Is paint quality better?

[Dpach]

We all know the previous generation (14-18) had major paint issues with chipping and that the thickness of the GM truck paint was about half of what the industry standard is. Many complained about paint chips all over their trucks, many with next to no miles.

 

I am currently pondering moving up from my 2013 Silverado Crew Z71 with only 31,000 kms (19,500 miles) to a new generation. I skipped the previous gen for a couple reasons: hit and miss vibration issues, paint quality/chipping issues, and wanting to get some usage on my 2013 for the money.

 

Out here on the prairies of Canada we haven't had this generation out long enough to have much feedback from owners (we starting getting these about 4 mths after the US did). So my question is, has anyone had the paint chipping on the new truck like the previous generation?

Edited June 18, 2019 by Dpach

[RyanbabZ71]

In 1000 miles I haven’t noticed anything different paint wise over my 2010. I did have a clear bra installed on the front and part of the hood though.


Ryan B.

[amxguy1970]

1 hour ago, Dpach said:

We all know the previous generation (14-18) had major paint issues with chipping and that the thickness of the GM truck paint was about half of what the industry standard is. Many complained about paint chips all over their trucks, many with next to no miles.

 

I am currently pondering moving up from my 2013 Silverado Crew Z71 with only 31,000 kms (19,500 miles) to a new generation. I skipped the previous gen for a couple reasons: hit and miss vibration issues, paint quality/chipping issues, and wanting to get some usage on my 2013 for the money.

 

Out here on the prairies of Canada we haven't had this generation out long enough to have much feedback from owners (we starting getting these about 4 mths after the US did). So my question is, has anyone had the paint chipping on the new truck like the previous generation?

You have data on what the paint thickness is for industry average or are you just making an assumption because you have read about some people on the forums having chipping issues? Nothing I have heard or seen indicates it is "below" industry average, I don't think "we all know" this issue you talk about. Check any other auto manufacturer forums and you will see the same things about easy chipping paint, especially on painted metal areas like the hood. It is all because of the type of paint they use these days for environmental purposes mainly. Been like that for the last few decades. It is easiest to happen to those with painted bumpers or on the front hoods. A rock hitting a hard surface will chip much easier than a soft painted surface such as painted plastic. Which is why chrome is the way to go, much more durable. I put a clear bra on the front of my hood, the painted plastic piece above my bumper has no chipping issue. I am going to go out on a limb and say there are no significant paint changes from the previous generation and like anything you have to take care of something in order for it to last. Just like waxing to protect the clear coat or change oil to protect the engine. You can't expect anything to me maintenance free, this is especially the case with painted bumpers. Put a protective clear bra on it, but don't expect any manufacturers painted front bumper to last...

 

BTW, 19k miles in 6 years, I would say you didn't get your usage out of that truck. 

 

Tyler

 

Edited June 18, 2019 by amxguy1970

[Dpach]

Amxguy, our GM body shop has been measuring paint thickness for years, and they tell me the industry average for paint and clear coat thickness is between 5-5.5 mils on todays cars with the water base paint. They have measured the 2014-2018 trucks as low as 3.5 mils and seem to average around 4 mils.  For some reason, the cars and SUVs seem to be more in the 5 mils range, closer to the industry average. I’ve worked 21 yrs at a GM dealership (various sales department positions) and we have repainted more 2014-2018 trucks, or parts of trucks approved by GM warranty than any previous generation (warranty claims) due to the chipping.  GM reps tell us it is because the water base paint they use is harder to resist scratching. Unfortunately hard paint is also brittle and chips very easily when thin. GM knows they have a problem as they quickly agreed to repaint trucks in 2014 and 2015, until they realized how wide claimed this was. After that they changed their parameters to qualify for a repaint. If you happen to even drive by a grid road while on the highway, they void paint chip warranty now. 

 

We are seeing many chips down the sides of vehicles that have never seen grid roads. I have many fleet companies who have complained about their GMs and Rams, but say their Fords are better. 

 

I know Ram is also having issues and the few Rams our shop has seen seem to have thinner paint like the GMs. Fords seem to be thicker, closer to the average. Now this is going by what our shop is saying. But they haven’t had to paint a new generation GM yet as we’ve really one had them a few months now. 

[FDHog]

7 hours ago, Dpach said:

Amxguy, our GM body shop has been measuring paint thickness for years, and they tell me the industry average for paint and clear coat thickness is between 5-5.5 mils on todays cars with the water base paint. They have measured the 2014-2018 trucks as low as 3.5 mils and seem to average around 4 mils.  For some reason, the cars and SUVs seem to be more in the 5 mils range, closer to the industry average. I’ve worked 21 yrs at a GM dealership (various sales department positions) and we have repainted more 2014-2018 trucks, or parts of trucks approved by GM warranty than any previous generation (warranty claims) due to the chipping.  GM reps tell us it is because the water base paint they use is harder to resist scratching. Unfortunately hard paint is also brittle and chips very easily when thin. GM knows they have a problem as they quickly agreed to repaint trucks in 2014 and 2015, until they realized how wide claimed this was. After that they changed their parameters to qualify for a repaint. If you happen to even drive by a grid road while on the highway, they void paint chip warranty now. 

 

We are seeing many chips down the sides of vehicles that have never seen grid roads. I have many fleet companies who have complained about their GMs and Rams, but say their Fords are better. 

 

I know Ram is also having issues and the few Rams our shop has seen seem to have thinner paint like the GMs. Fords seem to be thicker, closer to the average. Now this is going by what our shop is saying. But they haven’t had to paint a new generation GM yet as we’ve really one had them a few months now. 

Sorry, but I've owned Fords for the past 18 years and the paint quality on their trucks just plain sucks. Foreign objects in the paint, tiny pock marks, and don't get me started on the quality of their aluminum panels. Dimples all over.

One thing I noticed was how good the paint and panels were on my AT4.

[KARNUT]

My 17 Camry after just two road trips looked like it had the measles down low in the front. Dealer was like sh$t happens. I’m usually pretty tolerant, it was very noticeable. I finally made a cardboard template. Bought matching rattle can paint made it look new. Three additional trips later still looks good. The sides seemed to be holding up. It’s amazing how bad paint has gotten.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dpach]

2 hours ago, FDHog said:

Sorry, but I've owned Fords for the past 18 years and the paint quality on their trucks just plain sucks. Foreign objects in the paint, tiny pock marks, and don't get me started on the quality of their aluminum panels. Dimples all over.

One thing I noticed was how good the paint and panels were on my AT4.

Appreciate the feedback. How were the Fords for chipping as that is what I am concerned about?  Pock mark's, fish eyes, dust particles have more to do with the paint process and material prep.

 

Glad to hear about the AT4 though. Enjoy.

[aseibel]

10 hours ago, Dpach said:

Amxguy, our GM body shop has been measuring paint thickness for years, and they tell me the industry average for paint and clear coat thickness is between 5-5.5 mils on todays cars with the water base paint. They have measured the 2014-2018 trucks as low as 3.5 mils and seem to average around 4 mils.  For some reason, the cars and SUVs seem to be more in the 5 mils range, closer to the industry average.

Wow, this is very interesting. I just remembered that I have a coating thickness gauge in my tool bag, I rarely use it. but I went out and took 10 readings on my '15 truck hood, both the leading edge and top. The average was 3.81 mils. It seemed like the thinner areas are along that front edge, where most chipping occurs. on top of the flat hood is more like 4.0 and above.

Then for comparison, I looked at my '04 grand am hood, that was around 5.0 mils average.

[gt tangerine]

43 minutes ago, Dpach said:

Appreciate the feedback. How were the Fords for chipping as that is what I am concerned about?  Pock mark's, fish eyes, dust particles have more to do with the paint process and material prep.

 

Glad to hear about the AT4 though. Enjoy.

My 16 Silverado had waves in the top part of the bedside panels below the rail covers. So does my dads 17. thought my 19 would be better. It’s not, it may be worse. And my 16 mustang track pack, don’t even get me started on the panel imperfections. Chips I can deal with. Spots that look like dents are what gets me. 

[Dpach]

16 minutes ago, aseibel said:

Wow, this is very interesting. I just remembered that I have a coating thickness gauge in my tool bag, I rarely use it. but I went out and took 10 readings on my '15 truck hood, both the leading edge and top. The average was 3.81 mils. It seemed like the thinner areas are along that front edge, where most chipping occurs. on top of the flat hood is more like 4.0 and above.

Then for comparison, I looked at my '04 grand am hood, that was around 5.0 mils average.

I would be curious to know what the sides of the truck measure as we see a ton of stone chips down the sides.

[Grumpy Bear]

Day I received my lightly used15 I had the leading edges of the hood and front fenders clear bra. Then I put on WT no-drill flaps. It already had Go-Rhino tubular step rails. Bought the pieces of plastic GM had for any trim level and applied. The box corner protectors and some black RTV to install them. I avoid gravel like the plague and never follow closer than 200 feet at highway speeds. I repaired the one chip it had in it when delivered. Wish I would have cleared the painted bumper. The truck is now closing in on 100K miles and I have repaired less than six chips over nearly three years. I have two small ones now that need attention. The front bumper looks like bird shot and will receive attention yet this summer. Even up close the body looks new. 

 

Chip repair has been very easy and I expect mainly because the paint is so hard. Protection is key. I had the paint measured when I had PDR done on the box sides for the factory 'wave' and it metered in +/- a hair either side of 3 mills. Yea, some areas like near the rear bumper were under 3! So thin that in that area it looks sort of orange instead of Victory Red. But boy does it shine. 

 

And why are you trading a truck with under 20K on the clock? Got money to throw away? 

Edited June 19, 2019 by Grumpy Bear

[FDHog]

1 hour ago, Dpach said:

Appreciate the feedback. How were the Fords for chipping as that is what I am concerned about?  Pock mark's, fish eyes, dust particles have more to do with the paint process and material prep.

 

Glad to hear about the AT4 though. Enjoy.

Lets put it this way. My front bumpers looked like they had chicken pox after a few thousand miles.

[Dpach]

4 hours ago, Grumpy Bear said:

Day I received my lightly used15 I had the leading edges of the hood and front fenders clear bra. Then I put on WT no-drill flaps. It already had Go-Rhino tubular step rails. Bought the pieces of plastic GM had for any trim level and applied. The box corner protectors and some black RTV to install them. I avoid gravel like the plague and never follow closer than 200 feet at highway speeds. I repaired the one chip it had in it when delivered. Wish I would have cleared the painted bumper. The truck is now closing in on 100K miles and I have repaired less than six chips over nearly three years. I have two small ones now that need attention. The front bumper looks like bird shot and will receive attention yet this summer. Even up close the body looks new. 

 

Chip repair has been very easy and I expect mainly because the paint is so hard. Protection is key. I had the paint measured when I had PDR done on the box sides for the factory 'wave' and it metered in +/- a hair either side of 3 mills. Yea, some areas like near the rear bumper were under 3! So thin that in that area it looks sort of orange instead of Victory Red. But boy does it shine. 

 

And why are you trading a truck with under 20K on the clock? Got money to throw away? 

Here in Saskatchewan, with the US dollar versus Canadian dollar so strong, we are getting really good money from US brokers for used trucks and it is almost making sense to get the most out of my 2013 as I can to put towards a new one. Plus I am a firm believer in having a vehicle under warranty since we can't really work on these ourselves anymore with all the computer/sensor technology.  I still have one more year of warranty on my 2013, so I'm starting my research now, hoping to change up trucks in the next year or less, depending on the deal.  I can still get $23,000 CAN for my 6 yr old Crew LT Z71.

 

I agree that protection is the key and I would definitely put the 3M film all over the front and on the fender lips above the wheels. But we are seeing a lot down the side just from passing cars, and heaven help if anyone has to drive on a grid road. My 2013 has no more than 3 or 4 chips as I also avoid grid roads. If I have to take one, its at 10-15 mph max.

[AMPRG]

On 6/18/2019 at 1:09 PM, Dpach said:

We all know the previous generation (14-18) had major paint issues with chipping and that the thickness of the GM truck paint was about half of what the industry standard is. Many complained about paint chips all over their trucks, many with next to no miles.

 

I am currently pondering moving up from my 2013 Silverado Crew Z71 with only 31,000 kms (19,500 miles) to a new generation. I skipped the previous gen for a couple reasons: hit and miss vibration issues, paint quality/chipping issues, and wanting to get some usage on my 2013 for the money.

 

Out here on the prairies of Canada we haven't had this generation out long enough to have much feedback from owners (we starting getting these about 4 mths after the US did). So my question is, has anyone had the paint chipping on the new truck like the previous generation?

My 2014 was horrible in paint. It was the famous deep ruby color. Its clear coat chipped out all over the car. GM didn't accept the issue. I had to sell it cheaper last year because of the issue. 

I bought my 2019 in white not to take any risk ?. I haven't found anything issue yet after 8000 miles in 5 months. 

[HondaHawkGT]

 

On 6/18/2019 at 11:14 PM, Dpach said:

Amxguy, our GM body shop has been measuring paint thickness for years, and they tell me the industry average for paint and clear coat thickness is between 5-5.5 mils on todays cars with the water base paint. They have measured the 2014-2018 trucks as low as 3.5 mils and seem to average around 4 mils.  For some reason, the cars and SUVs seem to be more in the 5 mils range, closer to the industry average. 

 

We are seeing many chips down the sides of vehicles that have never seen grid roads. I have many fleet companies who have complained about their GMs and Rams, but say their Fords are better. 

 

I know Ram is also having issues and the few Rams our shop has seen seem to have thinner paint like the GMs. Fords seem to be thicker, closer to the average. Now this is going by what our shop is saying. But they haven’t had to paint a new generation GM yet as we’ve really one had them a few months now. 

 

Ford's are running pretty thin these days by the looks of it:

https://www.f150forum.com/f118/paint-thickness-chipping-417349/

 

"This one is for the paint experts. I had my truck inspected yesterday for a BOW suit, and he discovered that the paint is .5 mil in most areas, and just touching 1 mil in others. Could this be why rock salt chipped the paint so badly? Shouldn't it be between 1.5 and 2.0 mil thick?"

 

"I had to get it inspected by an ASE certified licensed inspector for the BOW case against Ford. He showed me the areas where the paint was very thin, and then compared it to another car he had nearby which was about what you said, 4 mil or so. The leading edge of the fenders near the lights showed a 0.5, the rest of the panels were 1 - 1.5. He showed me a car he painted, he is restoring I think a Pontiac GTO maybe, and he had 10+ mil on it. His main goal is to confirm or deny my complaints, and he 100% confirmed them, nearly crapped his pants when he let go of the wheel and nearly ran off the road. The paint isn't one of them though, but he did say, that the clear should not have separated from the base like it did, even from a chip."

 

They seem to have plenty of complaints for chipping.

 

https://www.f150forum.com/f2/2016-f-150-paint-peeling-435494/

https://www.f150forum.com/f118/aluminum-body-paint-durability-372367/

https://www.f150forum.com/f118/aluminum-body-paint-durability-372367/index12/#post6130623

https://www.f150forum.com/f118/worst-paint-ever-382727/

https://www.f150forum.com/f118/paint-flaking-newer-f150s-aluminum-bodies-436212/index2/#post6180923

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1467968-cheap-paint.html

 

My 2014 Silverado was ok for paint chips, but only okay. The chipping I had was very small and mainly due to the aggressive tires. The worst areas were the places where they applied that thick coating along the bottom 6-8" of the body panels. The coating seemed to allow the paint to chip off a little easier. Thankfully it didn't have any rust due to the chips, which was good for a rust belt truck that didn't get many washes in the winter time. The coating under the paint seemed to do its job.