Dyno testing Amsoil against other oils.

[customboss]

3 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

 

It varies a bit by grade but the test I run agree with Lake. Oxidation still showing lots of POE. 5W30 at 100 and my most recent 5W40 over 60. The 0W40 is near 120 as is the 0W20 still. If your going to say it isn't an indicator then ask Lake why he can estimate content by oxidation? 

 

Yes it has changed over the years. Most recent MSDS <14.9% light distillate. The carrier oil for the add package. Remainder is still 30% or more POE and balance PAO. As of Feb this year. 

 

Pay attention to the most recent additive packages. Lower TBN's, More Mg and less Ca. Less Moly. More Boron. Lower loads of Phos and Zinc as limited by ACEA A3/B4. The oil is changing, your brain is stuck. Every few months they add a new LSPI friendly grade to the HP line. You want a DEXOS oil with a Red Line label. Use the Black bottle Professional series. 

Add the double talk he did. Tossing out the first few dyno power pulls after showing more area UNDER THE CURVE with the Red Line until purged from the motor and multiple power passes. He can't have it both ways. 

 

Nothing in my real world experience is agreeing with this testing. Temperatures I have show MULTIPLE times to be substantially lower. Never used an oil that runs cleaner. Shown that over the life of my projects. Have also shown failure, something the rest don't like to show, using cheap but licensed oils. 

 

Something I agree with from the Engineering Explained guy is, "You can find a study to support every position". 

 

In no world, under those base conditions is RL running 100F over temperature for the reason of additive overloading. Something is amiss and you friend are starting to disappoint me by not questioning that yourself. 

 

Increased wear was the result of high temp causing low location viscosity and not additive failures. it's why GM tells Camaro owners to VIS UP on track day. That test is ridiculous. But you want to believe it, fine by me. 

 

 

I am asking why it’s 100F higher. Oxidation is NOT a way to determine base oils except for internet dudes. GCMS is what I used. 

 

[Black02Silverado]

7 hours ago, customboss said:

How will you control environmental variables? Test driver variables? Fuel? 

By only driving when the weather is the same and keep rpm’s the same though out the rest. As for fuel I would purchase 2,500 gallons in the beginning and keep it in an underground tank. Like I said, this would be expensive. 
 

 

 

Joking, no way to do that, well other than purchasing the fuel.

[customboss]

On 12/7/2025 at 2:39 PM, txab said:

Easy to do. I like the Rotella T6, you can catch it on sale or with rebates and get it very economically. full synthetic

Shell Rotella uses calcium salicylate-based detergent additives as a key component in its formulation, which is a distinctive feature compared to many other heavy-duty engine oils. These salicylate additives serve multiple functions, including:

• Detergency: Helping to keep engine components clean by preventing deposit formation.

• Anti-wear protection: Contributing to the overall wear resistance of the oil.

• Corrosion inhibition: Neutralizing acids formed during combustion and oil aging.

• Antioxidant properties: Enhancing oxidation stability, which improves oil life under high-temperature conditions.

While other oils may use traditional detergents like sulfonates or phenates, Shell’s use of overbased calcium salicylate technology—especially in its synthetic and synthetic-blend Rotella T6 and T5 lines—is considered a proprietary advancement. This formulation supports Shell’s "Triple Protection" and "Energized Protection" claims, offering enhanced performance in wear protection, deposit control, and oil durability.

Although salicylate additives are not exclusive to Shell across the entire lubricant industry, their specific integration into Rotella’s additive package, combined with synthetic base oils, represents a unique performance advantage tailored for modern low-emission diesel engines and severe operating conditions.

Shell RotellaBrand of diesel engine oil lubricants

Wikipediarotella.shell.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Shell Rotella additive technology

 

Copy

 

 

 

[customboss]

2 minutes ago, Black02Silverado said:

By only driving when the weather is the same and keep rpm’s the same though out the rest. As for fuel I would purchase 2,500 gallons in the beginning and keep it in an underground tank. Like I said, this would be expensive. 
 

 

 

Joking, no way to do that, well other than purchasing the fuel.

I proctored on road HDD truck tests for FP fuel additive back in 2000 ish and it was done through Southwest Research Institute in San Antonio and it was a frigging nightmare.  It was required as getting DO NO HARM by EPA and we passed but TOO MANY VARIABLES except same Semi trucks same weight, same route.  

[customboss]

On 12/6/2025 at 3:09 PM, OnTheReel said:

Red Line temperature is a weird one. Viscosity and HTHS is highest but Driven is very close in both specs and did best. COF difference?

When evaluating the temperature delta between oil and water, the video highlights a few key observations (25:40-25:45

• Red Line: Ran the hottest, with the oil temperature approximately 100°F hotter than the water temperature (25:47-25:52). This was linked to its higher base oil viscosity (26:06-26:23).
• Pennzoil Ultra Platinum: Ran next, with about a 90°F split between the water and oil temperature (25:55-26:04). This difference was also attributed to its base oil viscosity being on the lower side of the 30-grade range (26:13-26:17).
• Most other oils: Fell into a range of around 87-89°F split (26:50-27:00).
• Driven LS30: Was the coolest running oil of the entire group (27:07-27:12). This is because its base oil viscosity and overall formulation were designed for high-performance engines where oil temperature is critical (27:16-27:30).

  When evaluating the temperature delta between oil and water, the video highlights a few key observations (25:40-25:45):

  Red Line: Ran the hottest, with the oil temperature approximately 100°F hotter than the water temperature (25:47-25:52). This was linked to its higher base oil viscosity (26:06-26:23).

  Pennzoil Ultra Platinum: Ran next, with about a 90°F split between the water and oil temperature (25:55-26:04). This difference was also attributed to its base oil viscosity being on the lower side of the 30-grade range (26:13-26:17).

  Most other oils: Fell into a range of around 87-89°F split (26:50-27:00).

  Driven LS30: Was the coolest running oil of the entire group (27:07-27:12). This is because its base oil viscosity and overall formulation were designed for high-performance engines where oil temperature is critical (27:16-27:30).

So Redline 100F higher than coolant temp for clarification.  If there was a question. 

Edited December 9, 2025 by customboss

[OnTheReel]

1 hour ago, customboss said:

When evaluating the temperature delta between oil and water, the video highlights a few key observations (25:40-25:45

• Red Line: Ran the hottest, with the oil temperature approximately 100°F hotter than the water temperature (25:47-25:52). This was linked to its higher base oil viscosity (26:06-26:23).
• Pennzoil Ultra Platinum: Ran next, with about a 90°F split between the water and oil temperature (25:55-26:04). This difference was also attributed to its base oil viscosity being on the lower side of the 30-grade range (26:13-26:17).
• Most other oils: Fell into a range of around 87-89°F split (26:50-27:00).
• Driven LS30: Was the coolest running oil of the entire group (27:07-27:12). This is because its base oil viscosity and overall formulation were designed for high-performance engines where oil temperature is critical (27:16-27:30).

  When evaluating the temperature delta between oil and water, the video highlights a few key observations (25:40-25:45):

  Red Line: Ran the hottest, with the oil temperature approximately 100°F hotter than the water temperature (25:47-25:52). This was linked to its higher base oil viscosity (26:06-26:23).

  Pennzoil Ultra Platinum: Ran next, with about a 90°F split between the water and oil temperature (25:55-26:04). This difference was also attributed to its base oil viscosity being on the lower side of the 30-grade range (26:13-26:17).

  Most other oils: Fell into a range of around 87-89°F split (26:50-27:00).

  Driven LS30: Was the coolest running oil of the entire group (27:07-27:12). This is because its base oil viscosity and overall formulation were designed for high-performance engines where oil temperature is critical (27:16-27:30).

So Redline 100F higher than coolant temp for clarification.  If there was a question. 

Plenty of questions but unfortunately none that you’re answering there.
 

Figures don’t lie, but liars figure…

[Grumpy Bear]

4 hours ago, customboss said:

I am asking why it’s 100F higher. Oxidation is NOT a way to determine base oils except for internet dudes. GCMS is what I used. 

 

 

So Lake is just another dumb Internet dude but his video is gospel? Except the parts you disagree with?  How do you keep it straight? (Rhetorical question) 

 

 2 cSt of viscosity did not generate 100 F in oil temperature. If it would, then Driven LS would also be 100 F higher but it was the coolest of the bunch. Now your going to switch arguments to the add package but a comparison will show that a lame duck as well.  

 

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/red-line-euro-5w30-voa-01-27-2022.367218/ there is a correlation between oxidation and POE content. You will say the ROC is bogus as well or the lab they use is incompetent.  Or the sample is to old or...or...or Lake is incompetent even though he shares your certifications, licenses and business platform. 

 

 

 

10 minutes ago, OnTheReel said:

Plenty of questions but unfortunately none that you’re answering there.
 

Figures don’t lie, but liars figure…

 

  Nope, no answers.  Just allot of double talk.

 

Round and round the Mulberry bush, the monkey chased the weasel..... 

 

I haven't found an expert I agree with on every detail either. Lee is not unique there. But I'm not embarrassed to admit I have huge holes in my understanding of just about every topic of knowledge either. I'm also not stupid enough to reject what my labs, my eyes and my instruments and the education I use to interpret them are telling me in real time either. 

 

****************************************

 

 

I seem to NEVER get all the information required and NEVER get it soon enough to be useful. But I ALWAYS get it time to do it over. I NEVER run out of advice to stop believing my eyes; my labs and my experience and education. All I've ever really gotten from really smart people is their contempt. Contempt isn't useful in selecting knowledge, products and services or friends and yet they seem surprised in my response. How smart is that? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[customboss]

Wow. Both of you are odd fellows. I’m not promoting anything. I’m not demeaning either of you. I just posted a solid engine test. Make of it what you will. 
 

Ive observed a constant among the internet crowd. When someone is a professional in a subject, comes to sites like this one, shares knowledge and experience that might counter the internet crowd they seem to demonstrate  an inferiority complex. @KARNUT one of the worst. @Grumpy Bear bounces in and out of it and sadly now @OnTheReel

Edited December 9, 2025 by customboss

[OnTheReel]

56 minutes ago, customboss said:

Wow. Both of you are odd fellows. I’m not promoting anything. I’m not demeaning either of you. I just posted a solid engine test. Make of it what you will. 
 

Ive observed a constant among the internet crowd. When someone is a professional in a subject, comes to sites like this one, shares knowledge and experience that might counter the internet crowd they seem to demonstrate  an inferiority complex. @KARNUT one of the worst. @Grumpy Bear bounces in and out of it and sadly now @OnTheReel

Nothing has changed for me. I was first to respond and I've been asking the same questions since you posted this thread.
 

Your responses oscillate between being a professional with your own opinion, and just being the messenger quoting from the video without any critical thought. So you wind up with contradictory posts like your last one. Not trying to beat you up over it, I value your input…

[KARNUT]

1 hour ago, customboss said:

Wow. Both of you are odd fellows. I’m not promoting anything. I’m not demeaning either of you. I just posted a solid engine test. Make of it what you will. 
 

Ive observed a constant among the internet crowd. When someone is a professional in a subject, comes to sites like this one, shares knowledge and experience that might counter the internet crowd they seem to demonstrate  an inferiority complex. @KARNUT one of the worst. @Grumpy Bear bounces in and out of it and sadly now @OnTheReel

You must be off your meds. The only I thing I can think of that I disagree you with is politics. Of which of course you’re wrong with. That fact will continue to be proven. The oil thing. The only time I really cared was with Amsoil. It saved us many thousands. I know it. I don’t need to beat it to death. I don’t care who believes me. I can only relate my experience. I don’t need additional tests. I lived the results. I have nothing more to add on this subject and Im don’t with it. I don’t feel inferior about anything. Never did.

[Atlas]

It's a joke, guys...

 

Spoiler

So, it's solved, then? Quaker State 5w30 is the best, and I ain't hearin' anything else!!! 

 

Edited December 9, 2025 by Atlas

[customboss]

36 minutes ago, Atlas said:

It's a joke, guys...

 

  Hide contents

So, it's solved, then? Quaker State 5w30 is the best, and I ain't hearin' anything else!!! 

 

Actually….. for wear control and shorter drains it is! 

[txab]

I use Beef Tallow. It's Gluten free, environmentally friendly. For oil  filtration I use Members mark toilet paper rolls dropped into a specially designed canister. 

 

 

 

 

 

This has been a good discussion with lots of thought provoking going on

[Grumpy Bear]

OntheStribeckcurve.pdf

 

Recent Developments in Wear Prevention, Friction and Lubrication, 2010: 263-278
ISBN: 978-81-308-0377-7 Editor: George K. Nikas
7. On the Stribeck curve
Michael M. Khonsari and E. Richard Booser
Dow Chemical Endowed Chair in Rotating Machinery, Louisiana State University,
Department of Mechanical Engineering, Baton Rouge, LA 70803, USA;
Engineering Consultant, Vero Beach, FL 32966, USA

 

This paper is hands down he best work I've yet to read. It's a long read, sixteen pages, and there is a ton of difficult math imbedded but as daunting as that seems, it isn't. The read is easy and quite understandable. 

 

This is what "Useful, Reliable, Accurate Information" easy to understand looks like.

 

I am grateful to the authors to learn I have an very accurate understanding. I hope the most interested among us will enjoy this read as much as I did. 

[Grumpy Bear]

Why so hot?

 

 

Did we miss the use of a specific break in oil? HUGE ZDP levels. Enough to cause allot of friction and it doesn't go away quickly. It isn't because Red Line has SL levels of ZDP (1100-1250 ppm) but because the break in oil has TWICE that much and takes longer than one may think to wear off. Looks like it lingered for the first two samples and two flushing sequences, tapering off in only a few hours running. 2 hours test and 20/30 minute flushes. 

 

This motor may indeed have 7,000 dyno pulls on it but it also has seen allot of rebuilds and gets this break-in with each new cam and or ring package.