Oil change intervals

[Supreme Pizza]

Obviously the oil topic is endless, but rather than gambling with expensive 7K, 10K,15K or 20K oil changes, why not just use Supertech synthetic oil every 3K miles for $13 a pop? Its way cheaper in the long run, and guarantees success. Why roll the dice on a $70, 20K mile oil change?  For the same price, you can change your synthetic oil 7 times, for the same money. 

 

 

 

[swathdiver]

17 hours ago, Doublebase said:

I do take advantage of the yearly Mobil 1 rebate program they have every spring (although I missed it this year). If I remember ....receive $11 dollars off a five quart jug of Mobil 1 synthetic. So I'd buy six of them at Walmart on sale for $22 a jug ($132) and receive a check from Mobil 1 for $66...ends up being $2.20 a quart for Mobil 1. Unbelievable bargain. 

We bought 3 one gallon bottles of Mobil One and Mobil oil plus an extended life filter and got back $29 taking advantage of the various rebates they offered this spring.  

[Doublebase]

6 hours ago, swathdiver said:

We bought 3 one gallon bottles of Mobil One and Mobil oil plus an extended life filter and got back $29 taking advantage of the various rebates they offered this spring.  

I'm pissed at myself for missing it this year...all well, that's what I get for not paying attention. 

 

I'm still in the "free" oil change faze (2 freebies from the manufacturer). I did my own oil change at 1,300 miles, then I took it to the dealer at 4,300 miles. I can't stand taking it to the dealer - I sat there for an hour and a half - at some point your own time is worth more than a free oil change. I'll be doing the next one myself using Mobil 1. I'll probably use my last free oil change in the dead of winter when I don't want to crawl under it. I'll be doing 5,000 mile intervals, I'm at 8,000 miles already in three months.

[Supreme Pizza]

2 hours ago, Doublebase said:

I'm pissed at myself for missing it this year...all well, that's what I get for not paying attention. 

 

I'm still in the "free" oil change faze (2 freebies from the manufacturer). I did my own oil change at 1,300 miles, then I took it to the dealer at 4,300 miles. I can't stand taking it to the dealer - I sat there for an hour and a half - at some point your own time is worth more than a free oil change. I'll be doing the next one myself using Mobil 1. I'll probably use my last free oil change in the dead of winter when I don't want to crawl under it. I'll be doing 5,000 mile intervals, I'm at 8,000 miles already in three months.

 

 

 

 

Yep, sitting at the dealer sucks. I needed 2 recall items taken care of (free repair). I called and made an appointment. I was told it would take an hour total to fix both items. I was there for 4 hours, and they only addressed 1 of the items. They said they have to close now, but that I can bring the vehicle back another time if I would like. I was not happy. 

[ChristopherDB]

Apparently the oil percentage is nothing more than the percentage of remaining miles out of 7500 miles. No special algorithm based on RPMs, throttle position, runtime hours, etc. We've been duped.

 

Went to 1% at 7420 miles. Goes down 1% every 75 miles. I would have been at 7495 when it went to 0%.

 

[Cowpie]

On 7/10/2018 at 2:12 AM, Grumpy Bear said:

 

Form that same link: and as Paul Harvey would say. "Now for the rest of the story"  

 

Quote: "0W-20 and 0W-30 engine oils, with their extremely low temperature performance requirements, will continue to be dominated by PAO-base fluids for the next few years. (bet it's longer than that unless they find a way to defy hydrocarbon physics) And what is the current trend in OEM specs for viscosity? 

 

From that post the only example where they were offering a VI advantage was at 4.3 cSt at 100 C. That is the 100C viscosity minimum for a 10W. Not happing any time soon. What was that number? 123? 

 

You can make an argument from cherry picked information. You just can't run an engine on it. Shall I continue?

 

There's a reason they said 'can' and not DOES or WILL. My grand-pappy use to say, "Every really good lie is 90% true"!  Mom said, "IF (can) frogs had wings they wouldn't bump there butt when they jump". 

 

I'm not picking on you sir. Liars are good at their professions. If they can't trick an informed guy they won't have a job long. 

 

Oh, love this one: Consequently, they ( severely processed Group III) have exceptional purity with aromatics levels of much less than one percent, resulting in high thermal and oxidative stability. On the other hand, PAO stability depends largely on residual olefin content, which can be present at significant levels - up to five percent. There's that Can word again. 

 

So the point is that if I compare the WORST PAO to the BEST Group III the group III wins? No, tell me it isn't so! 

 

Oxidation test benefits were only valid in turbine oils with specific add packs. REALLY?  The test in part were run on Hydraulic Oils? Because? Because any advantage is in stocks with 100 C viscosities below 4.3 cSt. Jack oil. 

 

Words say Group III exceeds Group IV n NOACK and yet the graph show otherwise. Should have left that graph out I guess.  

 

By this report Exxon/Mobil, the largest producer of PAO, should be shutting down all it's PAO operations. Anyone find it funny that the one who started the PAO rally quietly withdrew that material from the 'brand' that made it's name on it's back? Thank you Castrol. Well they are not; so bean counters being what they are???? Yea this is drivel. They pulled out because the lower group oil was cheaper. Thing is with the two additional refinery steps to get close to a PAO the cost is going to be greater than a PAO. This is long term recon at it's best. 

 

There are several improvement statements made comparing the "severely processed Group III" to 'conventional synthetics' and even some more refined Group II stocks. What is a conventional synthetic?  Non-severely processed ? Note the date on one charts base oil 1923!! Well I hope so. C'mon man. 

 

Okay, okay....

 

So we need a new use for PAO's. How about blends with NP Esters? Wait!!!! Red Line?? Redline is not on the list of oils at PQIA. In fact I can't find a single Ester listed there. Why is that? How about VI's in clouds and NOACK a fraction of the 10W Group III's without major loads of any viscosity improvers nor solubility issues. 

 

Red LIne 0W20 VI is 172!  Noack is 9%! Pour point is -60 C - 76 F.  100C 9.1 cSt. 40 C 48 cSt. CCS 55 Poise at -35C (that's a mind numbing number). 

 

Group III numbers at any processing level are not even in the same zip code. 

 

 

That Redliine CCS is not a number derived from the industry standard ATSM D5293 cold crank simulator testing protocol. It really means little in terms of comparison.   A 172 VI is nice but many other oils have VI's in that range.   Pour point is good, but it is the CCS that really is more important.  And without showing the ASTM D5293 testing number of that CCS, "mind numbing"  is purely subjective.

 

And the "dirty little secret" that doesn't get told by the predominately PAO only oil folks is that it isn't only PAO.  PAO has problems with keeping additives in suspension.  A fact well recognized.  That is why they are not PAO only motor oils even when they claim they are.  And considering that any motor oil is up to 20% additive package, keeping it in suspension is paramount.  

 

But lets take a look at NOACK numbers.   A Pennzoil conventional 10w30 has a  lower NOACK than most any full blown synthetic (including primarily PAO) around of the same viscosity. The Petroleum Quality Institute of America randomly tests various oils off the shelf to see what they are comprised of and if they meet the standards they claim.  The Pennzoil conventional 10w30 came in with a  NOACK of 4.4.   PQIA didn't believe it so they rechecked.  It came in at 4.2 on that check.  Some have speculated that the base stock is primarily the newer NG to liquid base oil, but no one is sure.  And GTL base oils are considered a Group III.  What is fascinating is that PAO's are sourced from the ethylene gas that is primarily derived from natural gas.   So the GTL group III base stocks might be very similar to PAO's in several ways, and a heck of a lot cheaper to make.    And the Pennzoil conventional 10w30 far exceeds Dexos1 oil standards by a comfortable margin.

 

And the add pack is what really makes a good motor oil.  Base stock is just the starting point.  But even the best base stock will grenade a motor if it doesn't have the proper add pack in it.  Folks get all hopped up over base stock when it is the add pack they should really focus on.  And that information can be found if one takes the time to look.  One can also find out some of it by just getting an oil they are considering using and send in a virgin oil sample to one of those $25 testing sites like Blackstone, Polaris, etc..  A general breakdown of the oil makeup can be determined.  

 

And in that regard, I only consider a motor oil with a well balanced ZDDP combined with a boatload of calcium (detergency) and a healthy dose of soluble Molybdenum.  My base oil consideration does not take precedence over those considerations.  And the Pennzoil 10w30 puts many other high ticket oils to shame in terms of the add pack.  It has the most moly I have seen outside of Schaeffer oil, another brand I use frequently.  And they really ice the cake with a healthy dose of boron.  It is one of the best motor oil concoctions I have ever seen.  A real sleeper considering I can buy 5 qt jugs of the stuff at my local farm and home store for about $16.  

 

That is why my wife's 2006 Cadillac CTS 3.6, which GM said requires Mobil 1 5w30, gets a Pennzoil conventional 10w30 and has for almost the entire time we have owned it.  None of the timing chain problems many others have experienced with the motor.  Will be keeping this car for a lot longer.  It is one of the best cars I have ever owned.  Oil is changed around 6000-7000 miles.

 

http://www.pqiadata.org/Pennzoil10W30.html

 

I use a Schaeffer blend in my 2015 2500 6.0.   75% grp III / 25% grp IV PAO.  At some point may move the pickup over to the Pennzoil 10w30.  Schaeffer is my commercial oil supplier and the 2500 is part of the business so it gets the same brand of oil (not same viscosity) as my commercial stuff.  It gets a one time a year oil change, in June/July.  

 

http://www.pqiamerica.com/March2013PCMO/schaeffersyn.htm

 

 

Edited August 16, 2018 by Cowpie

[MarcuM]

Update:

the reason I couldn’t  or wouldn’t change my stuff at a more reasonable interval was mostly because I was putting 5000-9000 miles per month at times and having to change oil every other weekend if I followed the 20% change display lol

 

i have recently changed jobs to a 3hr away drive that’s only 150 odd miles  so I will  start doing my oil changes sooner mileage wise and going more weeks Between changes hopefully 

 

im still idling for 10hrs a day with a/c on and even with all that the olm still goes to 7300 miles 

 

also I used 1 quart extra this past cycle which is not new but it is inconsistent 

some cycles it doesn’t use and some it does never more then 1qt in a 10k cycle 

 

vacum pump is making a nice tick tick tick on driver side that is annoying when going down a fast food drive through lol

 

my biggest worrie is still the trans 

even with sucking out the 4-5qts tranny fluid every engine oil change  and replacing 

it still has odd tendency to awkwardly down shift a few times when kicking in passing gear at certain speeds like it’s in between gears or something 

[Sierra Dan]

1 hour ago, MarcuM said:

Update:

the reason I couldn’t  or wouldn’t change my stuff at a more reasonable interval was mostly because I was putting 5000-9000 miles per month at times and having to change oil every other weekend if I followed the 20% change display lol

 

i have recently changed jobs to a 3hr away drive that’s only 150 odd miles  so I will  start doing my oil changes sooner mileage wise and going more weeks Between changes hopefully 

 

im still idling for 10hrs a day with a/c on and even with all that the olm still goes to 7300 miles 

 

also I used 1 quart extra this past cycle which is not new but it is inconsistent 

some cycles it doesn’t use and some it does never more then 1qt in a 10k cycle 

 

vacum pump is making a nice tick tick tick on driver side that is annoying when going down a fast food drive through lol

 

my biggest worrie is still the trans 

even with sucking out the 4-5qts tranny fluid every engine oil change  and replacing 

it still has odd tendency to awkwardly down shift a few times when kicking in passing gear at certain speeds like it’s in between gears or something 

If your Vacuum Pump is "tick, tick, ticking" then get it changed for a new one.

Once this pump fails, it will grenade.... sending metal shards into the engine.

They are about $130 and it takes about 2hrs to change. Unless you have a Warranty still. If so get it to the dealer.

Some Pumps leak oil out the back which could be contributing to your oil loss.

 

 

[MarcuM]

Here’s a clip of the pump tick 

it’s been doing it for a couple months now 

 

I’m gonna order new pump today do I need a new belt too ?

 

4C10A036-602D-4C6E-8C3B-ABF6D3E7982A.MOV

[Sierra Dan]

On ‎9‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 9:19 AM, MarcuM said:

Here’s a clip of the pump tick 

it’s been doing it for a couple months now 

 

I’m gonna order new pump today do I need a new belt too ?

 

4C10A036-602D-4C6E-8C3B-ABF6D3E7982A.MOV

Just depends on the condition and age of the belt.

Maybe go ahead and replace it also while it is off. Totally up to you.

Please post an after video of the new pump sound/non ticking 

[Doublebase]

Anyone else have problems just getting an accurate reading when checking the oil? I always think I'm on a level surface but apperently not...I move the truck and it's a whole different reading. Very sensitive. It's to the point where I only check my oil at the exact location I changed it, which is a problem because it's three states away (I moved). So now occasionally I just pull into my old driveway on Saturday mornings while the people are enjoying coffee on the porch. They're cool with it though.

[pronstar]

Anyone else have problems just getting an accurate reading when checking the oil? I always think I'm on a level surface but apperently not...I move the truck and it's a whole different reading. Very sensitive. It's to the point where I only check my oil at the exact location I changed it, which is a problem because it's three states away (I moved). So now occasionally I just pull into my old driveway on Saturday mornings while the people are enjoying coffee on the porch. They're cool with it though.

Use a bubble level to find a good spot...?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[BigBlueLB756]

That's funny.

 

" Very sensitive. It's to the point where I only check my oil at the exact location I changed it, which is a problem because it's three states away (I moved). So now occasionally I just pull into my old driveway on Saturday mornings while the people are enjoying coffee on the porch. They're cool with it though. "

[Doublebase]

8 hours ago, pronstar said:

 

 

Use a bubble level to find a good spot...?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

 

You know what's funny? I almost considered this, but then I just called NASA. No but seriously...my readings are off. 

 

I managed to get check it in three different spots in the last two days (two of the three readings say the oil is fine), the other reading says it's overfilled. I figure it's fine. I'm 3,500 miles in on my oil change. I've added a half a quart of oil and that should keep it level until I change it.

[Grumpy Bear]

On ‎8‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 6:28 AM, Cowpie said:

 

That Redliine CCS is not a number derived from the industry standard ATSM D5293 cold crank simulator testing protocol. It really means little in terms of comparison.   A 172 VI is nice but many other oils have VI's in that range.   Pour point is good, but it is the CCS that really is more important.  And without showing the ASTM D5293 testing number of that CCS, "mind numbing"  is purely subjective.

 

Where are you getting that information?