Dyno testing Amsoil against other oils.

[customboss]

9 minutes ago, Atlas said:

Why don't they test oil with the engine in the car, on a track, doing track things (for performance applications). I get the idea behind reducing variability in operator inputs to compare across oils, but how much value does that have when a bench test is so far removed from an actual road test.

Cost and time to do a comparison in a similar engine.  His customers have BEGGED for direct comparisons so he did it with a test engine to limit variables. 

 

Bench tests because of time and cost to form deposits in actual engines. I used to vote at ASTM on standards ( I can't remember anymore because of dementia) and we wanted to level the playing field for BS marketing issues that confused the consumer. 

 

 

[customboss]

12 minutes ago, Atlas said:

Rotella T4 flush? You can't tell me flushing between doesn't influence the next test. Why not flush multiple times with the next oil to be tested? Wouldn't that be a cleaner method?

He did that and any good engine test will do it.  We did that at Cummins R&D. 

[customboss]

14 minutes ago, Atlas said:

I'm sure extrapolating results from a few hours of lab testing is useful, but these oil tests are always some guy on Youtube (doing it for the click/like/comment revenue stream).

 

A SBC is one application. I'm curious about modern applications: With direct injection, EGR, PCV and all the things that absolutely destroy engine oil..

Lake Speed Jr is a former formulator of Joe Gibbs racing lubricants, DRIVEN brand. His father was a NASCAR owner and drive who I knew. 

He doesn't have the training to be a tribologist but is trying to do good testing and he is learning.

 

I saw what he was doing and it was very close to DYSONANALYSIS my 45 year oil analysis company less my training and experience.

 

I wish I had the computer tech background to market my retired biz. I would have been a millionaire. 

 

Lake Jr owns https://www.speediagnostix.com/pages/about-us  a lab source that is lacking and costly but at least he trys.  

 

What we do have in common is a desire to get the consumer to understand chemistry differences and find that chemistry tailored for the consumer need.  

 

THIS SBC Shaver engine is a low tension ring and "soft" flat tappet cam that can accurately determine the ZONE riding formulation to build best balance of TQ/HP, lowest wear, heat dissipation capability, finding the ideal lubricant for the application. Dumbing down the engine with the rings and cam gives great data on a chemistry comparison that happen to correspond to brands.  

 

YES emissions and tech in engines affect our engines, but to test those is expensive, Lake did what he could with what he knew he could control variables with.  

 

Hope that helps. 

 

 

[Chuck FB]

9 hours ago, OnTheReel said:

Depends how they actually perform in your own vehicle and whether or not that even matters to someone. I’d like wear as close to zero so I don’t mind splitting hairs. And my lead foot can expose weaknesses of certain oils very easily. 
 

These bench tests are fun and can be informative. But most people are lazy and just blanket apply their results to every vehicle and every operator. Even something like oil temp is highly variable. I’m on 5w50 RL (5.0 HTHS), I log everything, and I haven’t seen any increase in temp vs any of the other oils I’ve tried in lighter grades. None.

 

The difference he measured between RL and Driven is astounding in comparison. I really don’t see RL 5w30 being too thick for any SBC. But would have been interesting to see him run 5w20 RL instead. Many people actually drop a grade when switching to Red Line so it would be logical.

 

 

I am curious as to why your running a 50 weight oil, is the oil running that hot in your application or is this more one of a reduced wear finding ?. 

 

In saying that and I am making no claims of having tested anything but the theme that Dexos in part has had to play playing with the viscosity within the recognized viscosity grades, its like a dexos 5W-30 themed oil is nearing a 25 grade rather than non dexos formulations or what was typical formulations with a 11.+ up to 12 vis @100c . And the Euro oil still staying with that higher viscosity HTHS 3.5+ and not having played the game. A typical heavy duty diesel rated 40 weight or a Euro is higher than this so called 40 weight dexos or I guess it would be called R rated oil that barely crosses the line into the 40 range. Its almost as if there is a 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 range of oil viscosities on the market as I try to make sense of any of it these days !. 

 

What one of my main thoughts and being the GM truck forum, the GM engine lineup and in this case the gas engines and issues surrounding GDI with intake valve deposit control, being mindful of LSPI although I wonder how touchy the naturally aspirated engines even are to that ? ( the 2.7 turbo being the outlier engine of the group ) and what is the best viscosity and additive formulation that fits with these engines, split into best with more than likely highest price by a fair margin boutique oil to the best choice within the brands that sit on most store shelves easily obtainable at todays typical price point and can even be found on sale. 

 

Are any of these GM engines noted for having sheer issues like what I gather is more prone with lets say the Ford double overhead cam designs and that long long chain ( again the GM 2.7 is that outlier vs the other three Gm engines ). Is a dexos 5W-30 plenty sufficient or looking at GM's own actions by switching to 0W-40 on the 6.2 recall engines, is there an advantage to going to either a Euro 5W-30 or a Dexos or Euro rated 0W-40 and in part to combat a vehicle use that may push the limits of fuel dilution.  

[customboss]

Lake worked for JE Pistons and this same engine was used to test rings and show benefits, weaknesses etc.  This SBC engine at Shaver is perfect for finding distinctions in situ by an engine oil.  Listen to first 4 minutes. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Atlas]

1 hour ago, customboss said:

He did that and any good engine test will do it.  We did that at Cummins R&D. 

 

Doesn't the Rotella influence the results of the next oil, though?

 

Speaking of Cummins... Is 8-10k over a year an OK OCI interval for an L9 using conventional 15w40? I've been a fan of Mobil Delvac for its supposedly higher quality base oil.

 

Although I've enjoyed the L9, the power to weight ratio in my motorhome application is pretty bad. 360hp, 1150 lb-ft, and fully loaded and towing we're about 45k gross combined. That engine gets worked hard.

 

 

1 hour ago, customboss said:

Lake Speed Jr is a former formulator of Joe Gibbs racing lubricants, DRIVEN brand. His father was a NASCAR owner and drive who I knew. 

He doesn't have the training to be a tribologist but is trying to do good testing and he is learning.

 

I saw what he was doing and it was very close to DYSONANALYSIS my 45 year oil analysis company less my training and experience.

 

I wish I had the computer tech background to market my retired biz. I would have been a millionaire. 

 

Lake Jr owns https://www.speediagnostix.com/pages/about-us  a lab source that is lacking and costly but at least he trys.  

 

What we do have in common is a desire to get the consumer to understand chemistry differences and find that chemistry tailored for the consumer need.  

 

THIS SBC Shaver engine is a low tension ring and "soft" flat tappet cam that can accurately determine the ZONE riding formulation to build best balance of TQ/HP, lowest wear, heat dissipation capability, finding the ideal lubricant for the application. Dumbing down the engine with the rings and cam gives great data on a chemistry comparison that happen to correspond to brands.  

 

YES emissions and tech in engines affect our engines, but to test those is expensive, Lake did what he could with what he knew he could control variables with.  

 

Hope that helps. 

 

 

 

Good info. And I'm not saying his test is bad, just that all of these tests leave me with questions regarding methodology and application.

Edited December 7, 2025 by Atlas

[customboss]

6 minutes ago, Atlas said:

Doesn't the Rotella influence the results of the next oil, though?

No because its flushed out after its used as a cleaner. Flushed with the next oil to be tested. They even had to flush Redline more than others because its so OVERTREATED with ADDITIVES it left more residuals and they caught that in dyno and analysis data they did correlating the test. 

 

Even if it did ( and I did not see it in the data)  they used the same flushing oil.  

 

 

Edited December 7, 2025 by customboss

[customboss]

7 minutes ago, Atlas said:

Speaking of Cummins... Is 8-10k over a year an OK OCI interval for an L9 using conventional 15w40? I've been a fan of Mobil Delvac for its supposedly higher quality base oil.

 

Although I've enjoyed the L9, the power to weight ratio in my motorhome application is pretty bad. 360hp, 1150 lb-ft, and fully loaded and towing we're about 45k gross combined. That engine gets worked hard.

What's your oil analysis show for that duration and miles on the RV?  Mobil DELVAC is one the lowest quality base oil versions of HD Oils but it performs well. It does NOT keep clean well.  

 

IF you are burning clean fuel, higher cetane, aren't capturing water in the engine oil from sitting the DELVAC should be fine, its Cummins approved and I tested it back in the day. CK4 and CJ4 15w40. 

 

 

L9 Agreed its a tradeoff engine for your weight. You could turn the boost and injection timing up with a flash from a Cummins if desired. Not terribly expensive and if still in warranty it would be covered until expiration. 

 

ISM would be a better option or ISX if you want to do wheel stands! LOL  

[customboss]

Heres his first test on $5-$10 a quart 5w-30? 

 

Note I can buy Amsoil OE for $7.35 qt as a PREFERRED customer at Amsoil through @Black02Silverado who is a LIFETIME SPONSOR HERE.  Shipped free. 

 

 

 

Edited December 7, 2025 by customboss

[customboss]

perplexity synopsis: 

The linked video is a dyno and used‑oil‑analysis test comparing four 5W‑30 synthetic oils that all meet the same GM dexos1 Gen3/API spec: Amsoil OE, Royal Purple, NAPA full synthetic (Valvoline‑blended), and Walmart Super Tech. In that test, all four oils protected the engine very well, with wear differences so small that price did not predict performance.

Main findings

• All four oils stayed in grade (viscosity remained in the 30‑weight range) and showed very low oxidation and fuel dilution during the high‑temperature dyno test.

• Total wear metals for Amsoil OE, Royal Purple, and Super Tech all increased by roughly the same amount from zero‑hour to end‑of‑test (about a 20‑ppm increase in total wear metals), indicating similar overall wear protection.

• NAPA full synthetic actually showed slightly lower total wear metal increase (about 14 ppm), which the presenter attributes to its higher level of a molybdenum friction‑modifier/anti‑wear additive (MoDTC) in its formulation.

What it means for $5 vs $10 oil

• In a healthy, essentially stock engine, any oil that meets the correct manufacturer spec (here, dexos1 Gen3/API) can provide excellent protection; the “cheap” oils did not show harmful extra wear compared with the expensive ones in this controlled test.

• The cheapest oil in the group (NAPA sale jug, roughly $4 per quart) actually produced the lowest measured wear in that specific engine and test cycle, so paying twice as much per quart did not automatically buy better wear protection.

Practical takeaway for your car

• For normal street use in a stock engine, the priority is: correct viscosity, correct spec (e.g., dexos1 Gen3, API SP, etc.), and regular change intervals; within that, brand and price are secondary.

• If you want to optimize further (for racing, long drains, or a specific engine), used oil analysis on your own engine is the only way to know which oil is the “A‑student” in your particular application, just as shown in the video.

 

 

Customboss comments: None of these oils will DEEP CLEAN so be aware of that. They are all KEEP CLEAN FORMULATIONS.  Emissions loading matter. 

 

 

 

 

[Z45]

Test, no test. I been using AMSOIL since circa 1976 with extended drains and NEVER had a engine issue since, rarely have to add oil between OCI. Saw this story {image below) in 1976 when Mobil 1 was selling in select markets.  Tried to buy some but no where in my area and then stopped for gas at a small station in U.P. of Michigan and they had this new Synthetic oil on display, AMSOIL. Bought a case of 10W-40 and never looked back.  From the point on I NEVER changed oil at 3,000 miles ever again, many times going 15,000 miles in a year.  Never had an engine issue.  Was fun back then po'ing die hard oil changers by not changing my oil at 3,000 miles. 

 

History repeating itself, this was 1976. Back then AMSOIL and Mobil 1 were both claiming 25,000 OCI. But Mobil later dumbed down Mobil to gain market share in the QL industry.

Edited December 7, 2025 by Z45

[Atlas]

1 hour ago, customboss said:

What's your oil analysis show for that duration and miles on the RV?  Mobil DELVAC is one the lowest quality base oil versions of HD Oils but it performs well. It does NOT keep clean well.  

 

IF you are burning clean fuel, higher cetane, aren't capturing water in the engine oil from sitting the DELVAC should be fine, its Cummins approved and I tested it back in the day. CK4 and CJ4 15w40. 

 

 

L9 Agreed its a tradeoff engine for your weight. You could turn the boost and injection timing up with a flash from a Cummins if desired. Not terribly expensive and if still in warranty it would be covered until expiration. 

 

ISM would be a better option or ISX if you want to do wheel stands! LOL  

 

Not trying to distract too much, so this can be a sidebar to the original topic. See?! This is where oil analysis is all over the place. I was led to believe Delvac (specifically, 1300 Super, 15w40) had a better quality base stock and "could" be called a semi-synthetic, even though it's not a true synthetic. I took it with a grain of salt, TBH Delvac and Rotella T4 are about the same price so I've just been using Delvac. Maybe I should switch to Rotella.

 

I won't be modifying the engine at all in this one. Perfectly content to trudge along going up mountain passes, right lane, flashers on, letting the engine/trans do its thing. We pass some semi's, and others blow our doors off. I think the maintenance schedule for OCI for applications (edit: as published by Cummins: is 18 months or 21k miles on conventional CK4 15w40) so felt that we were well within guidelines. To go that long on a drain interval one must use the long life oil filter, else they recommend changing annually, which we do. TBH I Haven't put much faith in oil testing companies but maybe I'll send a sample off after we do our next trip. That will be a total of 5k on the oil and might give an indication of what kind of protection it has left.

Edited December 7, 2025 by Atlas

[OnTheReel]

4 hours ago, Chuck FB said:

 

I am curious as to why your running a 50 weight oil, is the oil running that hot in your application or is this more one of a reduced wear finding ?. 

 

 

This is in a modified 6.2 Hellcat running E85 and higher boost. Measurable wear reductions as I climbed the viscosity ladder. 0w40 is the factory spec, went to 5w40 and now 5w50. Going to try HPL 5w50 next. Should be a little better in cold weather and curious how it’ll compare.

[txab]

4 hours ago, Atlas said:

 

Doesn't the Rotella influence the results of the next oil, though?

 

Speaking of Cummins... Is 8-10k over a year an OK OCI interval for an L9 using conventional 15w40? I've been a fan of Mobil Delvac for its supposedly higher quality base oil.

 

Although I've enjoyed the L9, the power to weight ratio in my motorhome application is pretty bad. 360hp, 1150 lb-ft, and fully loaded and towing we're about 45k gross combined. That engine gets worked hard.

 

 

 

Good info. And I'm not saying his test is bad, just that all of these tests leave me with questions regarding methodology and application.

He flushes the previous test oil with the Rotella. Then flushes with the next test oil. The the final fill with the test oil. Perform testing. Wash, rinse and repeat

[Atlas]

11 minutes ago, txab said:

He flushes the previous test oil with the Rotella. Then flushes with the next test oil. The the final fill with the test oil. Perform testing. Wash, rinse and repeat

 

I missed the part about the also-flush with the test oil. I was perhaps listening with one ear open while I did other things.