Towing a Toy Hauler with 5.3L

2004lebanshee · February 2, 2016

No, it is not the standard number. The industry standard number is 10% for bumper-pull. Why not say they can't tow 5000 lbs because your new made-up standard is 40% tongue weight? You can win every argument if you can make up the standards. It's possible you have a trailer so configured, but that does not make it an argument that applies to everybody else.

The industry standard is 10%. Some trailers will be more, some will be less and it is often adjustable by how you load the trailer. When making a blanket argument about what trucks can tow what loads, using an exceptionally heavy tongue weight well above standard is not a convincing choice.

150 lbs for the driver is already included. The "scale weight" of the vehicle is typically 150 lbs below its "curb weight" that is subtracted from the GVWR to get the number on the yellow sticker.

I really care but no the standard is not 10% on large travel trailers. All larger trailers (like were talking about here) should be set up at 12-15% 13% being ideal but often they are up to or over 15%. Better safe then sorry. I know lots of Rockwood's are 14%. . You are better having 15% then 10% when trailering a large travel trailer. Boats are lower 10% is common. Do not set the weight back just to haul a bigger load. It will handle like crap.

Change the numbers how you want but fact has always been a 1/2 ton runs out of payload before towing capacity. Legally anyhow. What ever is decide just have the trailer weighed when set up. DO NOT BELIEVE THE MANUFACTURE. Trailer manufacture's are the biggest lire's out there. All weights are before slides, fluids, ect.

If a trailer says the trailer is 8,000 lbs you better believe you will be over 9,000 when you take it somewhere.

foo.c · February 2, 2016

9000 lb trailer

900 lb tongue weight

Jon A · February 2, 2016

I really care but no the standard is not 10% on large travel trailers. All larger trailers (like were talking about here) should be set up at 12-15% 13% being ideal but often they are up to or over 15%.....

A standard is not what you feel is ideal for a particular type of trailer. Here is an example of a Standard, from SAE J2807:

4.4.2.4 Trailer Tongue Weight (Conventional Trailers)

Ballast should be applied to the trailer in a distributed manner such that the trailer tongue weight is 10% of total trailer

weight ±0.5%, or ±5 kg (11 lb), whichever is greater, at a nominally level attitude as described in 4.4.2.8. This is intended

to provide a nominal longitudinal center of gravity (cg) position of the ballasted trailer that is 10% (of the effective tongue

length) forward of the trailer axle(s) centerline.

To what published standard are you referring?

Yes, some trailers are more and some are less. But 10% has been the general rule of thumb for all bumper pull trailers since the beginning of time. It is so written in stone, that's what the SAE adopted for their testing/rating standard. You're free to say some trailers are more, or that you prefer more but you aren't free to say a generic 10,000 lb trailer must have 1500 lb tongue weight in order to be safely pulled.

Bgctrading · February 2, 2016

So after a crash some one recreates the vehicle and all of the items being towed and then weighs everything? I have never heard of this.

Bgctrading · February 2, 2016

Not in a non professional hauling company anyways

Jon A · February 2, 2016

So after a crash some one recreates the vehicle and all of the items being towed and then weighs everything? I have never heard of this.

Yes. It happens all the time ......... On the internet .....

HondaHawkGT · February 2, 2016

9000 lb trailer

900 lb tongue weight

While the tongue weight was 900 lb, they compensated for the 2WD weight difference by placing sandbags at the back of the bed. This had the effect of making the front end light as mr truck had pointed out.

gmckenzie · February 2, 2016

If a trailer says the trailer is 8,000 lbs you better believe you will be over 9,000 when you take it somewhere.

Estimate the weights at dry + carrying capacity and you have a good number to use. In my case that's 8,200 and I have scaled mine at just shy of 8,000.

cmysstailights · February 2, 2016

is this right a measly 1407 lbs for payload

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I have a 14 high country qith a 5.3 and 3:42 rear. Max i can tow with passangers is 7k trailer unloaded im guessing. Tow maybe twice a year.

redwngr · February 2, 2016

So looking at the GM link a 6.2 with max trailer 4x4 crew with short box shows as 2,010 max tong weight. That's better then I thought I was thinking they were around 1700 but still not good enough for the max weight.

Says its rated at 11,700 for a max trailer. Seems great.

EXE #1

11,000 Lb. travel trailer with 15% tong weight. This is the standard number could be more and could be less. Boats are usually less and trailers can be more.

= 1,650 on the hitch.

2,010 max payload -1650 tong weight.

= 360 lb. to spare for passengers (200lb driver and one 160lb passenger no road pop with this set up). If your fat, have 3 people, or want to put anything in the truck your over and need a smaller trailer.

EXE #2

It can handle this right?

10,000 lb trailer = 1,500 lb. tong

2010-1500= 510 lbs. left ( now you can take two 200 lb. adults and a big dog). Still not filling the truck with 4 passengers or gear (fire wood, beer, ect). Maybe you camp light.

This is why a 1/2 ton max what ever is still not practical or smart for a trailer over 9,000 lbs. Do what you want but if your over and get in a wreck and hurt someone I guarantee your insurance stiffs you and you lose everything you own. It doesn't matter if your smart. If someone stops short or cuts you off like an a$$ and you hit them you screwed. Can the truck pull heavier sure it could probably pull a semi but its like drunk driving you could lose everything doing it. Good luck. This is JMO.

I typically put the realistic max at about 80% of what its rated for. That's what I could put my family and gear in and use with out worry. If you have dodge it's around 70% due to low payload ratings from excess weight. Ford is higher.

Ball hitch tongue weight GM recommendation is 10 to 15%.

They rate the hitch for 800lb if weight carrying hook up is used.

They rate the hitch for 1200lb if weight distributing hookup is used.

GM recommends for 1500's that a weight distributing hitch be used if the trailer weight is above 7000lb

For more than 1200lb tongue weight a 2500 is required.

The hitch on a 2500/3500 has a larger square opening for the ball mount.

Red_5 · February 2, 2016

All this discussion has me wondering about payload. Where does unsprung weight such as wheels, tires and brakes figure into GVWR or payload? Wheels and tires have to weigh in the 300 pound range, add in brake rotors and caliper weight and you could push maybe 350? Maybe more if you have big E range mud tires. That weight would show up on the scales but isn't being supported by the suspension/chassis.

HondaHawkGT · February 2, 2016

If you put heavier tires on, that could be subtracted IMO. The other unsprung weight is already accounted for in the vehicle's ratings.

redwngr · February 3, 2016

All this discussion has me wondering about payload. Where does unsprung weight such as wheels, tires and brakes figure into GVWR or payload? Wheels and tires have to weigh in the 300 pound range, add in brake rotors and caliper weight and you could push maybe 350? Maybe more if you have big E range mud tires. That weight would show up on the scales but isn't being supported by the suspension/chassis.

I agree with you position, but legally the scale reading and the factory label would be all that matters.

A good argument could be made for the brakes having to stop the new wheels/tires -- and whose to say that scale weight as related to and stopping ability wasn't the limiting factor for GVW and payload rating?

Jon A · February 3, 2016

Yes, in the end the number they use for payload isn't quite that scientific. Witness the change from 7200 to 7600 for the max tows from 2014 to 2015 without actually changing any parts on the truck; simply crossing one number out and writing in the new number because that's the number they decided they wanted to put there. When it's that arbitrary trying to analyze further is a waste of time.

I have a 14 high country qith a 5.3 and 3:42 rear. Max i can tow with passangers is 7k trailer unloaded im guessing. Tow maybe twice a year.

It depends on the trailer and how big your passengers are. Some toy haulers, for example, are quite tongue heavy when unloaded but when loaded the tongue lightens up. How much depends on what you load and how you load it. With car transports you can often move the car around to put the tongue weight right where you want it, with camping trailers you may have all sorts of options while loading it....

There are just to many variables to make a blanket generalization. Your truck should be rated to tow ~9K. That's the maximum with an ideal setup--not a blanket approval for anything under that weight no matter how much you want to carry in the truck. I could load a trailer at only 5K that would exceed your payload. That doesn't mean saying your truck can't tow 5K in general is a true statement.