6.0 gas engine

[TRKLGND]

 

 
Also have the Alaskan, slight lift/level and otherwise stock.  Just completed 3100 miles in 15 days through the rockies and back.  Combination of highway and city and all kinds of weather.  19.5 works out to about 12mpg.  If I wanted fuel mileage we could have taken my wifes dodge dart.  But I wanted the convenience and safety of my truck on the highways.  

I've been running E85 for several weeks now. It's been about 90 cents cheaper than regular unleaded. In my truck, 61 cents is the break even point. If E85 is more than 61 cents less than regular unleaded it's worth it for me to burn it. Anyway, I'm getting about 8mpg. Have to fill up more often but that's about it. Runs fine, starts fine.

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[Bhurt]

5 hours ago, paracutin said:

I've been running E85 for several weeks now. It's been about 90 cents cheaper than regular unleaded. In my truck, 61 cents is the break even point. If E85 is more than 61 cents less than regular unleaded it's worth it for me to burn it. Anyway, I'm getting about 8mpg. Have to fill up more often but that's about it. Runs fine, starts fine.

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We don’t have the E85 up here. I’m paying about $1.07/litre here for regular 87 octane. so that’s about $3.50 a gallon US roughly I think. 

[SierraHD17]

1 hour ago, Bhurt said:

We don’t have the E85 up here. I’m paying about $1.07/litre here for regular 87 octane. so that’s about $3.50 a gallon US roughly I think. 

$4.05 a gallon.  94 premium that I run is $4.84 a gallon lol.

[TRKLGND]

We don’t have the E85 up here. I’m paying about $1.07/litre here for regular 87 octane. so that’s about $3.50 a gallon US roughly I think. 

Ouch. Regular unleaded is about $2.50/gal in Central Illinois. E85 is running $1.70/gal.
Im not a big fan of E85. I don't think we should be making fuel from our feed stock (corn) but I can't stop it and if my taxes are supplementing it I might as well take advantage of it.

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[TRKLGND]

$4.05 a gallon.  94 premium that I run is $4.84 a gallon lol.

Why do you run premium? With only 9.7:1 compression ratio I'm not sure what the benefits are.

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[4x4Pete]

I get between 12 and 14 mpg as long as  I don't push it or remote start too much.  I use premium in the summer as I feel that the truck runs better, and smoother. I don't know why but it does.  Come the winter though with the  longer remote starts and regular gas the mileage drops to about 10 or 11 mpg.  It's hard but I'd rather have this 6.0 than a DI 6.2 , reliability plays a big role for me with my vehicles and tools.  More power would be nice but not at the expense of reliability.  Sometimes like good tools reliability isn't necessarily the most efficient. 

[SierraHD17]

1 hour ago, paracutin said:

Why do you run premium? With only 9.7:1 compression ratio I'm not sure what the benefits are.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

30 degrees of ignition timing over the stock tunes pathetic 15 or so lol.  Premium won't do diddly squat for the truck with Gms tuning tables.  

[Cowpie]

On 1/6/2018 at 3:20 PM, paracutin said:

Ouch. Regular unleaded is about $2.50/gal in Central Illinois. E85 is running $1.70/gal.
Im not a big fan of E85. I don't think we should be making fuel from our feed stock (corn) but I can't stop it and if my taxes are supplementing it I might as well take advantage of it.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

Wow, how misconceptions just linger long after they are dead.    All subsidies to the ethanol industry were eliminated at the end of 2011, at the behest of the ethanol folks themselves!   There is not a single dime of taxpayer money going to the ethanol industry.  And of the entire U.S. corn production, less than 20% is used for human consumption.... worldwide.   Of the 80% that is left, it is for animal consumption, ethanol production, plastics production, etc.  And of the Ethanol production, only the starches from the kernel is used and rest is returned back to the feed supply system as high protein, highly digestible feed supplements for poultry and livestock.  Dried Distillers Grain (DDG), the resultant product from ethanol production is highly in demand, big time.  Even the Vietnamese sent a delegation to the Iowa to negotiate trade agreements to get their hands on more of the stuff for increasing their country's animal production.  

 

Now to be a little fair, there are some subsidies to retailers to put in ethanol blender pumps are some retail locations, but that is NOT the ethanol industry.  That is retail fuel station concerns.  

 

Corn is used for a variety of purposes than come from ethanol production.   Spark plug insulators are made from corn derived components for one.  Various components used in pharmaceutical production as well.  Various plastics are also derived in the same way.   Ever get a chance, check out places like the Blair, NE biofuels refinery plant.   And, surprisingly, many ethanol production facilities use no more water to produce ethanol than a petroleum refinery does to make petroleum derived products.   Nothing is wasted.  Every part of a kernel of corn that goes into a ethanol plant is used for some purpose and much of it returns to the food supply.  For every bushel of corn that goes in, 17-18 lb of it returns to the food supply.

[Bhurt]

Thats alot of interesting information.  I don't even know if anywhere in Canada offers E85.  My trip to the west coast I didn't see anyone who was selling it so I have my doubts... That being said a road trip to the States just became a lot more affordable.  

 

Is there any noticeable change in performance between the E85 and regular?

[SierraHD17]

E85 is sold at one station somewhere in vancouver and that's it for western Canada anyhow.  I can get drums of it but I would rather get a drum of unleaded 110 gas and blend it making my own swish for my performance stuff.

 

If GM adds any amount of timing it should help a bit for power... but I will never run the stuff so I can't really say.  I didn't even look at the alcohol multipliers in the tune haha.

[redwngr]

The mat be no direct subsidy, but in some jurisdictions ethanol is taxed at a lower rate than gasoline -- to encourage use. 

Not a direct subsidy, but because it is preferential treatment vs oil. 

 

 

There is also a mandated blend/usage requirement for ethanol.  In the US this is through the RFS -Renewable Usage Standard.

 

lots to read here:

https://www.afdc.energy.gov/laws/RFS

 

cut and paste of part of it:

Renewable Fuel Standard
RFS Volumes by Year

Enlarge illustration

 

The Renewable Fuel Standard (RFS) is a federal program that requires transportation fuel sold in the United States to contain a minimum volume of renewable fuels.

 

The RFS originated with the Energy Policy Act of 2005 and was expanded and extended by the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007 (EISA). The RFS requires renewable fuel to be blended into transportation fuel in increasing amounts each year, escalating to 36 billion gallons by 2022. Each renewable fuel category in the RFS program must emit lower levels of greenhouse gases (GHGs) relative to the petroleum fuel it replaces.

RFS Requirements

 

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) administers the RFS program and establishes the volume requirements for each category based on EISA-legislated volumes and fuel availability. EPA tracks compliance through the Renewable Identification Number (RIN) system, which assigns a RIN to each gallon of renewable fuel.

 

Entities regulated by RFS include oil refiners and gasoline and diesel importers. The volumes required of each obligated party are based on a percentage of its petroleum product sales. Obligated parties can meet their renewable volume obligations (RVOs) by either selling required biofuels volumes or purchasing RINs from parties that exceed their requirements. Failure to meet requirements results in a significant fine. Details of the program are available on EPA's RFS website.

 

Renewable Fuels Categories

 

Each year, the RFS program requires the sale of specified volumes of renewable fuels according to the categories below. EISA established life cycle GHG emissions thresholds for each category, requiring a percentage improvement relative to the emissions baseline of the gasoline and diesel they replace.

 

Conventional Biofuel: Any fuel derived from starch feedstocks (e.g., corn and grain sorghum). Conventional biofuels produced in plants built after 2007 must demonstrate a 20% reduction in life cycle GHG emissions.

 

Advanced Biofuel: Any fuel derived from cellulosic or advanced feedstocks. This may include sugarcane or sugar beet-based fuels; biodiesel made from vegetable oil or waste grease; renewable diesel co-processed with petroleum; and other biofuels that may exist in the future. Nested within advanced biofuels are two sub-categories: cellulosic biofuel and biomass-based diesel. Both biomass-based diesel and cellulosic biofuel that exceed volumes in their respective categories may be used to meet this category. Fuels in this category must demonstrate a life cycle GHG emissions reduction of 50%.

 

Biomass-Based Diesel: A diesel fuel substitute made from renewable feedstocks, including biodiesel and nonester renewable diesel. Fuels in this category must demonstrate a life cycle GHG emissions reduction of 50%.

 

Cellulosic Biofuel: Any fuel derived from cellulose, hemicellulose, or lignin—nonfood-based renewable feedstocks. Fuels in this category must demonstrate a life cycle GHG emissions reduction of at least 60%.

 

 

 

[sdeeter19555]

E85 is sold at one station somewhere in vancouver and that's it for western Canada anyhow.  I can get drums of it but I would rather get a drum of unleaded 110 gas and blend it making my own swish for my performance stuff.
 
If GM adds any amount of timing it should help a bit for power... but I will never run the stuff so I can't really say.  I didn't even look at the alcohol multipliers in the tune haha.

I run e85 for the same reason I run 93: it runs better in my 6.0l than 87.

Steve
2012 2500hd

[sdeeter19555]

The mat be no direct subsidy, but in some jurisdictions ethanol is taxed at a lower rate than gasoline -- to encourage use. 
Not a direct subsidy, but because it is preferential treatment vs oil. 
 
 
There is also a mandated blend/usage requirement for ethanol.  In the US this is through the RFS -Renewable Usage Standard.
 
lots to read here:
https://www.afdc.energy.gov/laws/RFS
 
cut and paste of part of it:
Renewable Fuel Standard
RFS Volumes by Year
Enlarge illustration
 
The Renewable Fuel Standard (RFS) is a federal program that requires transportation fuel sold in the United States to contain a minimum volume of renewable fuels.
 
The RFS originated with the Energy Policy Act of 2005 and was expanded and extended by the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007 (EISA). The RFS requires renewable fuel to be blended into transportation fuel in increasing amounts each year, escalating to 36 billion gallons by 2022. Each renewable fuel category in the RFS program must emit lower levels of greenhouse gases (GHGs) relative to the petroleum fuel it replaces.
RFS Requirements
 
The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) administers the RFS program and establishes the volume requirements for each category based on EISA-legislated volumes and fuel availability. EPA tracks compliance through the Renewable Identification Number (RIN) system, which assigns a RIN to each gallon of renewable fuel.
 
Entities regulated by RFS include oil refiners and gasoline and diesel importers. The volumes required of each obligated party are based on a percentage of its petroleum product sales. Obligated parties can meet their renewable volume obligations (RVOs) by either selling required biofuels volumes or purchasing RINs from parties that exceed their requirements. Failure to meet requirements results in a significant fine. Details of the program are available on EPA's RFS website.
 
Renewable Fuels Categories
 
Each year, the RFS program requires the sale of specified volumes of renewable fuels according to the categories below. EISA established life cycle GHG emissions thresholds for each category, requiring a percentage improvement relative to the emissions baseline of the gasoline and diesel they replace.
 
Conventional Biofuel: Any fuel derived from starch feedstocks (e.g., corn and grain sorghum). Conventional biofuels produced in plants built after 2007 must demonstrate a 20% reduction in life cycle GHG emissions.
 
Advanced Biofuel: Any fuel derived from cellulosic or advanced feedstocks. This may include sugarcane or sugar beet-based fuels; biodiesel made from vegetable oil or waste grease; renewable diesel co-processed with petroleum; and other biofuels that may exist in the future. Nested within advanced biofuels are two sub-categories: cellulosic biofuel and biomass-based diesel. Both biomass-based diesel and cellulosic biofuel that exceed volumes in their respective categories may be used to meet this category. Fuels in this category must demonstrate a life cycle GHG emissions reduction of 50%.
 
Biomass-Based Diesel: A diesel fuel substitute made from renewable feedstocks, including biodiesel and nonester renewable diesel. Fuels in this category must demonstrate a life cycle GHG emissions reduction of 50%.
 
Cellulosic Biofuel: Any fuel derived from cellulose, hemicellulose, or lignin—nonfood-based renewable feedstocks. Fuels in this category must demonstrate a life cycle GHG emissions reduction of at least 60%.
 
 
 

Forcing its use is to reduce emissions and dependency, it is classic "regulation forcing technology" mentality of EPA.

Steve
2012 2500hd

[TRKLGND]

6 hours ago, Cowpie said:

Wow, how misconceptions just linger long after they are dead.    All subsidies to the ethanol industry were eliminated at the end of 2011, at the behest of the ethanol folks themselves!   There is not a single dime of taxpayer money going to the ethanol industry.  And of the entire U.S. corn production, less than 20% is used for human consumption.... worldwide.   Of the 80% that is left, it is for animal consumption, ethanol production, plastics production, etc.  And of the Ethanol production, only the starches from the kernel is used and rest is returned back to the feed supply system as high protein, highly digestible feed supplements for poultry and livestock.  Dried Distillers Grain (DDG), the resultant product from ethanol production is highly in demand, big time.  Even the Vietnamese sent a delegation to the Iowa to negotiate trade agreements to get their hands on more of the stuff for increasing their country's animal production.  

 

Now to be a little fair, there are some subsidies to retailers to put in ethanol blender pumps are some retail locations, but that is NOT the ethanol industry.  That is retail fuel station concerns.  

 

Corn is used for a variety of purposes than come from ethanol production.   Spark plug insulators are made from corn derived components for one.  Various components used in pharmaceutical production as well.  Various plastics are also derived in the same way.   Ever get a chance, check out places like the Blair, NE biofuels refinery plant.   And, surprisingly, many ethanol production facilities use no more water to produce ethanol than a petroleum refinery does to make petroleum derived products.   Nothing is wasted.  Every part of a kernel of corn that goes into a ethanol plant is used for some purpose and much of it returns to the food supply.  For every bushel of corn that goes in, 17-18 lb of it returns to the food supply.

There is a lot of good info provided here.  Can you provide links to your sources?  I'd like to learn more.
 

From my perspective,  human consumption includes animal feed and edible plastics.  We "consume" those items.  Having approximately 33% of grain used to make ethanol returned to the food supply chain is a good thing.
 

As for subsidies, hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars are still being spent to subsidize ethanol and other bio-fuels.  While the majority are no longer being paid to the "industry" directly, we, as taxpayers, are still supporting bio-fuels.  Same goes for wind and solar, if the market can't or won't support it then it's not ready for prime time and there is more work to be done to make it profitable. 

https://www.taxpayer.net/energy-natural-resources/federal-subsidies-for-corn-ethanol-and-other-corn-based-biofuels/

 

Other uses for corn ethanol bi-products... 

Spark plug insulators are made primarily from ceramic and the formulas are proprietary.  I have found evidence where the insulator molds are made from a corn based material but not the insulators themselves. 

http://www.madehow.com/Volume-1/Spark-Plug.html

[TRKLGND]

One more thing to add.

I run E85 because, for me, it makes financial sense.  

I have not noticed any difference in performance between E85 and E10 (reg unleaded).  Your results may be different.

Further, I checked with the guys at black bear performance regarding a tune for my truck.  They have tunes for unleaded but not E85.  I was told that the 6.0L doesn't have enough compression to benefit from running their tunes with E85.