How can I wire this up?

[64BAwagon]

@gemarsh we said the same thing but you included visual aids 

[64BAwagon]

The left tail lamp assy. 

IMG_20231130_0001.pdf

Circuit 24 Green/white tracer wire to the R symbol.  In English it a green/white wire for the backup light power. 

Edited November 30, 2023 by 64BAwagon

[sage55]

On 11/29/2023 at 3:21 AM, gemarsh said:

 

 

@gemarsh and @64BAwagon I really appreciate you both and the graphic certainly helps as I'm more of a visual learner than a reading one so thank you for this.

 

I do wonder are Post 86 and 85 interchangeable on the reply by chance?

 

Here is a picture of the relay that came with the lights with it's wiring harness removed which looks similar to what your graphic shows, expect there is also a 87A but I'll ignore that.

 

 

 

As you see Post 85 is on the right side of the picture and in your graphic says it should be ground.

 

However, if I attach the included wiring harness that came with the lights it's all flipped around.

 

 

Red wire labels 1 and 2 are the power rings and ground with the ring terminals.

 

3 & 4 are the positive leads that go directly to the lights and use Post 30.

 

5 & 6 are the grounds for the lights and go to Post 86 (which is shown as power in your grahpic?)

 

7, 8, & 9 are the on / off switch that was included in the lights.

 

So it looks like they are using Post 86 for ground and Post 85 as power?

 

 

[64BAwagon]

85 and 86 are interchangeable. This is a std 4 pin relay. 

forget about 87A, it will just confuse things and its meaningless since this relay doesnt have it.

That plug is configured for you to use a switch to power those lights and in my opinion is just causing more confusion. 

Assuming you connect 86 to a ground, 85 to the backup light wire on the truck, 30 to a fused battery source, 87 goes to the positive wire on the lights and your lights should be grounded using a ring terminal at the nearest location to where they are mounted. 

 

If you try to use this plug it will be more work than necessary and you will end up with a monkey fist of unused wires and a sketchy looking wiring job. 

 

BTW, this does not require the use of that Curt adapter, I think it adds complexity to the job but doesnt accomplish anything of value. 

 

The hardest part of the job is running a power wire from under the hood to the left tail light area, I would use a 12 ga wire with 1/4" split loom and run it along the left frame rail. You can use existing wiring and sister along that with zip ties being sure to keep it as neat as possible and avoid any pinch points. You could run it down the right side but I use the left typically. 

 

The sketch is crude but its what I had, it echoes what Marsh posted

 

 

Digest this a little and let me know if it helps. If you want to send me a PM I will give you my phone number and I can walk you through it. 

 

Scott

 

. 

IMG_20231130_0002.pdf

Edited November 30, 2023 by 64BAwagon

[sage55]

5 minutes ago, 64BAwagon said:

BTW, this does not require the use of that Curt adapter, I think it adds complexity to the job but doesnt accomplish anything of value. 

Well you and @gemarsh are both correct - the Curt adapter isn't going to work out like I had hoped.

 

I bought it because I really didn't want to cut into any factory wires and I figured I'd have all my connections I needed right there in the adapter or the 5way T - but neither were the case.

 

After posting the info above about the relay, I went back out and grabbed a test light and nope... I don't have power back there as expected. Even putting with the truck running and in reverse I'm not getting anything from the center pin (reverse light). Because no trailer is connected - just like @gemarsh mentioned.

 

And then it hit me, that makes sense, as I just bought a power adapter for my travel trailer camper for this very reason. The factory 7 way doesn't provide the correct power, and after I bought one of these I had lights and cameras working on my trailer again.

 

So I'm returning the Curt T adapter (good thing I haven't cut into it yet).

 

@64BAwagon that drawing very much helps. I'm a very slow monkey and pictures help out a bunch. haha Seriously, this really does help!

 

So I'm thinking I'll mount the relay under the hood, run the power source to the battery and ground somewhere in the engine compartment.

 

From there I'm wondering, would you think I'd be fine running ground and power from the relay all the way back to the lights? This way I could re-use the wire it came with and use their factory plugs on the light themselves.

 

I also have 16 AWG flexible stranded wire I would run from Post 85 to maybe somewhere in the engine compartment (if possible?) or run it all the way back and sadly tap into the factory reverse light on one of the tail lights.

 

I was planning on soldering and heat shrinking any cuts or connections a 3 to 1 adhesive heat shrink, but I also have plenty of solder heat shrink combo butt connectors I could use. To make connections to the relay, I plan on using marine heat shrink spade and ring connectors.

 

[ManyCamaroz]

87 relay is a wonderful part and has many uses.

[64BAwagon]

13 hours ago, sage55 said:

Well you and @gemarsh are both correct - the Curt adapter isn't going to work out like I had hoped.

 

I bought it because I really didn't want to cut into any factory wires and I figured I'd have all my connections I needed right there in the adapter or the 5way T - but neither were the case.

 

After posting the info above about the relay, I went back out and grabbed a test light and nope... I don't have power back there as expected. Even putting with the truck running and in reverse I'm not getting anything from the center pin (reverse light). Because no trailer is connected - just like @gemarsh mentioned.

 

And then it hit me, that makes sense, as I just bought a power adapter for my travel trailer camper for this very reason. The factory 7 way doesn't provide the correct power, and after I bought one of these I had lights and cameras working on my trailer again.

 

So I'm returning the Curt T adapter (good thing I haven't cut into it yet).

 

@64BAwagon that drawing very much helps. I'm a very slow monkey and pictures help out a bunch. haha Seriously, this really does help!

 

So I'm thinking I'll mount the relay under the hood, run the power source to the battery and ground somewhere in the engine compartment.

 

From there I'm wondering, would you think I'd be fine running ground and power from the relay all the way back to the lights? This way I could re-use the wire it came with and use their factory plugs on the light themselves.

 

I also have 16 AWG flexible stranded wire I would run from Post 85 to maybe somewhere in the engine compartment (if possible?) or run it all the way back and sadly tap into the factory reverse light on one of the tail lights.

 

I was planning on soldering and heat shrinking any cuts or connections a 3 to 1 adhesive heat shrink, but I also have plenty of solder heat shrink combo butt connectors I could use. To make connections to the relay, I plan on using marine heat shrink spade and ring connectors.

 

I still think the relay mounted behind the tail light is the easiest way to keep the wires to a minimum. That way you only have to run one wire to the back, ground your relay there, make your connection to the backup light wire and then have only one wire to route to each light. This will only involve cutting one OEM wire. Your plan with the heatshrinks is solid. 

 

Before GM started putting 110v outlets in the bed of trucks I would run a 12v+ line to the left tail light area using a 12ga wire and then connect my dome light for my cap and a 12v cigarette style plug that I recessed into the bed near the tail light. That way I had constant power back there for whatever. 

Edited December 1, 2023 by 64BAwagon

[sage55]

1 hour ago, 64BAwagon said:

I still think the relay mounted behind the tail light is the easiest way to keep the wires to a minimum. That way you only have to run one wire to the back, ground your relay there, make your connection to the backup light wire and then have only one wire to route to each light. This will only involve cutting one OEM wire. Your plan with the heatshrinks is solid. 

 

Before GM started putting 110v outlets in the bed of trucks I would run a 12v+ line to the left tail light area using a 12ga wire and then connect my dome light for my cap and a 12v cigarette style plug that I recessed into the bed near the tail light. That way I had constant power back there for whatever. 

Okay I'm following you.

 

So relay and wire all in the back and just run a single 12+ from the battery in the front.

 

Will 16 AWG suffice or should I get bigger wire? What came with the original light harness, the ring terminal cables look to be maybe 12 or 10 AWG.

[64BAwagon]

If youre going to run a wire to the back the 12ga will give you extra capacity. That way if you ever want to power another item in the bed ( I have added water resistant cigarette plugs in the bed on past trucks ) you will have the extra power there to do it. If you dont think you would ever add anything then the 16ga will be fine. Your ground wire should be at minimum the same gauge as the power wire, you cant go wrong using 12ga but anything 16 and bigger would be fine. I use tooth washers on my grounds and dielectric grease or fluid film for a no worries ground.  

You can run it down the right side frame rail if you want, I have just always used the left since thats where the harness is typically run to the back. You have options. I will pull the left tail light on my 2024 and take a pic later today just for reference. 

[64BAwagon]

Here is a pic of the area behind the left tai light on my 2024. This is the wiring for the 3 led marker bar with the clear LED's wired for backup. 

The red wire from the middle lamp is the wire to the backup lamps from the green wire on the OEM. 

The other non OEM wire is the one tapped in to the tail lights and goes to the 3 Red LED's on the add on light. 

Notice the ground wire attached with the hex head zip screw in the middle.

The black oily stuff is fluid film. 

everything I added was in split loom and the 3 wires going to the lamp are in a separate loom that's sistered to the stock harness. 

 

Also note that there is a  red rag between the lamp housing and the side of the truck. The loose housing can seriously scratch the paint. I learned that many many years ago. 

[sage55]

@64BAwagon you are far too kind buddy. Thanks so much for all your help.

 

I thought I had a spool of 10 or 12 AWG wire, but it doesn't seem the case. So I just placed an order for 100' 12 AWG silicone stranded tinned wire. As well as 100' Dorman 3/8 split loom - all of which should be here on Monday.

[sage55]

2 hours ago, 64BAwagon said:

The red wire from the middle lamp is the wire to the backup lamps from the green wire on the OEM. 

 

Did you also use the solder heat shrink butt connectors for your connection?

[64BAwagon]

2 hours ago, sage55 said:

 

Did you also use the solder heat shrink butt connectors for your connection?

If youre talking about the ones that have the cold solder ring in the middle of the connector then the answer is no. I like the concept but found that the solder was a little inconsistent for me. I prefer to use my solder iron and a supply of heat shrink tubing or I use a regular style butt splice that is heat shrinkable.  I also wrap over that with some electric tape I have that reacts to heat. Where I am road salt is a religion so you have to be very careful with any connections. 

Edited December 1, 2023 by 64BAwagon

[Pryme]

24 minutes ago, 64BAwagon said:

If youre talking about the ones that have the cold solder ring in the middle of the connector then the answer is no. I like the concept but found that the solder was a little inconsistent for me. I prefer to use my solder iron and a supply of heat shrink tubing or I use a regular style butt splice that is heat shrinkable.  I also wrap over that with some electric tape I have that reacts to heat. Where I am road salt is a religion so you have to be very careful with any connections. 

What do you like for electrical tape? For me super 33 and 88 is by far the best I’ve used. 

[sage55]

A massive thanks to both @64BAwagon and @gemarsh for guiding my slow self through this process. It toiok me entirely way to long to "get it" than it should have, but the lights are installed and work great.

 

They are bright, but don't seem to be overly bright where it's effecting the camera at all. I made a few position adjustments this morning, so we'll see how it looks again tonight.

 

 

I like the slim design as they nearly disappear until they turn on. They are going to make seeing using my mirrors much easier!

 

My tail light was a bit different from yours @64BAwagon as I believe the 2023 AT4's are all LED's so I only had a single plug for the tail light. The plug did have a reverse light of course but I didn't see much room to splice how I wanted or to mount the relay.

 

Instead, I went to the passenger side of the truck and where the tail light harness plugs into the truck is where I put everything. Spliced into the backup wire (light green-ish color) on the wire harness to add my backup signal wire to the relay. I soldered the wires together, used 3-to-1 adhesive heat shrink, then wrapped it with electrical tape and wire loom.

 

I did a minor detour from your drawing, where as I put my grounds all off the relay (similar to how the factory rough country harness did). So for the lights I used their wiring plugs and wire, I just cut the wire MUCH shorter. I then connected the grounds and a 12 awg ground together on the relay and the other end of the 12 awg wire to where the spare tire cable clips to the truck.

 

Power was ran from the driver side battery to the back of the truck. Also in wire loom and with a 10 amp inline fuse.

 

The connectors to the relay are all marine grade and heat shrunk, with electrical tape wrapped around the wire and wire loom. Inside the connectors to the relay were filled with dielectric grease.

 

 

 

Besides trying to understand all this, the longest parts of doing all of it was running the power back from the battery to the back of the truck and cutting the factory harness wire. I wanted to avoid this so much and keep putting my clipped up to cut it and then stopping. haha

 

I'm happy with the results and feel I shouldn't have any issues with it at all. Thanks again guys!

 

 

@Pryme I know this probably wasn't for me, but I use 3M 88 tape myself.