST hitch should be able to carry more weight than the 10% listed by GM.

 

RST with the 5.3 and Max Trailer is rated for 11,300 on a crew cab short or standard bed.  Crew cab RST with 6.2 and Max Trailer, its 11,900lbs with the standard bed, 12,000lbs with the short bed.

 

All the trucks are built with the same hitches, frames, etc.  Max Trailer involves higher capacity cooling, taller gearing, different spring rates and 9.76" rear axle.  That is how the higher tow ratings are achieved.  A crew cab 5.3 without Max Trailer tows 9500/9600lbs.  

 

The label in the door jamb is the be all for a specific truck as far as the rated tongue and payload of the truck, as equipped with any options.

 

[OlyMike]

1 hour ago, newdude said:

 

RST with the 5.3 and Max Trailer is rated for 11,300 on a crew cab short or standard bed.  Crew cab RST with 6.2 and Max Trailer, its 11,900lbs with the standard bed, 12,000lbs with the short bed.

 

All the trucks are built with the same hitches, frames, etc.  Max Trailer involves higher capacity cooling, taller gearing, different spring rates and 9.76" rear axle.  That is how the higher tow ratings are achieved.  A crew cab 5.3 without Max Trailer tows 9500/9600lbs.  

 

The label in the door jamb is the be all for a specific truck as far as the rated tongue and payload of the truck, as equipped with any options.

 

Yes, I know the numbers on my sticker. The point of my question is, if I have a trailer tongue at 895lb unloaded and go over the sticker weight of 930lbs, will it really hurt anything if I go a bit over 930lbs.

[AEmedic]

It is possible that your tongue weight won't actually go up when you load the Toyhauler with the weight to the rear of the axle/axles.

[redwngr]

 

 

 

[kenny_r]

Most toyhauler...kinda like a lot of trailers want the weight forward of the axles. Mine has a hitch weight of around 700, but I’m guessing I’m more like 900, and that is with dry tanks. Add 50 or 100 gallons of water and say goodbye to any payload you had on that 1/2 ton, not to mention pushing the hitch limits

[newdude]

2 hours ago, OlyMike said:

Yes, I know the numbers on my sticker. The point of my question is, if I have a trailer tongue at 895lb unloaded and go over the sticker weight of 930lbs, will it really hurt anything if I go a bit over 930lbs.

 

GM prefers 10% based on all of the stickers but per their documentation in the order guide they allow for 10-15% tongue on conventional trailers. 

 

So, no it won't hurt anything other than you will have to subtract your final tongue weight from the payload on the tag to see what your true remaining payload will be when hooked up.  So if your payload is 1800lbs and your tongue hits 1000lbs, you will have 800lbs payload remaining.  That 800lbs covers you, any passengers and extra gear in the truck.  

 

[OlyMike]

3 hours ago, AEmedic said:

It is possible that your tongue weight won't actually go up when you load the Toyhauler with the weight to the rear of the axle/axles.

Ya, I was thinking that might be workable to manipulate the weight. 

 I have about 800lbs with 4 dirt bikes to work with. 

Edited December 28, 2020 by OlyMike

[RWTJR]

21 hours ago, OlyMike said:

If the MY RST chassis is capable of towing up to 11,600 with a swap to the gas 5.3L from my 3.0 duramax, does it make much of a difference if I max out the tongue weight or go a bit over it with a trailer? Keep in mind the trailer would still be below the 3.0's reduced tow max of 9300lb, which I've read is reduced due to heat with towing inside the engine compartment with the new 3.0 duramax. 

I ask this because I'm looking at buying a sub 6000lb UVW toy hauler, but some of the tongue weights are floating between 750-1120lbs. One that I like is 920lb, but I'm sure I might go over that with anything added to bedroom area......but I suppose the 800lb in bikes in  the back would reduce some of the nose weight. I've done estimations on a couple of trailers adding bikes, gear, people, food and liquids and would be under the max towing weight. My only concern it tongue weight, but the RST hitch should be able to carry more weight than the 10% listed by GM.

Toy Hauler tongue weights are always high to offset the weight of the toys/cargo loaded behind the trailer axles which reduces the tongue weight. Due to design differences in different brands of toy haulers there is no real formula. Let's assume on average, 2.5 lbs of added weight behind the trailer axles will reduce hitch weight by approximately 1 pound. This is not accurate because a toy hauler by one manufacturer is going to have different axle placement from another and the farther back the loaded weight the bigger the change, etc., but it illustrates how the tongue weight changes with toy/cargo loading behind the trailer axles.

 

So using the above concept; if a 6000 lb toy hauler had a 1100 lb unladen tongue weight and 800 lbs of dirt bikes was added behind the axles of the trailer, the tongue weight would be reduced by 320 lbs making it 780 lbs or about 11.5% of the 6800 lb trailer weight and well within the hitch weight restrictions and a pretty balanced load. Conversely, if the dry, unladen hitch weight was 900 lbs and and was reduced by the same 320 lbs it would have a 580 lb hitch weight or about 8.5% of the 6800 lb trailer and it would be too light and sway. Of course other cargo, accessories, etc., loaded forward of the axles will increase the tongue weight ****Please Note: This is just for illustration purposes. The trailer should be loaded as it will be towed and the actual tongue weight measured.****

 

Again, this is not accurate and is just to illustrate a point. DO NOT use these actual numbers or weight distribution formula in determining trailer or hitch weight.

 

It seems feasible a a 6000 lb dry weight toy hauler could be properly loaded to bring the hitch weight into the 10%-15% trailer weight range and not exceed the hitch or the truck published limitations.

 

See page number 14: https://www.chevrolet.com/content/dam/chevrolet/na/us/english/index/vehicle-groups/trailering-and-towing/trucks/02-pdfs/2020-chevrolet-trailering-and-towing-guide.pdf

 

JMHO

No expertise implied or expressed

 

[pewterliftedz]

You're going to be way over payload on that truck with a toy hauler.  I have a 26' travel trailer with 550lb of tongue weight and I'm almost over weight while traveling with my family to state parks.  I have almost 1800lb of payload on my truck.

[OlyMike]

Looks like I will go with the trailer that keeps the tongue weight as low as I can that fits bikes and kids too. Found a nice 19ft toy hauler that sleeps all of us and will hold 4 bikes. Tongue weight is just over 600lbs. May also do a WDH too.

Edited December 30, 2020 by OlyMike
typo

[AlaskaErik]

On 12/28/2020 at 7:48 AM, OlyMike said:

Yes, I know the numbers on my sticker. The point of my question is, if I have a trailer tongue at 895lb unloaded and go over the sticker weight of 930lbs, will it really hurt anything if I go a bit over 930lbs.

The limitation is on the door jamb trailering information sticker.  Don't look to the forum members to validate your going over the established tongue weight limit.  Either you're within the limits or you're not.  Get a 3/4 ton if you want to tow that much.

[bshort]

The marketing gimmick of "half-ton towable" is really just that.  

[Kirk Groenendaal]

On 12/27/2020 at 11:37 PM, OlyMike said:

If the MY RST chassis is capable of towing up to 11,600 with a swap to the gas 5.3L from my 3.0 duramax, does it make much of a difference if I max out the tongue weight or go a bit over it with a trailer? Keep in mind the trailer would still be below the 3.0's reduced tow max of 9300lb, which I've read is reduced due to heat with towing inside the engine compartment with the new 3.0 duramax. 

I ask this because I'm looking at buying a sub 6000lb UVW toy hauler, but some of the tongue weights are floating between 750-1120lbs. One that I like is 920lb, but I'm sure I might go over that with anything added to bedroom area......but I suppose the 800lb in bikes in  the back would reduce some of the nose weight. I've done estimations on a couple of trailers adding bikes, gear, people, food and liquids and would be under the max towing weight. My only concern it tongue weight, but the RST hitch should be able to carry more weight than the 10% listed by GM.

I have this setup now . A 4k max load for the trailer, 500lb tongue wt empty and 900 lbs tongue wt with the 4 wheeler on the trailer. Still in the tow wt range and gvwr but high on the tongue wt. I use a Andersen wt distribution hitch and am going with airbags to keep the truck level. I had a 3/4 ton truck (f250 6.7 diesel) and was over trucked for all conditions and decided to down size to the 1/2 ton with the 3.0. One trip out west each year will be at max load GVWR. All the other use with and without the trailer is far from max limit.  Hope this helps

Happy new Year

Kirk

[OlyMike]

Thank you....the more I read, the more I need to look at a TH trailer to just fit the family with the gear.....nothing fancy. I am finding sub 5000lb TH trailers out there. Shorter than 21ft.